Page 6 of 6 FirstFirst ... 456
Results 51 to 54 of 54

Thread: Obama agrees arms cuts, Afghan transit with Russia

  1. #51
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Obama agrees arms cuts, Afghan transit with Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad View Post
    Now remind everyone that your Russian and support Russian ambitions in Eastern Europe and the former Russian Empire.


    Just so people know your intent and outlook.
    How is justone's nationality relevant here? Are you saying that the opinions of Russians are automatically invalid unless they're anti-Russian in nature? You want what you think is best for YOUR country, don't you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    First video does not discredit what I said. Czech Republic is seeing a year long negotiations put on the table by Obama..they can't be happy about that at all.
    Obama has never been a fan of the missile defense system in Europe. It has nothing to do with Putin "walking all over him."

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    My remark about the Ukraine is in regards to the expansionistic intent of Russia towards their territory..not a meaningless popularity contest of polls.
    Well whether you like it or not, the Ukraine is a lot more culturally similar to Russia than it is to the United States. As long as the Ukrainians are content to be within Russia's sphere of influence, and as long as they aren't posing a threat to other nations, it's really not your concern.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    He made a deal. He also put the ABM system up to negotiation.
    Putting something up for negotiation is not the same as making a deal. And at any rate, "making a deal" is not necessarily a horrible thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    USA does not need to negotiate our ABM systems.
    I see. So you expect Russia to capitulate to all American demands, but you are unwilling to negotiate on anything at all that concerns Russia.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    It is not required of the USA to give out "presents" to talk...Obama needs to learn that.
    No, but it is a nice goodwill gesture when you're trying to repair a geopolitical relationship that has been badly damaged. Russia gave us a present (the transit line to Afghanistan) and we gave them a present (a nuke reduction agreement). Neither are of much consequence to the country giving them away, but both are at least perceived as being important in the other country. Nothing wrong with a show of good faith.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    Expect Obama to be pushed by Putin from now on..Putin has his number and plays this game like a pro.

    I have nothing but respect for Putin..he is perhaps one of the greatest European leaders since Adolf Hitler and now he has his Neville Chamberlain.
    You still haven't said what Obama conceded that will harm the United States. I'll wait.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  2. #52
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Last Seen
    07-18-09 @ 04:56 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    1,041

    Re: Obama agrees arms cuts, Afghan transit with Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    How is justone's nationality relevant here? Are you saying that the opinions of Russians are automatically invalid unless they're anti-Russian in nature? You want what you think is best for YOUR country, don't you?
    Virtually everything he posted he either misrepresented or at worse was meaningless to what he replied to.
    They where all though classic Putin era Russian propaganda.


    I didn't take the Soviets as credible when they did that and I won't take their kids as credible when they do it.


    Obama has never been a fan of the missile defense system in Europe. It has nothing to do with Putin "walking all over him."
    So what?

    He still put it on the table. He did this after Russian threatens towards NATO allies Poland and the Czech Republic.
    He also put them on the table knowing full well whatever he gets in return will not be worth the trade.


    Threaten + get concession=walking all over him.


    Well whether you like it or not, the Ukraine is a lot more culturally similar to Russia than it is to the United States. As long as the Ukrainians are content to be within Russia's sphere of influence, and as long as they aren't posing a threat to other nations, it's really not your concern.
    Ukraine is trying to get into NATO. I beleive they are in somehting like a stage 3 in entry(iow actively working with and training with NATO forces)
    They are not content to be under Russia and their biggest threat fear..is a Russian invasion.

    USA also has a defense agreement with the Ukraine...as part of a deal for them to dismantle al the former soviet nuclear weapons they possessed.


    Nothing is more likely to end in a war then the mentality you just expressed.



    Putting something up for negotiation is not the same as making a deal. And at any rate, "making a deal" is not necessarily a horrible thing.
    The "deal" is the arms agreement..what was put up was not part of the arms agreement. You're mixing two things together.

    In the arms agreement though is a clause that woudl in the end significantly restrict the size of nuclear capable delivery devices...primarily aircraft..Russia doesn't need as many aircraft as the USA does..if you don't know why...buy a globe.



    I see. So you expect Russia to capitulate to all American demands, but you are unwilling to negotiate on anything at all that concerns Russia.
    If that's what you see then you can't see.



    No, but it is a nice goodwill gesture when you're trying to repair a geopolitical relationship that has been badly damaged. Russia gave us a present (the transit line to Afghanistan) and we gave them a present (a nuke reduction agreement). Neither are of much consequence to the country giving them away, but both are at least perceived as being important in the other country. Nothing wrong with a show of good faith.

    Our relations are no worse then usual with Russia..Democrat cam,paign sign slogan.

    The transit thing Russia almost flippantly announced before the meetings had nothing to do with the primary point of the meetings..the arms control talks. There was not trade in political or diplomatic terms there.



    You still haven't said what Obama conceded that will harm the United States. I'll wait.
    Annexations of Georgian territory by Russia have been conceded as done by Obama.



    I don't like these line responses because they are often used to ignore the points being made.
    Nothing I replied to here was not already replied to before.
    Last edited by Triad; 07-14-09 at 07:37 PM.

