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Thread: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

  1. #31
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    Criticism, alone, does not determine whether or not one is engaging in patriotism or self-loathing. It is the balance or lack thereof that deterimes such. A Patriot criticizes his country when it fails to uphold ideals, but does so fairly and with acknowlegements of what it does right. If a person is simply indulging in never ending and often times wildly distorted accusations, they are not acting as a patriot at all, especially when their accusations are hypocritical to the extreme.

    Chomsky falls quite squarely in the latter category as far as I'm concerned.
    Brilliant post.

  2. #32
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Sounds like the Russian weapons dealers are about to get a juicy contract.
    Quod scripsi, scripsi

  3. #33
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    You realize, don't you, that the caste system started in India around 1500 BC.

    Were the Brits colonizing India in 1500 BC?
    The castes did not constitute a rigid description of the occupation or the social status of a group. Since British society was divided by class, the British attempted to equate the Indian caste system to their own social class system. They saw caste as an indicator of occupation, social standing, and intellectual ability.[31] Intentionally or unintentionally, the caste system became more rigid during the British Raj, when the British started to enumerate castes during the ten year census and codified the system under their rule.

    The Dalits, or the people outside the varna system, had the lowest social status. The Dalits, earlier referred to as "untouchables" by some, worked in what were seen as unhealthy, unpleasant or polluting jobs. In the past, the Dalits suffered from social segregation and restrictions, in addition to extreme poverty. They were not allowed temple worship with others, nor water from the same sources. Persons of higher castes would not interact with them. If somehow a member of a higher caste came into physical or social contact with an untouchable, the member of the higher caste was defiled, and had to bathe thoroughly to purge him or herself of the impurity. Social discrimination developed even among the Dalits. Upper sub-castes among Dalits, like dhobi, nai etc., would not interact with lower-order Bhangis, who were described as "outcasts even among outcastes".
    Nice try, but the caste system you refer to had no social or economical meaning until the arrival of the British.

  4. #34
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Now, back to our regularly scheduled topic. So, the British, those good guys who modernized the primitives and recieved no thanks, when they were not as bad looters and pillagers as the Spanish and French, are now backing away from Israel. Will other European countries do so as well, or is this simply a British reaction to domestic powers?

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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Brilliant post.
    So, do you guys think that even though the War in Iraq may not have been justified, one should find things to compliment in order not to be unpatriotic?

  6. #36
    DEATH TO ANTARCTICA!!!
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    So, do you guys think that even though the War in Iraq may not have been justified, one should find things to compliment in order not to be unpatriotic?
    There are people who simply hate their own nation.
    How does it work? I can't tell ya, I haven't studied the issue.
    But when a person is always there to complain about how evil and bad his country is and is never there to point out at the good things that it does, he shouldn't even consider calling himself a patriot.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

  7. #37
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    There are people who simply hate their own nation.
    How does it work? I can't tell ya, I haven't studied the issue.
    But when a person is always there to complain about how evil and bad his country is and is never there to point out at the good things that it does, he shouldn't even consider calling himself a patriot.
    If your refering to me then I refer you to the list of times ive defended our foriegn policy.

  8. #38
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    There are people who simply hate their own nation.
    How does it work? I can't tell ya, I haven't studied the issue.
    But when a person is always there to complain about how evil and bad his country is and is never there to point out at the good things that it does, he shouldn't even consider calling himself a patriot.
    You and Gardener may well be right, and there may indeed be people who literally hate their own nations. My point is that one must indeed by weary of labelling people as such for criticisms of policy. Chomsky, for example, criticizes the U.S.'s foreign policy. He has rarely, if ever criticized domestic policy, thus we do not know his feelings on the subject. I would not accuse him of hating America based on his criticisms of foreign policy alone.

    Why am I so hesitant to proclaim such labels? Herman Goering said it best:

    Voice or no
    voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders.
    That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked,
    and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the
    country to danger. It works the same in any country."

  9. #39
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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Dave View Post
    If your refering to me then I refer you to the list of times ive defended our foriegn policy.
    I haven't mentioned names, and no, I wasn't referring to you.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

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    Re: UK cuts Israel weapons contracts

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    I haven't mentioned names, and no, I wasn't referring to you.
    My bad i was on the defensive due to the random character assasination

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