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Thread: Part of railway to be nationalized

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    The problem with private sector choo-choos is that there's a train from Washington to Baltimore to New York.

    How many different sets of tracks are there? In order to promote efficient service, there has to be

    enough traffic to be commercially viable.
    more than one service provider.

    Generally, there's not more than one or two sets of tracks going from point to point, not any more.

    Do competing companies share the track? Why bother?

    So, the basic problem with rail is lack of competition and yet, if there's only one company running trains from A to B, because only one can afford to run, sure enough, there'll be a mob of dimwits whining about "monopoly".

    Could be that no one in the private sector, given all the controls and regulations and other hassles, wants to run a train that way. So the government volunteers, except governments do not excel in passenger service, no. The forte of government, after all, is power, and force, and threats.

    Fortunately, the United States is no longer linked by passenger rail as the only long distance means of mass transit.

    We've got airplanes.

    Which suck even more of the passenger base away from the choo-choos.

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    BBC NEWS | Business | East Coast rail to be state-run

    Why stop there?
    Buy back all of the railways.
    It should never have gone to private hands in the first place
    Just what America needs bigger government and more businesses. It is called free market, if you want a cheap train, go start and cheap train company and charge low prices, you competition will lower theirs. We do not need the government buying the train industry, because then they will just buy the car companies, and then it is the air industry. The government should not own the transportation companies, that is not there job.

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Lib View Post
    I see your point. Perhaps that isn't the best way to put it. I ask you then, do you believe that it would be better in the hands of the private sector, and if so, what are your reasons. Do you believe that it is none of the governments business or that the private sector could truly do a better job?
    The private sector does it better because it has an incentive to be efficient and live within its means. With a government program, if they fail, they get more money, so there's actually an incentive to run a bad company. This is why private companies are better than government at running businesses.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    The private sector does it better because it has an incentive to be efficient and live within its means. With a government program, if they fail, they get more money, so there's actually an incentive to run a bad company. This is why private companies are better than government at running businesses.
    Brilliant! The private sector has this thing called competition which prevents a business from giving up on trying to innovate and get better. Competition encourages advancement. Also competition will actually keep prices lower, because there is not one power (the government) that controls the price and cannot be challenged.

    I think the space industry should also be given up to the private sector. They would accomplish the same stuff faster and cheaper. If there was competition it would not cost sixty trillion dollars to put a bottle of water in orbit.

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by Polimaster View Post
    Just what America needs bigger government and more businesses. It is called free market, if you want a cheap train, go start and cheap train company and charge low prices, you competition will lower theirs. We do not need the government buying the train industry, because then they will just buy the car companies, and then it is the air industry. The government should not own the transportation companies, that is not there job.
    Not to pick on you, since it seems no one actually read the link...but go read the link. It has a nice map that should make things much clearer for you, assuming you can recognize that Britain is not part of America.

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Not to pick on you, since it seems no one actually read the link...but go read the link. It has a nice map that should make things much clearer for you, assuming you can recognize that Britain is not part of America.
    A condescending liberal, that's a rarity.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    A condescending liberal, that's a rarity.
    It was simply too easy this time.

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by Polimaster View Post
    Just what America needs bigger government and more businesses. It is called free market, if you want a cheap train, go start and cheap train company and charge low prices, you competition will lower theirs. We do not need the government buying the train industry, because then they will just buy the car companies, and then it is the air industry. The government should not own the transportation companies, that is not there job.
    America?
    Dude, this is UK. You are safe no worries.

    What cheap train tickets?
    No. It should never have gone to some greedy ass minority who make the rest of Londoners life hell. The majority outweigh the minority of billionaires [My heart is bleeding for them really]
    The other railway lines should be taken away from them by the Government imo.
    Last edited by Laila; 07-02-09 at 02:57 AM.


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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Privatization of rail in the UK has brought some of th highest prices in Europe and arguable on a cost benefit basis, the worst service.

    Rail in Europe proper for the most part is profitable and is both state and private owned. The French high speed rail network is a state owned company (51%) and last I looked has a yearly profit of 1 billion Euros.. that is 1.4 billion dollars. It is also far cheaper that flying and faster.

    In the end, governments keep rail systems in place for political and social reasons and in many ways also economic and environmental reasons. Rail networks are part of the whole economic system as it provides a very good alternative to the car to get to work. Congestion in major cities, lack of parking and so on, is a serious problem in most European cities and rail networks provide a way for people too choose a different way and many do. Without them, the congestion in for example London would be far far far worse, not to mention the pollution would be higher.

    So while the rail network in places might not be profitable per say, it does have other benefits that up to a point is acceptable, both politically and economically.

    And lets be realistic, the rail network we are discussing here lacks one very important thing..high speed rail. The UK rail companies have been talking about it for 20 years but have barely done anything about it. They are just finishing the high speed rail connection between London and the Channel tunnel.. what.. 15 years after the tunnel was completed? pathetic. So basically the UK rail service (in places) on long distances is relatively too expensive for the speed they achieve and time it takes. Also from what I gather, because of the privatization, the companies have done what private companies always do if they are allowed,... screw the consumer over. From what I have experienced on the UK rail system (granted it was 10 years ago) was utter confusion on pricing. You could get 3+ different prices for the same time period, on the same class, on the same connection... wtf is that. I was once going from London to Birmingham and for some reason I was able to get 3 different prices for the same ticket...

    Also lets not forget, rail is by far the cheapest way to transport goods from city to city, something America needs to learn.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Part of railway to be nationalized

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    So while the rail network in places might not be profitable per say, it does have other benefits that up to a point is acceptable, both politically and economically.
    If the traffic is as bad as you say it is, then a private company would make great profits there.

    Also lets not forget, rail is by far the cheapest way to transport goods from city to city, something America needs to learn.
    I think you might underestimate how much we ship by freight rail.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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