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Thread: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

  1. #151
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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by Baralis View Post
    I still see so much misconception in this thread. So far we have talked over and over about people needing emergency medical assistance but dont have the money to pay cash at the time. This is not how it works! Granted a person can pay cash at the time most do not. The hospitals dont ask you if you can pay and if you say no *shrug* and say "ok we will just write it off". They send you a bill just like most other services. A person unable to pay in a lump sum can make payment arrangments.

    So stop saying that all people that do not have medical insurance and do not have the cash in hand means the tax payer pays. Its just not true alot of the time.

    Also people have said that just because you are young this does not protect you from injury or illness and should be required to carry insurance reguardless. I also disagree. I am a person that will not go due to a illness. I have broken 2 bones (nurmerous other injuries) in my body and did not go for treatment either time (were found at a later time when a serious injury happened). When I did have a serious injury and no insurace and no cash guess what? I made payments untill the bill was paid. *gasp!*
    Unbareevable! j/k

    If we included legislation exempting medical care from bankruptcy filing it would help loads with the cost of visiting a doctor or hospital.




    Quote Originally Posted by Baralis View Post
    Some people such as myself and some of my family will not go for illnesses. Its just how we do things. Its not a matter of bravado but how we think. If I had cancer today (or any other illness) I would not seek treatment, its just how I am. So why should I be required to purchase a service I would not need.
    Quote Originally Posted by Polimaster View Post
    They are not getting a free ride though. We got off the point. A college student does not need health insurance because chances are they will not need it. Sure there will be some people that get hurt but they have options.



    There is the solution. College students have enough expenses, and so does everyone else, they don't to add another three grand onto them, especially if they are not necessary. You should get health insurance between the ages of 25-30.
    You used to be able to buy what I would call "catastrophic coverage" or surgical plans that would cover the costs of getting surgery and other similar things. This was about 8-9 years ago I think.

    I've been searching for one since I've started debating this and haven't found anyone offering them anymore. It would be perfect for college students and the like because it is so low cost.

    It could be that mandated coverage laws have erased them from the table of health coverage options.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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  2. #152
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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by Polimaster View Post
    They are not getting a free ride though. We got off the point. A college student does not need health insurance because chances are they will not need it. Sure there will be some people that get hurt but they have options.



    There is the solution. College students have enough expenses, and so does everyone else, they don't to add another three grand onto them, especially if they are not necessary. You should get health insurance between the ages of 25-30.
    agree, but only if they are in the military from the time they get off their parents insurance til they buy their own...
    Oracle of Utah
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  3. #153
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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    agree, but only if they are in the military from the time they get off their parents insurance til they buy their own...
    Yes, because they do not have bigger concerns than breaking a leg while in the military.

    No, chances are you will not need major medical care until you are older than 25. There are some exceptions, sure, like if you get a major illness. But no one generally needs insurance between the ages of 18-25. Lets say you pay 3 grand for health insurance, which is a normal amount. Then you save twenty-one thousand dollars between the ages of 18-25, that could pay for an entire year of college. Besides during those years you are not going to wrack up twenty thousand dollars in medical expenses, you save money by just paying it out of your wallet. True you might not have it all at once, but in the long run you will have saved your money. They will not deny treatment to anyone, so set up a payment plan with the hospital and save some money.

  4. #154
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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by Polimaster View Post
    Yes, because they do not have bigger concerns than breaking a leg while in the military.

    No, chances are you will not need major medical care until you are older than 25. There are some exceptions, sure, like if you get a major illness. But no one generally needs insurance between the ages of 18-25. Lets say you pay 3 grand for health insurance, which is a normal amount. Then you save twenty-one thousand dollars between the ages of 18-25, that could pay for an entire year of college. Besides during those years you are not going to wrack up twenty thousand dollars in medical expenses, you save money by just paying it out of your wallet. True you might not have it all at once, but in the long run you will have saved your money. They will not deny treatment to anyone, so set up a payment plan with the hospital and save some money.
    Are you assuming that the money saved will be spent going to college?
    My experience is that MOST people in good health who do not have health insurance are spending the money on non-essentials.
    If you are unlucky and get cancer between the age of 18 and 25, who pays?
    Do you expect to be let off the hook for the big bucks? or do you expect to spend the rest of your life paying for it?
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  5. #155
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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    A new instance of failure with government programs for the needy.

    As you know I care for my terminally father. To make it short but understandable. I no longer drive and have no vehical. My father has rarely driven since becoming ill so he sold his car. So basicly we use a local taxi when we need to get around but in this case the distance was to long for us to afford. My father's nurse informed him of a government program that will transfer non-emergency patients to medical treatment for free for those on medicaid.

    He had an appointment on July 7th at a heart specialist 75-80 miles away. He calls this service three weeks in advance. They tell him he has to call 3 days in advance and 3 days in advance only. They failed to tell him that they were closed on the 3rd for the holiday so when he calls they are closed. He called on the 6th (first day they are open again) and they refuse service because he did not call 3 days ahead. He explains the situation but they refuse anyway.

    He makes a new appointment and calls 3 days ahead. They tell him he must have a phone so that they can call prior to picking him up to insure that he is available. He tells them "I have no phone". They reply that they cannot pick him up if he does not have a phone. (WTF?) So he asks the neighbor if we can use his number (phone hes calling from).They then inform him it must be 3business days and once again refuse service. So he calls and rescedules his appointment and calls again 3 business days ahead. They then inform him that the distance is beyond the limit of service they like to provide so he will need to his doctor to send them a letter stating that the treatment is necessary (rationing service sound familar?)

    At this point he cussed them lol and hung up. I guess he wont be using them.
    And we want more government medical services?
    Last edited by Baralis; 07-10-09 at 09:15 PM.

  6. #156
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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    ^^Well I guess it's funny if you're into dark humor. But talk about inept (and useless).

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  7. #157
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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    ^^Well I guess it's funny if you're into dark humor. But talk about inept (and useless).
    The only other option is for the AMA to allow more doctors. But again, that could have its own unintended consequences, specifically decrease in quality.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    The only other option is for the AMA to allow more doctors. But again, that could have its own unintended consequences, specifically decrease in quality.
    With the wages that doctors are getting, I think that the market is dictating for more doctors.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    With the wages that doctors are getting, I think that the market is dictating for more doctors.
    While i agree that more doctors would be desirable, it is up to the AMA, and not the markets.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: Senate Bill Fines People More Than $1,000 for Refusing Health Care Coverage

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    While i agree that more doctors would be desirable, it is up to the AMA, and not the markets.
    Because the AMA has no incentive to keep the number of doctors low so that doctors get paid higher wages . . .

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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