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Thread: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by goldendog View Post
    My qualm is with people who are choosing to ignore and deny the reality of things and are flapping their gums about the "THREE PEOPLE THAT WERE TORTURED". It's an assine argument and I really don't see many credible links that prove that only three were tortured. But that doesn't keep a pack of numbnuts from running around and claiming such a thing. Does it?
    I would rather have this discussion on the basis of 3 provable allegations of torture than 100 embroidered and embellished suspicions of torture.

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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by goldendog View Post
    My qualm is not with the Previous administration because it is clear as a bell that they are guilty as hell.

    My qualm is with people who are choosing to ignore and deny the reality of things and are flapping their gums about the "THREE PEOPLE THAT WERE TORTURED". It's an assine argument and I really don't see many credible links that prove that only three were tortured. But that doesn't keep a pack of numbnuts from running around and claiming such a thing. Does it?



    So you have an issu with Obama? Please tell us all about it.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    So you have an issu with Obama? Please tell us all about it.
    Goldendog is TOTALLY nonpartisan.


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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by goldendog View Post
    My qualm is not with the Previous administration because it is clear as a bell that they are guilty as hell.

    My qualm is with people who are choosing to ignore and deny the reality of things and are flapping their gums about the "THREE PEOPLE THAT WERE TORTURED". It's an assine argument and I really don't see many credible links that prove that only three were tortured. But that doesn't keep a pack of numbnuts from running around and claiming such a thing. Does it?
    But it still has little to do with the topic at hand. Unfortunately, a lot of people will still take any opportunity to attack the Bush Administration even if it is unwarranted and even though he's not the President anymore.

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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    I think that there are two reasons to have this debate publicly. First, to make it explicitly clear that these acts are in violation of U.S. Law, our history as a nation, and our national ethics.
    There were no laws broken however; the US attorney's who reviewed this and deliberated for a long time on this issue and they clearly indicate it was legal.

    Is your legal background more credible than theirs?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    Secondly, to ensure that we don't repeat this mistake.
    This again is an OPINION and not shared by everyone. I think that it would be a serious mistake to NOT have this capability available in times of national emergency; which is the exact reason Obama has reserved that ability still. Why do you think that is?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    I'm not opposed to trials, but it strikes me that there will be just as many dems prosecuted as Republicans.

    Of course, I'm totally okay with Nancy Pelosi being incarcerated. I've never liked her.
    If there is no legality issues, if no one is going to be prosecuted and you are not going to show how water boarding meets the UN definition of torture and you have a President who has expressly stated he will never authorize the use of such methods, what is the point?

    Once more, there was NOTHING illegal about it and these techniques do not meet the United Nations criteria for the definition of torture which brings me to the logic of my argument; it is merely and attempt by a mainstream political party in power to impugn the previous political party for purely hyper partisan political purposes.

    It doesn't make us safer, it doesn't make the troops risking their lives in these countries any safer and it serves NO purpose in the interest of National Security.


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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    There were no laws broken however; the US attorney's who reviewed this and deliberated for a long time on this issue and they clearly indicate it was legal.

    Is your legal background more credible than theirs?
    Probably

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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    What is most interesting is all the focus on waterboarding. We have had detainees die from other forms of torture and abuse. Yet all we talk about is waterboarding.

    This problem is well beyond just waterboarding. When the focus in on waterboarding it allows people like TD to jump up and down and say "but it was only THREE people....we don't torture because our government said waterboarding isn't torture."

    This focus on a single technique is making us lose sight of the forest for the trees. Systematic punishment of detainees that lead to physical injury or death is wrong. You give it any label you want, it's still wrong. We shouldn't be doing it.

    I still would like us to strive to be the actual good guys. When we do these things we are no better than those we are fighting.
    *insert profound statement here*

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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    There is a difference between prosecution, and doing nothing. I feel we should find out what happened, what was done, how well it worked as best we can tell, gather all the information available, and then look at setting a long term policy.
    Two things here; do you not think that our Government can handle this without all the public scrutiny and hysterics if that is your argument? and; two, if we are trying to find out what happened, why only leak the secret memos on the justification and not the memos showing how these techniques actually resulted in actionable intelligence as well?

    In addition, if getting all the information out is important, why then should the Obama Administration not release the memos requested by Dick Cheney and the pictures the ACLU successfully sued to get released?

    You see the slippery slope one gets on when making these claims?


    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I might or might not agree with the policy, but I think that we owe it to the ones who will implement any such policy to have it be as clear as can be. Clear is obviously not how I would describe things the last few years in this regard.

    And in the end, what I am seeing is that no one can sufficiently link these methods to anything illegal and cannot link these methods to the United Nations description of what constitutes torture.

    Which supports my argument that this is a desperate highly emotional partisan issue brought up by a major political party in this country that had knowledge of these techniques when they were being used by said nothing but now want to use them to impugn their political opponents for purely partisan purposes.


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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    I would rather have this discussion on the basis of 3 provable allegations of torture than 100 embroidered and embellished suspicions of torture.
    And that is the problem. We are too hung up on waterboarding alone. There are many, many cases of detainees dying in custody as a result of abuse by our troops or interrogators. When we focus on waterboarding we tend to forget about those deaths.

    Torture, waterboarding...there is too much emphasis being put on legal definitions and semantics and not enough emphasis on what the hell we are actually doing to detainees.
    *insert profound statement here*

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    Re: Conservative radio host gets waterboarded, and lasts six seconds before.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    There were no laws broken however; the US attorney's who reviewed this and deliberated for a long time on this issue and they clearly indicate it was legal.

    Is your legal background more credible than theirs?
    I don't have a legal background, however, I do consider the opinions rendered by the FBI staff attorneys (who advised that FBI agents be pulled from joint CIA/FBI operations due to legal violations) and the ABA to be more credible than those of the Bush legal flunkies.

    Since I can tell that you have a sincere desire to learn more about this subject, here's some light reading:

    http://fl1.findlaw.com/news.findlaw....orce103rpt.pdf

    Enjoy.

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