Page 28 of 31 FirstFirst ... 182627282930 ... LastLast
Results 271 to 280 of 307

Thread: House bill would make health care a right

  1. #271
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 02:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Nixon View Post
    How do you figure that one?
    That you cannot sue the police should they fail to protect you?
    Castle Rock v. Gonzales - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Failure to enforce the law can come from a number of things and the police aren't the only avenue for punishment.
    Perhaps... but if, as you claim, the police were obligated to protect you (as opposed to just enforcing the law) and failed to do so, then you could use them.

  2. #272
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 02:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders View Post
    I don't understand what you're saying. Why is it okay to use taxpayer dollars to provide people with a trial by jury
    Trial by jury, and all other associated rights, exist only because the government exists, as trials (et al) are a function of government. As such, these rights are necessarily a function of government, which necessarily requires taxation (of some sort) to exist.

    Health care is not.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 07-20-09 at 12:38 PM.

  3. #273
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 02:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders View Post
    I realize that, I was speaking in the abstract. Say there was a constitutional amendment to make healthcare a bona fide right. Goobie was saying that it wouldn't be comparable to trial by jury, and that it would be slavery to use tax dollars for this purpose. I just didn't follow his reasoning
    The part you're missing is that government HAS to privde the means to exercise the right to a just trial, as the only way a jury trial can exist is through government.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 07-20-09 at 12:38 PM.

  4. #274
    Norville Rogers
    Kernel Sanders's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Last Seen
    07-23-12 @ 10:20 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3,730

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Why couldn't health care be a government function, and why couldn't the free market provide trials?
    Last edited by Kernel Sanders; 07-20-09 at 12:35 PM.

  5. #275
    Klattu Verata Nicto
    LaMidRighter's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Louisiana
    Last Seen
    07-21-17 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    30,534

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders View Post
    Why couldn't the free market provide trials?
    No access to criminal courts, only a legally appointed authority has such powers under the founding of this country, the way the red-light camera companies get away with existing in the U.S. is to do everything from civil court and credit law, they basically coerce you to pay the fines with no criminal recourse, so they are allowed to operate in many states that way, it would be the same thing with free market trials.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  6. #276
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 02:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by LiveUninhibited View Post
    Technically correct on the car idea,
    Then you agree with me -- that the right to health care is just like the right to a car or a house or a gun. Thanks.

    Having something "paid for by somebody else" isn't really a criteria for privilege...
    Sure it is. It exists only because a law gives it to you. That's a prvilege.
    If it were a right, it would exist regardless of any law.

    There is no inconsistency here. NHI, and having access to healthcare, does not and cannot mean that healthcare is "free," it's still a matter of who pays for it.
    Obviously, the issue is if is free to the end user -- the person with the right.

    I advocate to use the rich via our progressive tax system to make sure the poor can access it...
    The poor have access to it now.

  7. #277
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 02:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders View Post
    Why couldn't health care be a government function
    You really mean to ask why can't the only way health care exist is through the government?

    and why couldn't the free market provide trials?
    Because trials are an exclusive function of government?

  8. #278
    Norville Rogers
    Kernel Sanders's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Last Seen
    07-23-12 @ 10:20 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3,730

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    You really mean to ask why can't the only way health care exist is through the government?
    Yes, what is it about healthcare that precludes it from being an exclusive function of government, just like trials?

    Because trials are an exclusive function of government?
    Why does it have to be that way? What is it about trials that precludes them from being handled by the free market, just like health care?

  9. #279
    Klattu Verata Nicto
    LaMidRighter's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Louisiana
    Last Seen
    07-21-17 @ 02:42 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    30,534

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    [quote]
    Quote Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders View Post
    Yes, what is it about healthcare that precludes it from being an exclusive function of government, just like trials?
    Exactly because it is not a power granted to the government and doesn't qualify as a right, no one has a right to a service, while a trial is a right of due process as it is assumed that the government must provide evidence of guilt in criminal matters, whereas the government does not have a right to negotiate services on behalf of the citezenry, the state and local levels do.



    Why does it have to be that way? What is it about trials that precludes them from being handled by the free market, just like health care?
    A) because that is the law of the land and B) because it isn't a natural right if someone else must surrender their earnings via taxation for someone to utilize something, i.e. medical services.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

    LMR

  10. #280
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 02:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: House bill would make health care a right

    Quote Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders View Post
    Yes, what is it about healthcare that precludes it from being an exclusive function of government, just like trials?

    That health care presently exists outside the goverment proves that health care is something that -can- exist outside the government.

    Justry trials cannot.

    Why does it have to be that way?
    I really do not understand why you do not understand how it is that jury trials are an excluseive function of government.

Page 28 of 31 FirstFirst ... 182627282930 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •