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Saddam: 'I Lied About WMD In Fear Of Iran'

Of course not. But I understand some of the whys and hows of how we got in there.

It is weird for me, I am a Democrat and do think that the administration had Iraq in it's sights from the get-go, and that 9/11 was just a convenient excuse, but I still think that it can be a good thing over all. I try to avoid criticizing GW Bush, because though I do not think he was our most deep thinking President, I do think he had the best for our country in his heart. I love that our system has so many different views, and I can see many of the hawks points on foreign policy, but I do think there needs to be a careful balance. I am with you that we need much stronger negotiators that what we have now.
 
If you can't figure it out you shouldn't be in this thread.

The WMD threat was to our ally Israel.

There's a clue.

Can you figure it out on your own now?

Oh, okay. I get it now. That makes perfect sense..

Because of all the many WMD attacks Iraq had made on Israel before 2003. Right? Saddam just WMD'd Israel every other day, didn't he? Twice on Sunday. Sure. And of that intel we got pre-2003 that indicated Saddam was going to WMD Israel even more. Now I remember.

Course, Saddam didn't have WMDs at the time...

We couldn't be expected to know that, of course, because of the fabricated intel, er, I mean the intel we had at the time, from trustworthy (ha ha) sources like 'Curveball,' and the Wolfowitz/Feith team (who invented some 'facts' later coined 'Alternative Intelligence').

So, based on the information we had at the time (shrug), we had to invade Iraq and bomb it to crap and lose thousands of American lives and spend a trillion dollars and keep our military there for over 6 years (so far).

Thanks for reminding me of the reason we had to invade Iraq.
 
Oh, okay. I get it now. That makes perfect sense..

Because of all the many WMD attacks Iraq had made on Israel before 2003. Right? Saddam just WMD'd Israel every other day, didn't he? Twice on Sunday. Sure. And of that intel we got pre-2003 that indicated Saddam was going to WMD Israel even more. Now I remember.

Course, Saddam didn't have WMDs at the time...


We couldn't be expected to know that, of course, because of the fabricated intel, er, I mean the intel we had at the time, from trustworthy (ha ha) sources like 'Curveball,' and the Wolfowitz/Feith team (who invented some 'facts' later coined 'Alternative Intelligence').

So, based on the information we had at the time (shrug), we had to invade Iraq and bomb it to crap and lose thousands of American lives and spend a trillion dollars and keep our military there for over 6 years (so far).

Thanks for reminding me of the reason we had to invade Iraq.

Iraq launched dozens and dozens of SCUD missiles into Israel during the first Gulf War and was vociferously anti-Israel.
 
Iraq launched dozens and dozens of SCUD missiles into Israel during the first Gulf War and was vociferously anti-Israel.

I remember the useless scuds, yes I do. Saddam fired some of them of in, when was it, er, 1991. That's right, 1991. So, you're right, it makes perfect sense for the United States, in 2003, to invade Iraq, bomb the hell out of it, lose thousands of our soldiers, spend a trillion dol - well, you know.

If I remember right, Iraq fired more scuds at Saudi Arabia than at Israel.
 
I remember the useless scuds, yes I do. Saddam fired some of them of in, when was it, er, 1991. That's right, 1991. So, you're right, it makes perfect sense for the United States, in 2003, to invade Iraq, bomb the hell out of it, lose thousands of our soldiers, spend a trillion dol - well, you know.

If I remember right, Iraq fired more scuds at Saudi Arabia than at Israel.

I agree with you that invading Iraq was a complete farce, as to the reasons presented. Yet, I cannot help but hope that it does become the beacon of democracy and hope in the Middle East.
 
Again all this is irrelevant, Saddam was sponsoring terrorism against the United States (including AQ affiliates) right up to the fall of Baghdad.

The 9/11 Commission Report found no link between Saadam and Al Qaeda.
 
I agree with you that invading Iraq was a complete farce, as to the reasons presented. Yet, I cannot help but hope that it does become the beacon of democracy and hope in the Middle East.

I guess anything is possible. But democracy goes against the grain in the Middle East, because they favor religious government.

My friend, who moved here from Egypt in 1980, says democracy will never work over there.
 
I guess anything is possible. But democracy goes against the grain in the Middle East, because they favor religious government.

My friend, who moved here from Egypt in 1980, says democracy will never work over there.

Democracy can work there, just not the liberal democracy we have in the West. Indonesia is Muslim and a democracy and it works well.
 
Again all this is irrelevant, Saddam was sponsoring terrorism against the United States (including AQ affiliates) right up to the fall of Baghdad.

In a related (and equally accurate) news story, Obama is an Arab.
 
The 9/11 Commission Report found no link between Saadam and Al Qaeda.

A) No the 9-11 Commission Report found numerous links between AQ and Saddam just no collaborative relationship.

B) I didn't say AQ proper I said AQ affiliates.

