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Thread: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    You know I agree with you. I'm only playing devil's advocate.

    But again, from a legal standpoint there is no inequality. The standard is applied evenly across the board. All of the arguments you make could be used by a 42 year old man who wants to marry a 15 year old bride.
    Save that a 15 year old bride is not of an age to enter into a marriage contract. And that is the same argument that stopped interracial marriage...every white can marry a white and every black can marry a black. Everyone has the same standard applied.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    You know I agree with you. I'm only playing devil's advocate.

    But again, from a legal standpoint there is no inequality. The standard is applied evenly across the board. All of the arguments you make could be used by a 42 year old man who wants to marry a 15 year old bride.
    Again, all those rights already exist. Prop8 did nothing to abolish them.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    You're not making the same choices as I am. That's the point.

    Take sex out of it for a moment: I don't condone adultery among hetero couples even when it's consensual, yet you and Josh are adulterers to each other. You don't live in the same place, so it can't be said that you're living an equivalent life.

    Hell Inferno is a far, far better poster child for gay-marriage than you are, so let her represent next time.
    We are done. You and I have absolutely nothing left to say to each other anymore Jerry. You have crossed a line.

  4. #334
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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Save that a 15 year old bride is not of an age to enter into a marriage contract. And that is the same argument that stopped interracial marriage...every white can marry a white and every black can marry a black. Everyone has the same standard applied.
    Even your own CA court rulings agreed with that principal.

  5. #335
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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    The problem is you have to show how inequality is an issue when the standard of one man married to one woman is applied evenly across the board.
    If a state declares that men are allowed to drive cars, but women are not, it would rightly be struck down as discrimination.

    If a state declares that men are allowed to buy houses, but women are not, it would rightly be struck down as discrimination.

    If a state declares that men are allowed to marry women, but women are not, why would the same standard not apply?
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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    No the problem is you have to show why it is the business of the the government that they should have a problem with two gays getting married.

    Are you saying two gay married people can't raise children when two non-married gay people can?
    No. But as long as the government is restricting marriage, involved in marriage we are going to have this issue of how or why they restrict certain things. If there's a standard applied evenly which dictates one man & one woman of legal age then what we're asking for is something extra. It's not a civil rights issue as no group is being unduly infringed upon while another group has rights they do not. Every argument that is made for same sex marriage could be made for marriages involving more than two parties, marriages involving child brides, etc. They would all be a request for a wider definition of marriage.

    So I think ultimately it will come down to swaying the public opinion so that people want to change their constitutions to widen the definition of marriage. But it would take activism from the bench in order to force change as this is not a civil rights issue.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    Then what are you fighting against if its all the same?
    As I keep saying, the fight is sociological, not legal.

    This is not the right place to fight for social acceptance since that is not something a court can grant.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    We are done. You and I have absolutely nothing left to say to each other anymore Jerry. You have crossed a line.
    I'm sorry you feel that way, but this is exactly why I try to avoid using myself as an example of anything.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    If a state declares that men are allowed to drive cars, but women are not, it would rightly be struck down as discrimination.

    If a state declares that men are allowed to buy houses, but women are not, it would rightly be struck down as discrimination.

    If a state declares that men are allowed to marry women, but women are not, why would the same standard not apply?
    How is this post any different that anti-gm bringing up marrying animals or incest or polygamy....

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    As I keep saying, the fight is sociological, not legal.

    This is not the right place to fight for social acceptance since that is not something a court can grant.
    The government CAN grant them equality under the law. Social acceptance is completely different. It is the gay marriage OPPONENTS who are attempting to equate the two.
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