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Thread: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

  1. #221
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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    When I say "taking them on" I mean actually defeating and advancing against them -- the Chinese got their butts whipped.

    The US, on the other hand, achieved victory over an entrenched and fanatical fighting force that fought to their last drop of blood; they don't call Marines "devil dogs" for no reason...
    Point well made, point taken.

    *insert profound statement here*

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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    What is there to be proud of?
    If we are mentioning humanitarian reasons for our actions in Iraq, why shouldn't i mention other countries which ARE more worthy of US and UK help? Why aren't we helping stop a genocide but we went nuts about invisible weapons?

    We did not go to Iraq because of a dictator. We didn't care when we was funding weapons and helping him murder his own people.
    Hell, US and UK refused to condemn the actions Iraq had took against Iran in the UN, chemical weapons because he was our "friend"
    We sure as hell didn't care he was a oppressive, murderous dictator then did we? We brushed aside human rights and democracy as if it was nothing then.
    Why was it so different in 2003?
    Would you rather Saddam the butcher of Baghdad still be in power?

    You act as if your country is not complicit in this monsters reign. We were complicit though less so than the Soviets, French, and Germans, but the U.K. and U.S. had their dealings with Saddam. We are not complicit in Sudan, we are complicit in Iran as well to about the same degree as we are in Iraq. We not only have the means but we have the responsibility to help these people achieve popular sovereignty.

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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lerxst View Post
    Point well made, point taken.

    Not that I'm into these America v Europe pissing matches concerning WWII (okay, maybe a lil), but I feel like America's contribution in the Pacific Theater goes somewhat overlooked. The Marines saw absolute hell over there -- they deserve to be remembered and remembered well.

    Gunnery Sergeant John Basilone:

    At Guadalcanal, he was ordered to hold back 3,000 Japanese troops attempting to capture Henderson airfield. With only 15 men (12 subsequently killed) he held the line for 72 battle-filled hours - firing machine guns, fixing machine guns, and crawling through Japanese lines to obtain ammunition. A full Japanese regiment had been almost wiped out.

    MOH citation:

    For extraordinary heroism and conspicuous gallantry in action against enemy Japanese forces, above and beyond the call of duty, while serving with the 1st Battalion, 7th Marines, 1st Marine Division in the Lunga Area. Guadalcanal, Solomon Islands, on 24 and 25 October 1942. While the enemy was hammering at the Marines' defensive positions, Sgt. Basilone, in charge of 2 sections of heavy machine guns, fought valiantly to check the savage and determined assault. In a fierce frontal attack with the Japanese blasting his guns with grenades and mortar fire, one of Sgt. Basilone's sections, with its guncrews, was put out of action, leaving only 2 men able to carry on. Moving an extra gun into position, he placed it in action, then, under continual fire, repaired another and personally manned it, gallantly holding his line until replacements arrived. A little later, with ammunition critically low and the supply lines cut off, Sgt. Basilone, at great risk of his life and in the face of continued enemy attack, battled his way through hostile lines with urgently needed shells for his gunners, thereby contributing in large measure to the virtual annihilation of a Japanese regiment. His great personal valor and courageous initiative were in keeping with the highest traditions of the U.S. Naval Service.



    [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Basilone]John Basilone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Wait, this happened a few days back?
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
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    The Only Thing to Fear is Fear Itself.
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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Ferris View Post
    Would you rather Saddam the butcher of Baghdad still be in power?
    Pretty much yeah.
    I'd rather we didn't invade Iraq at all and focused entirely on Afghanistan.

    You act as if your country is not complicit in this monsters reign. We were complicit though less so than the Soviets, French, and Germans, but the U.K. and U.S. had their dealings with Saddam. We are not complicit in Sudan, we are complicit in Iran as well to about the same degree as we are in Iraq. We not only have the means but we have the responsibility to help these people achieve popular sovereignty.
    What you mean we didn't give Saddam weapons and support?
    Oh thank God, that has taken a load off my mind

    So we have the responsibility to help others achieve soverignty and we chose Iraq and not the countless others which may want it?
    Why would US wish to give democracy to the ME when its own neighbours has not experienced that gift?
    I mean, i'm sure Cuba would appreciate it when we pat them on the head and tell them it was for their own good ....