C) The Pentagon Review of the DOCEX release entitled the "Iraqi Perspectives Project, Saddam and Terrorism: Emerging Insights from Captured Iraqi Documents (Redacted)," proves conclusively that Saddam was sponsoring terrorist activities against the U.S. right up to the fall of Baghdad.
 
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A) No the 9-11 Commission Report found numerous links between AQ and Saddam just no collaborative relationship.

B) I didn't say AQ proper I said AQ affiliates.

C) The Pentagon Review of the DOCEX release entitled the "Iraqi Perspectives Project, Saddam and Terrorism: Emerging Insights from Captured Iraqi Documents (Redacted)," proves conclusively that Saddam was sponsoring terrorist activities against the U.S. right up to the fall of Baghdad.

All of those you cite are a stretch, at best, but hey, I think Iraq will turn out to be a good thing in the end. I do not criticize Bush for the action, just the means to the action.
 
All of those you cite are a stretch, at best

Um no you don't have the slightest idea of what you're talking about, this is cold hard fact proven by the Iraqi's own documentation:



WASHINGTON — A Pentagon review of about 600,000 documents captured in the Iraq war attests to Saddam Hussein's willingness to use terrorism to target Americans and work closely with jihadist organizations throughout the Middle East.

The report, released this week by the Institute for Defense Analyses, says it found no "smoking gun" linking Iraq operationally to Al Qaeda. But it does say Saddam collaborated with known Al Qaeda affiliates and a wider constellation of Islamist terror groups.

The report also undercuts the claim made by many on the left and many at the CIA that Saddam, as a national socialist, was incapable of supporting or collaborating with the Islamist al Qaeda. The report concludes that instead Iraq's relationship with Osama bin Laden's organization was similar to the relationship between the rival Colombian cocaine cartels in the 1990s. Both were rivals in some sense for market share, but also allies when it came to expanding the size of the overall market.

The Pentagon study finds, "Recognizing Iraq as a second, or parallel, 'terror cartel' that was simultaneously threatened by and somewhat aligned with its rival helps to explain the evidence emerging from the detritus of Saddam's regime."

A long time skeptic of the connection between al Qaeda and Iraq and a former CIA senior Iraq analyst, Judith Yaphe yesterday said, "I think the report indicates that Saddam was willing to work with almost any group be it nationalist or Islamic, that was willing to work for his objectives. But in the long term he did not trust many of the Islamist groups, especially those linked to Saudi Arabia or Iran." She added, "He really did want to get anti-American operations going. The fact that they had little success shows in part their incompetence and unwilling surrogates."

A former Bush administration official who was a member of the counter-terrorism evaluation group that analyzed terror networks and links between terrorists and states, David Wurmser, said he felt the report began to vindicate his point of view.

"This is the beginning of the process of exposing Saddam's involvement in Islamic terror. But it is only the beginning. Time and declassification I'm sure will reveal yet more," he said. "Even so, this report is damning to those who doubted Saddam Hussein's involvement with Jihadist terrorist groups. It devastates one of the central myths plaguing our government prior to 9-11, that a Jihadist group would not cooperate with a secular regime and vice versa."

The report concludes that Saddam until the final months of his regime was willing to attack America. Its conclusion asks "Is there anything in the captured archives to indicate that Saddam had the will to use his terrorist capabilities directly against the United States?" It goes on, "Judging from Saddam's statements before the 1991 Gulf War with the United States, the answer is yes." As for after the Gulf War, the report states, "The rise of Islamist fundamentalism in the region gave Saddam the opportunity to make terrorism, one of the few tools remaining in Saddam's 'coercion' tool box." It goes on, "Evidence that was uncovered and analyzed attests to the existence of a terrorist capability and a willingness to use it until the day Saddam was forced to flee Baghdad by Coalition forces." The report does note that it is unclear whether Saddam would have authorized terrorism against American targets in the final months of his regime before Operation Iraqi Freedom five years ago. "The answer to the question of Saddam's will in the final months in power remains elusive," it says.


Report Details Saddam's Terrorist Ties - March 14, 2008 - The New York Sun

Here's a rather telling document from DOCEX which shows how Saddam was recruiting suicide volunteers right up until at least 2001 to attack U.S. interests:

Wednesday, April 05, 2006

March 2001 Document: Saddam Regime Recruits Suicide Terrorists to Hit US Interests (Translation)


Page 6 from document BIAP 2003-000654 is a Top Secret letter dated March/11/2001 six months prior to 9/11/2001, proves that not only Saddam Regime supported terrorists organization like Hamas and Al Qaeda as we have learned from other documents but also they were recruiting Suicide Terrorist Bombers to hit US interests. Saddam Regime was a TERRORIST REGIME and there was no other way but to destroy it after 9/11.

