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Thread: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Why would anyone want to settle for socialized health care that would have government restrictions? Let's fix the things that are wrong with our present system. There are many ways to save money without changing the whole system. I know that having a hospital bill made so people can understand and check it, would save a few billion. Making it so BC&BS get the same rates for services as do Liberty Mutual and other ins co. Have states hire more people to police doctors that are padding bills and cheating ins co. Check ins co. to make sure they are paying out what they should be paying. Blah, blah.

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    You proved nothing. I asked you a question. Why do you feel that you deserve medical treatment? In other words, why do you feel that you can tell the doctor what can do, to basically enslave him? Why do you deserve his services?

    Other countries doing it proves nothing. Other countries used to have official religions and persecuted people of other religions. Does that mean that we should have done it? So don't try those logical fallacies on me again.
    For the same reason I deserve a fire department, public roads, police and military protection, a functioning electrical grid, clean water and free education. I am a citizen, I pay taxes, I live in a civilized, high tech society. If I or a member of my family needs medical care, the quality of that care should not depend on the size of my bank account, and it certainly should not drain that bank account. Why do I deserve medical treatment? Because I am an American citizen.

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    Why do I deserve medical treatment? Because I am an American citizen.
    You can argue you have a right to all those things, all you want.

    However, having a right to something doesn't equate to having the right to have others pay for it.

    In the land of milk and honey, YOU must put it on your table.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 06-12-09 at 02:18 PM.

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    For the same reason I deserve a fire department, public roads, police and military protection, a functioning electrical grid, clean water and free education. I am a citizen, I pay taxes, I live in a civilized, high tech society. If I or a member of my family needs medical care, the quality of that care should not depend on the size of my bank account, and it certainly should not drain that bank account. Why do I deserve medical treatment? Because I am an American citizen.
    You're dodging the question. You pay for military protection, fire protection, and police protection in accord to what you have. So you're paying for it in accord with what you get. Not so with the health protection that you're advocating. That does not change in proportion to what you have. However, you want people to pay for it in accord with what they have. Where's the justice in that? We all need health coverage in the same amounts roughly. So it's not the same at all.

    Same with water, electricity, and education. The government should not be providing these. We ration water and run low on water with the government controlling it. Same with electricity. Government has failed us with education.

    The only job of government is to protect us. Anything more than that is an intrusion on our liberties.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Well, there are some inherent inefficiencies in insurance that need to be dealt with. For example, if you had food insurance, would you buy ground beef or filet mignon? You'd by the filet every time. Of course, if you were buying yourself, you might pick the ground beef since it's cheaper and you can't afford filet every time. So we can see how insurance can throw off the price system.
    Using absurdity to make a case doesn't lend any credibility to your arguments; food insurance? Please……

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    The solution to me seems to be deductibles and co-pays. This way we feel the price of what we are getting it and are covered in case of an emergency.
    You're kidding right? You don't know that almost EVERY insurance plan today includes deductibles and co-pays? The ONLY ones that are 100% paid for may be a few leftover Union plans but for the most part, ALL insurance programs I know of have a deductible, which is selectable as to the amount of deductible to the monthly cost by participants I might add, and co-pay options which also allow the buyer to choose the amount of co-pay which reduces or increases your monthly premium.

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    What a joke. If I am driven to an emergency room, they won't even treat me unless I can prove I can pay for it. If they do treat me, it will cost a fortune if I have to stay overnight, thousands if I walk out after treatment. How does that even come close to being "the best medical care systems in the world"?
    It is nearly impossible for me to take anything you post with any degree of seriousness.

    Carry on.

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by Catman View Post
    Why would anyone want to settle for socialized health care that would have government restrictions?
    The answer to this is easy; (1) they are uninformed or ignorant; or (2) they are a politician who wants more power over your life.

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    Using absurdity to make a case doesn't lend any credibility to your arguments; food insurance? Please……
    It's an analogy, and it works.

    You're kidding right? You don't know that almost EVERY insurance plan today includes deductibles and co-pays? The ONLY ones that are 100% paid for may be a few leftover Union plans but for the most part, ALL insurance programs I know of have a deductible, which is selectable as to the amount of deductible to the monthly cost by participants I might add, and co-pay options which also allow the buyer to choose the amount of co-pay which reduces or increases your monthly premium.
    And these help, but we need more of them so that we can come closer to a true price system. The importance of the food analogy was that no one will know the price of what they are getting and won't care. It becomes a huge expense for society, yet no one will care because they are covered. Deductibles and co-pays help us to get closer to a price system, but we probably need more of them.

    Ask a doctor how much an MRI costs, you'll be amused at the answer you get.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    For the same reason I deserve a fire department, public roads, police and military protection, a functioning electrical grid, clean water and free education. I am a citizen, I pay taxes, I live in a civilized, high tech society. If I or a member of my family needs medical care, the quality of that care should not depend on the size of my bank account, and it certainly should not drain that bank account. Why do I deserve medical treatment? Because I am an American citizen.
    There is not a person working in America today that cannot afford to buy health insurance; but when having a big screen LCD TV is more important to you than providing for healthcare, we call that CHOICE.

    CHOICE and QUALITY are two things missing in any Government sponsored system; the notion that anyone should be placed on a WAITING list for critical care can only be argued for in a vacuum of reality and the FACTS.

    The other FACT is that the countries who treat healthcare as a "right" are now struggling with the burden of such systems as they approach bankruptcy.

    Another FACT is that for decades, these nations also gutted their defense budgets to help pay for the ever increasing costs of their generosity relying on the USA to carry their burdens and the FACT that their societies have suffered low economic growth rates and double digit unemployment.

    Another FACT is that their citizens suffer from HIGH tax burdens in just about every facet of their lives including personal tax rates at the lower pay levels of 25%, gas prices more than double ours and a VAT that makes it cheaper to buy from other nations and pay the duty than to buy their own products.

    Why would ANY nation with EDUCATED citizens want the SAME?

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    Re: AMA opposes Obama's Health Care plans...

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Ask a doctor how much an MRI costs, you'll be amused at the answer you get.
    Low Cost Cash Discount MRI $380 - Cash Discount CT Scan $270
    Low Cost CT Scan & MRI Discount Cash Prices for people with no health insurance.

    Open or closed, low cost quality cash discount MRI with and without contrast, and open or closed, low cost quality discount CT Scans with and without contrast for people with no health insurance. Low cost cash discount $270 CAT Scans - Affordable CT Scans - MRI $380 cash discount prices - Quality open MRI or closed MRI and open CT Scans available. Doctor referral required to get the discount prices.

    Magnetic Resonance Imaging $380, CT Scans $270, MRI Discounts, MRI Prices, Low Cost MRIs,Discount MRIs,MRI Costs, MRI Prices,Discount CT Scans,CT Scans,CT Scan Discounts, Low Cost CT Scans,CT Scan Prices,CT Scans Costs

    What does an average MRI cost?

    MRI cost can range between $400 to $3,500 depending upon which MRI procuedure is performed (example: brain mri vs. shoulder mri) and where you have the MRI test performed. The same exact MRI test can vary by hundreds of dollars from testing facility to testing facility. That's why it is important that you shop around to make sure you're getting the best possible price. By spending a little time and shopping around your local hospitals and imaging centers you can save hundreds if not thousands of dollars. MRI costs are broken down into two areas:

    Technical Fees: this is the cost of the procedure and where there is a potential to save a considerable amount of money.

    Professional Fees: this is the fee associated with having the radiologist interpret the test result.

    Costs Reimbursement - Insured Customers

    Most insurance companies, including Medicare, will reimburse the cost of getting an MRI. In most situations when an MRI is requested by a medical professional the procedure is automatically determined to be reimbursable dependant upon your particular insurance plan. It's important that you are familiar with your insurance prior to having any procedure, especially expensive procedures, performed to know if there are any special notifications or authorizations that need to be secured to ensure reimbursement. Make sure you notify the imaging doctor or technician of your concerns or pre-certification prior to any elective tests or procedures. If pre-certification is required by our insurance carrier and you do not get such pre-certification this may result in full denial of your insurance claim. Medicare and other insurance coverage policies are always changing so it is important that you contact Medicare (www.mericare.gov) or your insurance company to determine coverage prior to having any procedure performed.

    MRI Cost & Pricing Information

    Typical costs:
    For a patient not covered by health insurance, the typical cost of an MRI ranges from about $1,100 to $2,700, depending on whether the MRI is performed at a doctor's office or hospital and on what part of the body the MRI is done. For example, according to the BlueCross BlueShield of North Carolina Health Care Cost Estimator, an MRI done in a doctor's office ranges from $1,100 to $1,485, while an MRI done in a hospital ranges from $1,458 to $2,090. And, at the Tulane University Hospital and Clinic, a patient would pay between $1,369 and $2,623 with an uninsured discount. And at the Kapiolani Medical Center, in Aiea, Hawaii, the charge for a brain MRI would be about $934 if paid within 30 days and $1,090 if paid within 90 days.

    The MRI, when ordered by a doctor, would be covered by almost all health insurance plans as a medically necessary diagnostic tool.

    For patients covered by health insurance, if deductibles are met, typical out-of-pocket cost for an MRI would be a copay for the doctor's visit and possibly a copay for the MRI. For example, on a First CarolinaCare copay plan, the visit copay would be $20 and the MRI copay $100.

    Cost of an MRI - Get Information and Cost Guidelines - CostHelper.com

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