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Thread: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    I will continue to repeat the following until I am blue in the face:

    The government is NOT going to regulate the private insurance sector because it holds too much lobbying power over government. Unless that day comes, UHC needs to be created to provide competition that offsets the corruption. I think the health bill is costly, but the government is far more willing to make tax payers pay more than they are come down on the corporations. It doesn't matter which government you have, Republican or Democrat, they will always back industry and avoid regulaton!

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by Don't Tase Me Bro View Post
    LOLOL!!!! I love when an ignoramus cites the WHO report.

    You don't even know what's in the damn thing nor how they came up with those rankings and here you are repeating it because you heard some pro-Socialist kook reference it.

    Very simple question for you. Do you honestly think that people from all over the world come to this country to receive the 37th best health care in the world? Don't strain your brain too hard on that one.
    Yeah, check out how the WHO rates a country's health care (what a PC joke):
    WHO’s assessment system was based on five indicators: overall level of population health; health inequalities (or disparities) within the population; overall level of health system responsiveness (a combination of patient satisfaction and how well the system acts); distribution of responsiveness within the population (how well people of varying economic status find that they are served by the health system); and the distribution of the health system’s financial burden within the population (who pays the costs).
    1st indicator - overall level of population health - this makes sense if it is done accurately. Judging from the large numbers of those coming to the US for health care, we should rank very high on this one!!!
    2nd indicator - why should health inequities skew a country's rating when their overall average health is high?
    3rd indicator - All indications are that the US has the most responsive health care for those who chose to work, carry their weight, and pay health premiums.
    4th indicator - "distribution of responsiveness" - when you don't sit around waiting for the government to take care of you it's pretty good.
    5th indicator - I guess that the US loses points as we don't have all the cost burden paid by the "rich"... Obama and friends is working on that one!
    Last edited by rebelbuc; 07-29-09 at 12:55 PM.
    Obama lied... Ambassador Stevens died!

  3. #33
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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by Orius View Post
    I will continue to repeat the following until I am blue in the face:

    The government is NOT going to regulate the private insurance sector because it holds too much lobbying power over government. Unless that day comes, UHC needs to be created to provide competition that offsets the corruption. I think the health bill is costly, but the government is far more willing to make tax payers pay more than they are come down on the corporations. It doesn't matter which government you have, Republican or Democrat, they will always back industry and avoid regulaton!

    I agree with this, except I would substitute always for mostly.

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    I agree with this, except I would substitute always for mostly.
    Don't you realize that those large numbers of lobbyists can be nullified by one misguided 1000 plus page (unread, of course) bill? I will keep repeating that those who believe what you just wrote are NAIVE!
    Obama lied... Ambassador Stevens died!

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by celticlord View Post
    How is forcing people away from spiraling private insurance costs (meaning no hit to taxpayer) and into spiraling Medicare costs (meaning big hit to taxpayer) "solving" or even "addressing" the problem?

    Medicare is not "more efficient"--it merely externalizes costs.

    Cost-shifting is not efficiency. Efficiency would entail cost-elimination.

    Medicare is more efficient. As for private, they are so fat with bloat it's disgusting. I was watching a story on health insurance last night, and it was pointed out that in the early 90s, the last time we had a national conversation about health care and health insurance, private companies were paying out 95 cents of every premium dollar in claims. Now they are paying out 80 cents of every premium dollar - and those premiums are spiralling out of control. You are paying $20mil executive salaries, salaries of people whose job it is, is to find ways to deny claims, and all kinds of other things that have nothing to do with providing better care to beneficiaries.

    Besides, if you're so concerned that a Medicare-style plan won't be more efficient, then you have no reason to worry about competition.

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by rebelbuc View Post
    Don't you realize that those large numbers of lobbyists can be nullified by one misguided 1000 plus page (unread, of course) bill? I will keep repeating that those who believe what you just wrote are NAIVE!

    Yes they can, but the fear factor is huge. Those lobbyists are convincing people that paying more for a lower quality product is somehow a good thing. And, some people are like, yea, that sounds great !

    It's a puzzler.

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    I actually find myself amazed to watch Republicans argue against competition ...
    The healthcare bill seeks to end all private competition. If not, then why does it deny options to add dependents or change private carriers? It's obviously designed to socialize medicine totally and take the profit motive out of healthcare. The profit motive is what results in breakthroughs that end up curing diseases and saving lives.
    Obama lied... Ambassador Stevens died!

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by rebelbuc View Post
    The healthcare bill seeks to end all private competition. If not, then why does it deny options to add dependents or change private carriers? It's obviously designed to socialize medicine totally and take the profit motive out of healthcare. The profit motive is what results in breakthroughs that end up curing diseases and saving lives.

    No, it does not. That is a myth being propogated by those seeking to protect the fat bloated profits of private insurers. Private insurers do not want more competition. Why would they?

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    If we have the best health care system in the world, why isn't the rest of the world ditching their systems and trying to emulate us?
    Because it is political suicide to shift reponsibility from any government to its people.

    This a very simple, obvious and basic concept.
    Last edited by Oftencold; 07-29-09 at 01:34 PM.
    Quod scripsi, scripsi

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    Re: Senate committee passes health bill, first to act

    Quote Originally Posted by jackalope View Post
    People with Medicare insurance are more satisfied with their coverage than people with employer-based insurance. What is the argument for denying what people like better, costs less, and offers easier and better access to physicians (as reported by the insureds).
    Nothing the Government does costs less. Nothing that does not involve competition costs less. Nothing that does not involve competition results in efficiency.

    Even the most basic economic course will teach people this. This notion that Government can manage ANYTHING efficiently and cost effective requires willful denial beyond the pale.

    I am curious if all you Obama admirers would fell the same way about Guvuhmint when Republicans are in charge. Yeah, I didn't think so.

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