Beginning of the translation of page 6 from document BIAP 2003-000654

In the Name of God the Merciful The Compassionate

Top Secret

The Command of Ali Bin Abi Taleb Air Force Base
No 3/6/104
Date 11 March 2001
To all the Units

Subject: Volunteer for Suicide Mission

The top secret letter 2205 of the Military Branch of Al Qadisya on 4/3/2001 announced by the top secret letter 246 from the Command of the military sector of Zi Kar on 8/3/2001 announced to us by the top secret letter 154 from the Command of Ali Military Division on 10/3/2001 we ask to provide that Division with the names of those who desire to volunteer for Suicide Mission to liberate Palestine and to strike American Interests and according what is shown below to please review and inform us.

Air Brigadier General
Abdel Magid Hammot Ali
Commander of Ali Bin Abi Taleb Air Force Base
Air Colonel
Mohamad Majed Mohamadi.
End of translation of page 6
 
A) No the 9-11 Commission Report found numerous links between AQ and Saddam just no collaborative relationship.

B) I didn't say AQ proper I said AQ affiliates.

C) The Pentagon Review of the DOCEX release entitled the "Iraqi Perspectives Project, Saddam and Terrorism: Emerging Insights from Captured Iraqi Documents (Redacted)," proves conclusively that Saddam was sponsoring terrorist activities against the U.S. right up to the fall of Baghdad.

Depends on who you believe, I guess. The information is way too much for me to read all of it, so you have to depend on somebody else's interpretation.

To the point, though, in 2003, I don't recall having any fear of Iraq or an attack from that country, especially since it was pretty much under our control since the 1991 war. Hussein/Iraq was no threat to us.
 
Depends on who you believe, I guess. The information is way too much for me to read all of it, so you have to depend on somebody else's interpretation.

The relevant information is in the first PDF here's a short summary and an actual document from DOCEX:

WASHINGTON — A Pentagon review of about 600,000 documents captured in the Iraq war attests to Saddam Hussein's willingness to use terrorism to target Americans and work closely with jihadist organizations throughout the Middle East.

The report, released this week by the Institute for Defense Analyses, says it found no "smoking gun" linking Iraq operationally to Al Qaeda. But it does say Saddam collaborated with known Al Qaeda affiliates and a wider constellation of Islamist terror groups.

The report also undercuts the claim made by many on the left and many at the CIA that Saddam, as a national socialist, was incapable of supporting or collaborating with the Islamist al Qaeda. The report concludes that instead Iraq's relationship with Osama bin Laden's organization was similar to the relationship between the rival Colombian cocaine cartels in the 1990s. Both were rivals in some sense for market share, but also allies when it came to expanding the size of the overall market.

The Pentagon study finds, "Recognizing Iraq as a second, or parallel, 'terror cartel' that was simultaneously threatened by and somewhat aligned with its rival helps to explain the evidence emerging from the detritus of Saddam's regime."

A long time skeptic of the connection between al Qaeda and Iraq and a former CIA senior Iraq analyst, Judith Yaphe yesterday said, "I think the report indicates that Saddam was willing to work with almost any group be it nationalist or Islamic, that was willing to work for his objectives. But in the long term he did not trust many of the Islamist groups, especially those linked to Saudi Arabia or Iran." She added, "He really did want to get anti-American operations going. The fact that they had little success shows in part their incompetence and unwilling surrogates."

A former Bush administration official who was a member of the counter-terrorism evaluation group that analyzed terror networks and links between terrorists and states, David Wurmser, said he felt the report began to vindicate his point of view.

"This is the beginning of the process of exposing Saddam's involvement in Islamic terror. But it is only the beginning. Time and declassification I'm sure will reveal yet more," he said. "Even so, this report is damning to those who doubted Saddam Hussein's involvement with Jihadist terrorist groups. It devastates one of the central myths plaguing our government prior to 9-11, that a Jihadist group would not cooperate with a secular regime and vice versa."

The report concludes that Saddam until the final months of his regime was willing to attack America. Its conclusion asks "Is there anything in the captured archives to indicate that Saddam had the will to use his terrorist capabilities directly against the United States?" It goes on, "Judging from Saddam's statements before the 1991 Gulf War with the United States, the answer is yes." As for after the Gulf War, the report states, "The rise of Islamist fundamentalism in the region gave Saddam the opportunity to make terrorism, one of the few tools remaining in Saddam's 'coercion' tool box." It goes on, "Evidence that was uncovered and analyzed attests to the existence of a terrorist capability and a willingness to use it until the day Saddam was forced to flee Baghdad by Coalition forces." The report does note that it is unclear whether Saddam would have authorized terrorism against American targets in the final months of his regime before Operation Iraqi Freedom five years ago. "The answer to the question of Saddam's will in the final months in power remains elusive," it says.


Report Details Saddam's Terrorist Ties - March 14, 2008 - The New York Sun

Wednesday, April 05, 2006

March 2001 Document: Saddam Regime Recruits Suicide Terrorists to Hit US Interests (Translation)


Page 6 from document BIAP 2003-000654 is a Top Secret letter dated March/11/2001 six months prior to 9/11/2001, proves that not only Saddam Regime supported terrorists organization like Hamas and Al Qaeda as we have learned from other documents but also they were recruiting Suicide Terrorist Bombers to hit US interests. Saddam Regime was a TERRORIST REGIME and there was no other way but to destroy it after 9/11.

Beginning of the translation of page 6 from document BIAP 2003-000654

In the Name of God the Merciful The Compassionate

Top Secret

The Command of Ali Bin Abi Taleb Air Force Base
No 3/6/104
Date 11 March 2001
To all the Units

Subject: Volunteer for Suicide Mission

The top secret letter 2205 of the Military Branch of Al Qadisya on 4/3/2001 announced by the top secret letter 246 from the Command of the military sector of Zi Kar on 8/3/2001 announced to us by the top secret letter 154 from the Command of Ali Military Division on 10/3/2001 we ask to provide that Division with the names of those who desire to volunteer for Suicide Mission to liberate Palestine and to strike American Interests and according what is shown below to please review and inform us.

Air Brigadier General
Abdel Magid Hammot Ali
Commander of Ali Bin Abi Taleb Air Force Base
Air Colonel
Mohamad Majed Mohamadi.
End of translation of page 6

To the point, though, in 2003, I don't recall having any fear of Iraq or an attack from that country, especially since it was pretty much under our control since the 1991 war. Hussein/Iraq was no threat to us.

The ISS was not under control they were sponsoring terrorist activities and fomenting radical Islamist allies (including AQ affiliates) for their clandestine war against the U.S.. Saddam through his actions violated the armistice.
 
Um no you don't have the slightest idea of what you're talking about, this is cold hard fact proven by the Iraqi's own documentation:





Here's a rather telling document from DOCEX which shows how Saddam was recruiting suicide volunteers right up until at least 2001 to attack U.S. interests:

The first citation tells nothing but that there are indications. You have one letter, that I will give you, does show interest in sponsoring terror over U.S. support of Israel. Other than that, nothing that justifies invasion when the U.S. had Iraq so embargoed that the people did not even have running water.
 
The first citation tells nothing but that there are indications.

It didn't say "indications" it made unqualified assertions stating that Saddam was in fact sponsoring terrorism against the U.S..

You have one letter,

No there are thousands of letters located in the first PDF of the link to the DOCEX review which I provided you.

that I will give you, does show interest in sponsoring terror over U.S. support of Israel. Other than that, nothing that justifies invasion when the U.S. had Iraq so embargoed that the people did not even have running water.

O.K. so sponsoring terrorist activities against the U.S. is no longer an act of war. Gotcha. :roll:
 
Um no you don't have the slightest idea of what you're talking about, this is cold hard fact proven by the Iraqi's own documentation:





Here's a rather telling document from DOCEX which shows how Saddam was recruiting suicide volunteers right up until at least 2001 to attack U.S. interests:

Such a threat to the US.

But up until shortly before the 1991 war, Iraq and the US were good buddies. We backed him during the Iran/Iraq war, removed Iraq from our list of terrorist nations so Saddam could do business freely, treated Saddam's Iraq like a regular ally. And this was done at the time when saddam actually was committing atrocities using chemical weapons, with our knowledge. President Reagan didn't seem to have much of a problem with Hussein, wasn't scared of him at all.
 
It didn't say "indications" it made unqualified assertions stating that Saddam was in fact sponsoring terrorism against the U.S..



No there are thousands of letters located in the first PDF of the link to the DOCEX review which I provided you.



O.K. so sponsoring terrorist activities against the U.S. is no longer an act of war. Gotcha. :roll:

Have we declared war on Saudi Arabia? We have know for years that they provide funds to terrorist groups.
 
Have we declared war on Saudi Arabia? We have know for years that they provide funds to terrorist groups.

Damn good point. And, lest we forget, we were attacked on our soil by 19 Saudi Arabians on 9/11/2001.
 
Depends on who you believe, I guess. The information is way too much for me to read all of it, so you have to depend on somebody else's interpretation.

To the point, though, in 2003, I don't recall having any fear of Iraq or an attack from that country, especially since it was pretty much under our control since the 1991 war. Hussein/Iraq was no threat to us.

If Iraq had WMD's (as was believed...read first post of this thread) Israel had every reason to worry about their continued existence as a nation.

If Israel launched a defensive first strike without proof or provocation a large regional war could have started.

We prevented that greater war.
 
Damn good point. And, lest we forget, we were attacked on our soil by 19 Saudi Arabians on 9/11/2001.

A majority of them were Saudi but not all of them, fwiw.
 
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