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Thread: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    Neocon began to be used during the Reagan administration and resurged during the Bush administration to describe those who supported toppling the leadership of a nation in order to set-up a democracy. If we have been doing that since WWII, tell me what nations we invaded, occuppied and attempted to establish democracies in prior to Iraq.
    You don't have to topple a country to spread democracy. Any time the Soviet Union tried to encroach on the US we fought them. NATO was formed to stop the spread of communism into Europe.

    Wanting to spread freedom and democracy could never have a name associated with some sort of evil.

    Neocon reminds people of the word "neo nazi" and has no meaning today other than to be insulting. Stop using it!

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Quote Originally Posted by sazerac View Post
    You don't have to topple a country to spread democracy. Any time the Soviet Union tried to encroach on the US we fought them. NATO was formed to stop the spread of communism into Europe.

    Wanting to spread freedom and democracy could never have a name associated with some sort of evil.

    Neocon reminds people of the word "neo nazi" and has no meaning today other than to be insulting. Stop using it!
    We never really succeeded either did we? Our best hope for Neoliberalism, which is exactly the type of policy this is, would be China, for they are the only country where real economic change is being used.

    If it offensive then I will refrain, though I have heard many GOP describe themselves and party with the said term.

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    We never really succeeded either did we? Our best hope for Neoliberalism, which is exactly the type of policy this is, would be China, for they are the only country where real economic change is being used.

    If it offensive then I will refrain, though I have heard many GOP describe themselves and party with the said term.
    Thank you. In the last several years the word has become something along the lines of "libtard" or "repug."

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Quote Originally Posted by sazerac View Post
    Thank you. In the last several years the word has become something along the lines of "libtard" or "repug."
    Not a problem good sir.

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain America View Post
    I'll give you an honest answer. I think Powell supported Obama because Obama is considered to be an African-American.

    And somehow that's ok?
    Yeah...it couldn't POSSIBLY be because Powell, like most of America, thought Obama was clearly the better choice.

    The reality is, the John McCain that ran is not the same McCain that really was a right-leaning moderate. McCain sold his integrity by pandering to the radical religious right. He lost the independents and moderates when he did that. He lost more when he stubbornly stuck to his assertion that the "fundamentals of the economy" were strong, when the rest of the country understood that we were in trouble.

    No....Powell recognized that Obama was a better leader and better capable to lead this country. Yet...the Rush Limbaugh's of this country cannot accept that fact and continue to try to make it about race...as if a black person is incapable of making a well informed rational decision. But do you really expect more out of people like this?
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    How did you win?
    How did you win the last midterms?

    Being honest?
    Being forthright?
    Telling people precisely what you wanted to do?

    No.

    Ferraro nailed Obama cold.
    He is there now, but in reality it was hysteria and ignorance that got him elected.

    As for the midterms?
    All the wacked out leadership went into hiding.
    You ran D's that were out of step with the party leadership.
    You used Foley as a foil.
    Then you brought Kerry out in the last minute and he fumbled on the 1 yard line.
    Many in your party thought ugh-oh.

    Once the circus acts are spent, what have you folks got?

    Little to nothing.

    You are the party of factions, not a coherent, time tested philosophy that works.

    What cheap trick will you folks try next time in an effort to camouflage the truth with your willing propagandists?

    Fineman: 'Mainstream Media Party' is over - Howard Fineman- msnbc.com

    Yes we lost, but we lost because we don't have folks coming out and espousing conservatism. Once that happens, we'll be fine.

    Until then, we'll have to watch the amateur hour circus act run the country.

    Carter was good for the Republican party.
    Obama... it is a little too early to have massive buyers remorse, but there are some already who have stated... this is not what I voted for.

    .
    In other words, you're sore that we won. Noted.
    *insert profound statement here*

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    GAHH! I just had a major write up and accidently hit "reload" hotkey. God Damnit.

    Alright, going to condense it. Captain America, as a note, this is mostly to you.

    You're either letting your annoyance for TD irritate you, or quite frankly you're AMAZINGLY ignorant of conservatism.

    Every single complaint and bitch you've had in this thread from the semi legitimate (legally denying marriage) to the asanine (dress codes) that you've tried to put forth as an example of why the GOP needs to not go farther to the right is like saying MUSIC needs to stop being produced because Death
    Metal sucks. You're not bitching about Conservatism, you're bitching about Social Conservatism. More to the point, you're bitching about Social Conservatism that is generally taken to an extreme point and is in no way balanced and thus contained to a reasonable level by other portions of conservatism.

    Powell can't be more wrong. WI explained this a good bit. Giving people the choice of Democrat of Democrat Light is not going to work, you're going to amazingly depress your base and when it comes down to it the people you hope to snag are still going to look between the two and go "why go with the pretenders when I can have the original?"