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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    What the hell happened. Im hearing news of massacres of students, wtf. Why isn't anyone talking about this!!!!!!!!!!!! WHAT THE HELL
    Last edited by repeter; 06-27-09 at 02:23 AM.
    Veni. Vidi. Vici.
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    The Only Thing to Fear is Fear Itself.
    -Franklin Delano Roosevelt

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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lerxst View Post
    Okay.

    True.

    They are the facts.

    No, not at all.

    Please provide a citation for this.

    Nobody declared them the savior of Europe. But they were absolutely responsible for creating the setting for which D-Day had occured. If Russia had not dealt the Germans such horrible defeats and put them on the run on the eastern front there would have been much more armor, air power, and infantry in western Europe. This is an undeniable truth.

    Stop being so melodramatic. It just makes you look silly. We didn't save Europe from the Germans, we actually saved western Europe from the Russians. That was my point. Go back and read. Had we not launched D-Day the French would be speaking Russian because the Red Army would have defeated Germany. The Rhineland was running out of military aged men to put in uniform and had made a major series of strategic and tactical errors.


    So you agree, Russia did not actually need our troops to defeat Germany.

    Okay?

    No, any "real historian" would not grant that point because it's not that simple nor is it realistic.
    I can admit when I am wrong. I obviously misunderstood your argument. I agree with you. Yes, Russia could have won, if only by sheer force of numbers. I do believe we saved the world, in the sense that the world would be screwed without the guiding influence of its Western Powers, however, my statement in my previous post was rather over dramatic (rather superhero esque actually). I appologize for the insinuation that you discounted the sacrifice of our troops. I now realize what your argument was, and agree with it. I do hope you can forgive someone who has been staring at posts from people who have no idea what they are talking about in several other threads for misjudging your post.
    “Justitia suum cuique distribuit” Justice renders to every one his due

    - Cicero

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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Quote Originally Posted by Laila View Post
    Pretty much yeah.
    Insa!

    I'd rather we didn't invade Iraq at all and focused entirely on Afghanistan.
    Afghanistan is the armpit of the Middle East unless you lack a warm water port it lacks all strategic value.

    What you mean we didn't give Saddam weapons and support?
    Oh thank God, that has taken a load off my mind
    Not weapons per-say, dual use items retrofitted for military use after the fact.

    So we have the responsibility to help others achieve soverignty and we chose Iraq and not the countless others which may want it?
    Those were American made helicopters used as gun ships during the '91 uprising. A truly black mark on our record. "Stand up" as we "sit down".

    Why would US wish to give democracy to the ME when its own neighbours has not experienced that gift?
    Um the entirety of the Americas are democracies in one form or another save for perhaps Cuba.

    I mean, i'm sure Cuba would appreciate it when we pat them on the head and tell them it was for their own good ....
    You mean the only non liberal democracy in the entire hemisphere with the Chavez Junta following close behind?
    Last edited by Agent Ferris; 06-27-09 at 04:10 AM.

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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Unimaginable Horror In Tehran Today (Baharestan Square Massacre)

    Quote Originally Posted by wbreese91 View Post
    I can admit when I am wrong. I obviously misunderstood your argument. I agree with you. Yes, Russia could have won, if only by sheer force of numbers. I do believe we saved the world, in the sense that the world would be screwed without the guiding influence of its Western Powers, however, my statement in my previous post was rather over dramatic (rather superhero esque actually). I appologize for the insinuation that you discounted the sacrifice of our troops. I now realize what your argument was, and agree with it. I do hope you can forgive someone who has been staring at posts from people who have no idea what they are talking about in several other threads for misjudging your post.
    Meh, it's all good.

    *insert profound statement here*

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