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Thread: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

  1. #21
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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    Quote Originally Posted by Scorpion89 View Post
    No it doesn't not even close but nice try to bring in something that is way off topic as a matter of fact I call and trolling
    So you're telling me that there was no corruption in the 2000-2001 elections? How is that a bs statement? My statement was "almost the same type of corruption", which in a given sense holds true. Maybe not to the extent they have in Iran right now, but along the same lines.

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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    Has there been any election, ever, without at least SOME corruption?

    Further, has there been a US election in the past 50 years that had only slight corruption?
    That is my point, I just used the 2000-2001 elections as an example. Stating that there are similarities amongst the election in Iran.

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    Re: Reports: Turmoil grips Iran as reform candidate arrested

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Poll watchers in Iran's election report that Moussavi got 65% of the vote.

    The Mullah's give the election to Ahmedinejad, and claim that Moussave only got 28% of the vote.

    How does one solve a huge discrepancy like that? Easy. Arrest the candidate who really won, and wage a brutal crackdown on his supporters. How good of a strategy is that? It depends on the integrity of the people. I have a feeling that the Spirit of Philadelphia has returned, this time making a visit to Iran. The Mullahs have become the new King George III. Freedom for the Iranian people may not happen overnight, but it will eventually come. More than 200 years ago, Americans showed that, no matter how mightily armed the suppressor is, it cannot keep the people down forever, and that eventually, they will rise up and overthrow tyranny. I am optimistic that this is exactly what is going to happen in Iran. As Americans, we should support and encourage the overthrow of Iran's tyrants. My best wishes go out to the Iranian people. May they one day prevail, and soon.

    Article is here.

    As I have been saying for years; the mullahs, the ayetoiletbowl, and Aminademonjihad, all need to be removed from power.

    As long as Ali Komonkey****er is in control there will be no legitimate government in Iran.

    Until a fair election is conducted in Iran, I say hit Iran with the same sanctions I proposed for NK.

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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    Quote Originally Posted by The Mark View Post
    From the article; I found this interesting:

    Trying to cut their communications, eh?
    I heard on the radio last night tehran non state issued web news was blocked at the state level during the night.

    internet was cut off
    Thank you

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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    I doubt we'll ever know what happened to this election. Unlike the US, they don't keep records for anyone to unearth later.

    From Al Jazeera


    Al Jazeera English - Middle East - Poll results prompt Iran protests
    Thousands of Iranians have taken to the streets of Tehran in protest against the outcome of the country's elections, in the biggest unrest since the 1979 revolution.

    Riot police were deployed in the capital on Saturday after about 3,000 supporters of Mir Hossein Mousavi, a reformist candidate, took to the streets following the announcement of his defeat by Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, the incumbent president.

    The protests intensified following a televised speech by Ahmadinejad in which he said the vote had been "completely free" and the outcome was "a great victory" for Iran.
    Al Jazeera's Teymoor Nabili, reporting from Tehran, said major streets in the north of the city had come to a standstill.

    "Coming up the street there were running battles happening between riot police and students and there were refuse bins alight in the middle of the road," he said.

    "I saw riot police hitting students with sticks. I saw students - or young people - throwing stones at the riot police, trying to knock them off their motorcycles.

    "But you didn't get a sense that there was any kind of organised movement in this."
    Mehran Kamrava, the director of the centre for international and regional studies, at Georgetown University's campus in Qatar, said that protests in northern Tehran were not necessarily an indication of a rigged ballot.

    "The western media has been talking to people in north Tehran, who tend to vote overwhelmingly against Ahmadinejad," he told Al Jazeera.

    "But let's not forget that many of the urban Iranians have priorities and proclivities that are not necessarily reflected in other areas of the main cities, and those people could easily have voted for Ahmadinejad.

    "Iranian politics have proved themselves to be notoriously unpredictable and this could be one of those instances of unpredictability."
    But Khameini appeared unlikely to intervene, calling on defeated candidates and their supporters to avoid "provocative behaviour".

    <snip>

    Iran does not allow international election monitors.
    Last edited by NDNdancer; 06-13-09 at 08:08 PM.
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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    Quote Originally Posted by BaZaRr BeAtZ View Post
    That is my point, I just used the 2000-2001 elections as an example. Stating that there are similarities amongst the election in Iran.
    Perhaps.

    But selecting a specific election belittles the constant corruption which has an effect on all our elections.

    Which was what I was trying to point out.
    Education.

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  7. #27
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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    Source: guardian.co.uk

    The scale of the fraud committed here is simply astounding.
    It's a good thing if they riot. It shows that they want more freedom, democracy. A revolution could bring this, unlike an invasion like in Iraq.

    The best thing we could do is to support these rioters.

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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    Quote Originally Posted by bub View Post
    It's a good thing if they riot. It shows that they want more freedom, democracy. A revolution could bring this, unlike an invasion like in Iraq.

    The best thing we could do is to support these rioters.
    Bub,

    Unless international governments gain concrete proof of the massive fraud--which will likely be covered up by Iran's rulers--they will likely be very cautious in their pronouncements. On one hand, they would like the will of Iran's people to be respected. On the other, if they align themselves against the present Iranian government and that government prevails, they may wind up having cut off all negotiating opportunities on the nuclear issue on account of their opposition. Those are difficult trade-offs.

    The conservative clerics (Ayatollah Khamenei and the Council of Guardians) and the Ahmadinejad government are ruthless. They won't go quietly.

    If Iran's people attempt to bring down the government--via large protests or even violence--one can expect the Revolutionary Guards, secret police, and other security elements to resort to widespread repression and terror. In a "reign of terror" type situation, opposition leaders, student leaders, and others that the regime finds hostile or suspect opposes it will be dealt with severely.

    In the end, if the protests continue to spread, as has been reported this evening, the government will probably give an ultimatum and then move to quash the protests.

    It is unfortunate that the will of Iran's people will likely be violated and ignored. But the unelected and unaccountable conservative clerics care little about the will of the people. Their major priority is retaining power.

    Hence, I don't believe the protests will escalate to the point of a new Iranian revolution, much less one that would bring down the conservative clerics and Ahmadinejad. The risk of such a revolution might increase if the regime acts ruthlessly against peaceful protests leading to widespread deaths and/or injuries. Then, a more explosive situation could be set off.
    Last edited by donsutherland1; 06-13-09 at 08:18 PM.

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    Re: Reports: Turmoil grips Iran as reform candidate arrested

    Quote Originally Posted by Vader View Post
    As I have been saying for years; the mullahs, the ayetoiletbowl, and Aminademonjihad, all need to be removed from power.

    As long as Ali Komonkey****er is in control there will be no legitimate government in Iran.

    Until a fair election is conducted in Iran, I say hit Iran with the same sanctions I proposed for NK.
    We should possibly hit Iran with the same sanctions as North Korea. However, if your only reason is that there is no "legitimate government" in Iran, then we would be forced to have simillar sanctions on countries such as Saudi Arabia, China and even Russia.

    You can argue for that, but I think that would be a very bad idea. We can't have a fractoring of the world into its same old West vs Non-West supporting governments. This is another topic though.


    I am leaning to supporting an invasion of an unlegitimate nation (especially if the people seem to be supportive of a regime change, possibly in Iran) but as long as we have the forces to carry it out, and the timing is ideal. The problem is that we are currently in Afganistan and Iraq right now, and I don't believe we will have the forces for that type of action.


    If anything, strong sanctions should be on nations that harm other nation's sovernighty (sponsor terrorism is an example) and even though Iran is continuing to do that to some degree, it has died down alot.

    So I am supportive of the semi-friendlier policy we are leaning towards with Iran now, at least for the present.

    -------

    I would be curious what anyone would predict if we did invade Iran now and allow a fair ellection. If the country would stick together and terrorism wouldn't increase, then I may support that now. But I have no idea

  10. #30
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    Re: Riots erupt in Tehran over 'stolen' election

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    Bub,

    Unless international governments gain concrete proof of the massive fraud--which will likely be covered up by Iran's rulers--they will likely be very cautious in their pronouncements. On one hand, they would like the will of Iran's people to be respected. On the other, if they align themselves against the present Iranian government and that government prevails, they may wind up having cut off all negotiating opportunities on the nuclear issue on account of their opposition. Those are difficult trade-offs.

    The conservative clerics (Ayatollah Khamenei and the Council of Guardians) and the Ahmadinejad government are ruthless. They won't go quietly.

    If Iran's people attempt to bring down the government--via large protests or even violence--one can expect the Revolutionary Guards, secret police, and other security elements to resort to widespread repression and terror. In a "reign of terror" type situation, opposition leaders, student leaders, and others that the regime finds hostile or suspect opposes it will be dealt with severely.

    In the end, if the protests continue to spread, as has been reported this evening, the government will probably give an ultimatum and then move to quash the protests.

    It is unfortunate that the will of Iran's people will likely be violated and ignored. But the unelected and unaccountable conservative clerics care little about the will of the people. Their major priority is retaining power.

    Hence, I don't believe the protests will escalate to the point of a new Iranian revolution, much less one that would bring down the conservative clerics and Ahmadinejad. The risk of such a revolution might increase if the regime acts ruthlessly against peaceful protests leading to widespread deaths and/or injuries. Then, a more explosive situation could be set off.
    Those are good points, but I still think that if the actual regime arrived via a revolution, then why coulnd't it be replaced by a "democratic revolution"?

    Isn't it what has happened in many countries before?

    But you're right, I doubt it could happen today in Iran. I still hope that the current regime will loose a maximum of credibility by reacting unadequately, and that it will bring some positive reforms in the future

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