    The thing the GOP needs to do IS to go farther to the Right, but not in regards to Social Issues where they're already EXTREMELY Right, but in all other aspects of conservatism. Political Ideology is a lot like a wheel and you end up going so far to the right at times you end up left and vise versa, which is the exactly the case of what happens with Social Conservatism if its not tempered by the rest of conservative ideology.

    The GOP will ASSURE itself of death if it completely rejects social conservatives, without a thought. Its not surprising that every liberal, especially some of the most extreme and most hyper partisan on this board, run around continually cheering this fact as if it needs to "save" the GOP. Like they give two ****s about the GOP? They loathe it. Read anything written by these hyper partisan and, like their conservative counterparts, the seething hatred flows forth from it. Yet THESE are the foolish folk that we're supposed to listen to to "Save" our ideology.

    May I kindly say to those genius liberals that think they know so well what conservatives should do....Mind your own ****ing Business and let us deal with our ideology.

    The GOP had basically given the middle finger to one segment of conservative ideology before with fiscal conservatives. They ended up driving some to 3rd parties, others even to the democrats, and more so simply depressing them to the point they don't bother voting or never donate or participate when in the past they would. To redo this same thing with social conservatives would yield similar issues....a fragmented base that can't give a clear national paltform and will stagger on in mediocrity.

    Late term abortions is NOT something the majority of American's want. Most Americans do have a sense of national pride and would like to see immigrants actually assimilate into society and come here legally, not come through illegally and simply leech off of this land. Most people I dare say don't want nudity flaunted wherever and whenever in society, detailed sex acts being talked about in schools, or making it perfectly okay for a middle school girl to come to school in booty shorts with a thong hanging out and a see through belly shirt. You only show ONE extreme and expect people to accept your word as gospel that that's somehow PROOF that an entire ideology is rejected. I say Bull****, utter completely and steaming, Bull****.

    The only way the GOP will truly manage to return and sustain at a national stage is if they have a clear, balanced, CONSERVATIVE platform that equally embraces fiscal responsability, limited government, strong defense, and traditional values. Until all portions of conservatism are promoted and balanced equally AND once in power these things actually REMAIN the case instead of being only talk useful to get elected then the GOP is doomed to mediocrity. To completely disavow social conservatism is as much of a death knell as focusing primarily on social conservatism.

  8. #78
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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Powell supported Obama because of Powell's own strategic vision for the U.S. For the love of God I wish some people on this forum would actually READ A BOOK or at least do some intense internet research on a man's politics before they launch accusation like "Powell voted on race."

    Powell did no such thing and not a single person on this forum can prove otherwise. John McCain promised more of the same with regard to his foreign policy. If you study Powell's career and his military philosophy what Bush did and McCain signaled he would do was in stark contrast to Powell's better judgment and overall strategic vision.

    Obama was absolutely the best choice among the two because he was the most likely to actually follow Powell's own strategy on foreign policy and military use.
    Last edited by Lerxst; 05-26-09 at 11:55 AM. Reason: oops
    *insert profound statement here*

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Yeah...it couldn't POSSIBLY be because Powell, like most of America, thought Obama was clearly the better choice.
    Perhaps that's the case. However, that doesn't bode well in regards to him also trying to claim he's a Conservative.

    He's conservative in regards to the size and scope of government? Really, so he's supporting a guy pushing for Universal government health care?

    He's conservative in regards to fiscal issues? Really, so he was supporting a guy pushing for numerous increases in spending that won't just last for years but for decades upon decades? For a guy that planned on increasing the taxes through a large variety of different ways?

    Social issues? Military issues? Give me a break.

    Maybe he thought that Obama was the better choice than the historically moderate conservative McCain. I'm not going to sit here and go "its because its black".

    But if its not that, then its because he prefered liberal ideas to the conservative ones.

    That doesn't make him a bad person, that doesn't make him racist, what it does most likely make him is not conservative.

    He either voted for Obama because he liked his politics, in which case he liked distinctly liberal views over moderate conservative views, or he voted for some other intangible reason. Now, that "politics" may have been singularly his views on the war. If that's the case, I start to wonder about Powell's intelligence if he actually believed there'd be a significant change with Barack Obama in charge. Not to mention, the fact that he's not talking about military issues, but other issues here that the Conservatives need to go liberal on make me believe that its not JUST the military issue that attracted him.

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    Re: Powell cautions against a GOP slide to the right

    Too many people feel that Republicanism strictly equals conservatism. It doesn't. If anything should tell you this it's the existence of a moderate movement to the center within the party. Just like not all Democrats are dyed in the wool liberals.

    Party for party's sake right?
    *insert profound statement here*

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