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Thread: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by earthworm View Post
    Is marriage a right ?...a Constitutional right ?
    Actually yes it is a right the SCOTUS ruled in Loving vs. Virginia.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Actually yes it is a right the SCOTUS ruled in Loving vs. Virginia.
    And, specific to California law, in Sharp v Perez.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote:Originally Posted by Truth Detector
    In other words, Obama once again attempts to take BOTH sides in an issue and his loyal fans (that would be YOU) willingly swallow the swill he dishes out for no other reason than of him being a Liberal Democrat.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Not at all...its called respect for others views. It is possible, believe it or not, to have your own personal views but not feel the need to subject everyone else to them (something that many cannot grasp).
    What a fascinating argument coming from someone who so obviously doesn't respect a majorities views which were voted on several times that marriage is between a MAN and a WOMAN.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    For instance, you can personally believe that Abortion, for example, is wrong and still be pro-choice because you do not believe that you have the right to force others to accept your viewpoint.
    You can be anti-gay marriage, but nevertheless be against prop 8 because despite your views, you understand that it is wrong to force that view upon others.
    This is called equivocation. It is the easy way out for a politician whose entire political ideology is based on equivocating.

    If Obama thinks that his views should not be forced upon others, then why even express a position?

    If Obama believes that his views should not be forced on others, then why have a “green” initiative or demand that car manufacturers adhere to higher gas mileage standards?

    If Obama believes that his views should not be forced on others, why then sign spending bills that will force me and my children to pay higher taxes in the future to pay for them when I do not agree with them?

    Your arguments, as usual, are on a very slippery slope.

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Obama simply understands that his right to his views end when it infringes upon the rights of others. That is a concept that you probably cannot understand.
    Once more, the notion that one can be against something, but yet condone it requires some level of absurd logic I just cannot comprehend.

    That is similar to saying you are against terrorism, but think people have the right to support it.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by DarkWizard12 View Post
    yea, that's what I meant.

    But either way, will this fight ever end?
    10 years from now, people will look back in dismay that there even was a 'fight'.

    IMO--it's a sad day in CA history. But the reality is, there are some very densely populated counties in this state that are far removed, literally and figuratively, from the great UC campuses.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Wow, bro if you think marriage is about being free....man you don't understand the issue at all.
    Although I may disagree with you view on this issue, I am going to have to be honest and say... Well said, sir.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    10 years from now, people will look back in dismay that there even was a 'fight'.

    IMO--it's a sad day in CA history. But the reality is, there are some very densely populated counties in this state that are far removed, literally and figuratively, from the great UC campuses.
    Since when was marriage a "right”; does the constitution refer to it?

    I always thought of marriage as a formal commitment between a man and a woman who wished to start a family, usually conducted by a minister under the eyes of God and witnesses. When did it become a "right?"

    Oh yeah, when gay rights activists wallowing in emotional hysterics and hyperbole decided it should be and determined ALL society should now accept THEIR definition of marriage!

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    10 years from now, people will look back in dismay that there even was a 'fight'.

    IMO--it's a sad day in CA history. But the reality is, there are some very densely populated counties in this state that are far removed, literally and figuratively, from the great UC campuses.
    So true, everything north of Humbolt County on the coast is redneck country...might as well be northern Idaho. The whole Central and San Joaquin Valley regions are redneck country too. Might as well be the midwest.
    Each one of the founding fathers was a special interest group.

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    Since when was marriage a "right”; does the constitution refer to it?

    I always thought of marriage as a formal commitment between a man and a woman who wished to start a family, usually conducted by a minister under the eyes of God and witnesses. When did it become a "right?"
    When the government started giving out goodies for doing it. Also, as has been stated, when Loving v Virginia pretty much confirmed it.

    Oh yeah, when gay rights activists wallowing in emotional hysterics and hyperbole decided it should be and determined ALL society should now accept THEIR definition of marriage!
    Your definition was even wrong when it comes to the legal definition. So how the hell are you going to sit there chortling to yourself with undeserved smug satisfaction when you couldn't even get it right?

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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    Since when was marriage a "right”; does the constitution refer to it?
    The Constitution refers to equal protection under the law. As long as marriage is a legal institution instead of just a religious one, then yes, the Constitution does refer to it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector
    I always thought of marriage as a formal commitment between a man and a woman who wished to start a family, usually conducted by a minister under the eyes of God and witnesses. When did it become a "right?"
    No one is advocating forcing your minister to perform a marriage for anyone he doesn't want to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector
    Oh yeah, when gay rights activists wallowing in emotional hysterics and hyperbole decided it should be and determined ALL society should now accept THEIR definition of marriage!
    Yeah, equal rights are really a matter of "emotional hysterics and hyperbole."

    You don't have to accept their definition of marriage. You don't even have to talk to them if you don't want to. All they're asking is for you to leave them the **** alone and give them the same rights that everyone else has.
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    Re: California Supreme Court Upholds Proposition 8

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    There is no constitutional right specifically to gay marriage. The only court cases heard by the Supreme Court that signifies a constitutional right to marriage refers to that of a traditional male and female marriage. The Supreme Court has turned down any case thus far to my knowledge dealing with same sex marriage. As such, until its either:

    1) In the constitution
    2) Decided so by the Supreme Court

    Same Sex Marriage is not a constitutional right. It is your opinion that it is, but it is not a fact it is. The only FACT is that marriage as defined between a man and a woman is a constitutional fact. This remains the case until such time as one of the above two things happen. Until then, its just your OPINION that it is a constitutional right.
    Not exactly.

    This is what they court found in [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_re_Marriage_Cases"]In re Marriage Cases[/ame]

    In re Marriage Cases (2008) 43 Cal.4th 757 [76 Cal.Rptr.3d 683, 183 P.3d 384], is a California Supreme Court case with the dual holding that "statutes that treat persons differently because of their sexual orientation should be subjected to strict scrutiny" and the existing "California legislative and initiative measures limiting marriage to opposite-sex couples violate the state constitutional rights of same-sex couples and may not be used to preclude same-sex couples from marrying."

    On May 15, 2008, the court ruled in a 4–3 decision that laws directed at gays and lesbians are subject to strict judicial scrutiny and that marriage is a fundamental right under Article 1, Section 7 of the California Constitution, thereby holding unconstitutional the previously existing statutory ban on same-sex marriage embodied in two statutes, one enacted by the Legislature in 1977, and the other through the initiative process in 2000 (Proposition 22). The Court's ruling also established that any law discriminating on the basis of sexual orientation is constitutionally suspect, making California the first state in the United States to set such a strict standard.
    I am waiting to get a summary of today's ruling to see how they seemed to come full circle. They made it an equal protection issue last year, but then the constitutional amendment gets around that... I guess.

    Thanks LDS church--but from now on, can we just let California's decide what's best for us w/o a media blitz of fear ads.... please, and thank you.

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