  3. #53
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Last Seen
    07-18-09 @ 04:56 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    1,041

    Re: Obama agrees arms cuts, Afghan transit with Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by justone View Post
    Now remind everyone that you are black…

    Now remind everyone that you are Jew…

    Now remind everyone that you are Chinese..
    Now remind everyone that you are Irish Catholic…

    You are like Tashah, not even a bit of shame or conscious.

    I'm not black, jewish, or chinese.

    I do have a good chunk of Irish in me..some English..alot of Norwegian, Some German and a lil Northern Italian.. that I know of.



    Would you be so kind to quote me doing that – in my post above or in any of my posts. And would be so kind to show facts of Russian ambitions in Eastern Europe and the former Russian Empire and absence of thereof on the part of the US – far, far away from the US? If I support anything it is getting rid off A$$holes in the US where I live, I don’t care about the other side of the globe.
    Speaks for itself.



    I guess you along with GyGgt are informing the public that I am a KGB spy. I guess in your and GyGgt’s view Obama is a Kenyan spy, and only you are pure Americans… a special higher race here in the US…. not even a bit of shame or conscious.

    Uh ok....wth?




    I guess I was wrong about immaturity of Americans. I wouldn’t even know how to comment on somebody saying that black is white. Get this: the expansionistic intent of the US supports the Ukrainian President. Ukrainians do not support their President; he has 5.2% of approval. In spite of all the Western propaganda against Russia 57% of Ukrainians support the Russian president. Yet in the Orwellian world it is Russia which expands and brings dictatorship, but not the US which expands and props the failed anti-Ukrainian regime in Ukraine... Who cares what Ukrainians think...

    In the Orwellian world Chech president talks about Obama. Get this – Chech president does not talk about Obama he talks about Putin and Russia. He points to the relentless bi-partisan propaganda insinuating that Russia dropped bombs on Georgia and he does not sleep well because of Russia. He himself says – it is an absurd, I sleep well, Russia does not bother me. Yet the propaganda says – it does not matter what you, Czech people or Ukrainian people or Russian people say and vote for, you don’t sleep well and we will keep on propping democracy in Ukraine and twisting your arms to make sure that you’d say that you don’t sleep well.

    I guess, Russia cannot avoid a war or a series of wars against the US expansion. But you know what? As Russia was kicking Bush’s behind, it will be kicking Obama’s each and every time at each and every corner. Nothing has changed from the last time and nothing is going to change. For me as for an American it is humiliating to watch, all I have to remember that personally I have done all best to avoid the humiliation, I’ve tried even knowing that a$$holes cannot be reasoned, they have no shame not even conscious. I’ve tried.
    Proving my point.

    Russia isn't a Democracy its a Fascist state.
    Last edited by Triad; 07-14-09 at 07:34 PM.

  4. #54
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Obama agrees arms cuts, Afghan transit with Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad View Post
    Virtually everything he posted he either misrepresented or at worse was meaningless to what he replied to.
    They where all though classic Putin era Russian propaganda.


    I didn't take the Soviets as credible when they did that and I won't take their kids as credible when they do it.
    And a good many people see your rhetoric as "Bush era American propaganda." You're going to need to do more than just dismissing someone because of their nationality; you have to actually show that your argument is better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    So what?

    He still put it on the table. He did this after Russian threatens towards NATO allies Poland and the Czech Republic.
    He also put them on the table knowing full well whatever he gets in return will not be worth the trade.


    Threaten + get concession=walking all over him.
    Again, putting something on the table is not the same as conceding it. And how the hell can he know full well that whatever he gets in return isn't worth it, if he never puts it on the table to begin with? Since Obama most likely doesn't want the missile defense anyway (because he's actually sensible), if he can trade it for something that would be great.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    Ukraine is trying to get into NATO. They are not content to be under Russia.
    Are the two mutually exclusive? And why must you use a loaded pejorative like "under Russia" when it's at least partially with the consent of the Ukrainian people?

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    Nothing is more likely to end in a war then the mentality you just expressed.
    So you don't believe that other nations should be able to forge good relationships with their powerful neighbors, unless you approve of their decision?

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    The "deal" is the arms agreement..what was put up was not part of the arms agreement. You're mixing two things together.
    The arms agreement was a minor deal, and was just a token gesture of goodwill to the Russians. If that is the big "concession" that means Obama is Neville Chamberlain, then I suggest you learn about geopolitics. This was an extremely minor deal that costs us very little while making the Russians feel proud to have contributed to world peace. It's nothing more than a nice gesture.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    In the arms agreement though is a clause that woudl in the end significantly restrict the size of nuclear capable delivery devices...primarily aircraft..Russia doesn't need as many aircraft as the USA does..if you don't know why...buy a globe.
    Don't worry. The United States and Russia will still be able to blow each other up many times over.

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    If that's what you see then you can't see.
    OK. Please make a list of the US policies that concern Russia, over which you ARE willing to negotiate. And they don't count if they're policies that you want to scrap anyway.

    Then let's line that list up next to the things you want Russia to do. Are your two lists of comparable length/importance? Do you have any items on that first list at all?

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad
    Annexations of Georgian territory by Russia have been conceded as done by Obama.
    Really? Will you please point me to the remarks from the meeting where Obama conceded Georgian territory to Russia?
    Last edited by Kandahar; 07-14-09 at 07:43 PM.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

Page 6 of 6 FirstFirst ... 456

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •