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Thread: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

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    Thumbs up Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    By the way jallman, thanks for taking the time and having the courtesy to discuss the issue in a mostly civil fashion.

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by Voidwar View Post
    Terminology fudging, and more attempts to apply science books to a personal and unprovable question.
    Well, that pretty much states it all right there. You openly confess that this is not an issue that you intend to approach rationally, stating that science has no bearing on your rabid opining about how it is acceptable to dismember babies in utero.

    I think I fully understand the caliber of intellect I am dealing with here. you have abandoned all honest discourse in favor of tossing out catch phrases like "appeal to emotion" in an attempt to obfuscate the true nature of what you are advocating. You may believe what you like however I am fully in agreement with the law where your kind are concerned: partial birth abortions undertaken without medical justification are treated as crimes. The only place where I deviate from the law on that issue is that I think the punishment should be much stiffer than it already is, up to and including the death penalty if premeditation is proven.

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by Voidwar View Post
    By the way jallman, thanks for taking the time and having the courtesy to discuss the issue in a mostly civil fashion.
    Thank you, also, but I do think that we have come to an impasse on this issue.

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by Voidwar View Post
    Provide statistics that prove they weren't. I will stick with the fact that Tiller was a doctor and you are not. His judgment = cause.
    Proving a negative is a logical fallacy. You made the claim they were done with cause. Now the onus is on you to back that claim up.

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Well, that pretty much states it all right there. You openly confess that this is not an issue that you intend to approach rationally, stating that science has no bearing on your rabid opining about how it is acceptable to dismember babies in utero
    If it is "in utero" then it is, factually not a baby.

    I think your approach is irrational, and I will demonstrate why.

    Your line is arbitrary. Human gestation and development is quite variable.

    Some 21 weekers, are at the same stage as some 23 weekers.

    So your line is an arbitrary one, and not really "rational" at all.

    Birth is not arbitrary but a fact.

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I think I fully understand the caliber of intellect I am dealing with here. you have abandoned all honest discourse in favor of tossing out catch phrases like "appeal to emotion" in an attempt to obfuscate the true nature of what you are advocating.
    It is not a catch phrase any more than your consistant use of inapplicable inflammatory terminology.

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    You may believe what you like however I am fully in agreement with the law where your kind are concerned: partial birth abortions undertaken without medical justification are treated as crimes.
    Dr. Tiller's judgement is sufficient medical justification under Kansas law.
    An attempt to force him to document it was vetoed. Thus his judgement, without documentation is sufficient under Kansas Law.

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    The only place where I deviate from the law on that issue is that I think the punishment should be much stiffer than it already is, up to and including the death penalty if premeditation is proven.
    As I stated earlier, the best you are getting here is trading one murder for another. Of course, the citizen you saved is worth much less than the one you destroyed, because the rest of society had already invested a minimum of 12 or so years in any citizen capable of concieving. So, Society is out twelve years of investment, and no better off.
    Last edited by Voidwar; 06-08-09 at 06:46 PM.

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Proving a negative is a logical fallacy. You made the claim they were done with cause. Now the onus is on you to back that claim up.
    Aye, the fact that he proceeded with the procedure is proof that there was cause in his judgement. A law attempting to require more, was vetoed.

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    How is not giving a hoot that Tiller was gunned down support for his killer?
    Thanks for addressing all of my points with an insignificant question. I did not say that anybody supported the killer. I said that they could justify the killing. Or do you disagree? If this was anyone else, would you feel the same way- uncaring whether or not they lived or died?

    Also, did you really think that was the most significant part of my post? Or are you just going to ignore the more difficult questions?

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    Well forgive me for not having the same faith in women and drs. There are corrupt drs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Talloulou
    have given you a dr. who was hired by the state to review Tiller's records. He has declared repeatedly on record that Tiller was not following current Kansas law and that he saw charts where there was no satisfactory proof that the late term abortion met the irreversible health threat criteria. If your claim is that he's a liar then fine. Where's the dr. who reviewed the charts and found them to be in order??????
    So how is it you distrust one doctor, but not another, seemingly based simply on whether you like what the particular doctor hsa to say?

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    So how is it you distrust one doctor, but not another, seemingly based simply on whether you like what the particular doctor hsa to say?
    Why...that's not what she said at all.

    Now she can correct me if I am wrong, but I think her issue is with the intentional lack of transparency Tiller Baby-killer had. Normally if people are going out of their way to hide something...

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    Re: Man accused of killing abortion doc says he's being 'treated like a criminal'

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    The Tiller murder was like a breath of fresh air.
    This is what has so many of us so upset. Tiller was not a convicted criminal. There are huge, gaping holes in any case against Tiller. The best document you can come up with against him is the argument of a doctor who has protested Tiller previously, and who you believe unquestionably, despite your stated distrust of doctors. And yet you are happy that a guy is dead.

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