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Thread: North Korea conducts nuclear test

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    joke Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    And then he's regime would be forcibly removed from power. The last thing it wants. People have these notions that states like North Korea and Iran will act in a manner that results in their regimes' end despite years of doing everything they can to stay in power.
    And who pray tell, would remove them from power? The United States under the administration of President Obama, who has assured us that small counties are no threat? I hardly think so.

    No, you are seeing the first fruits of our abandonment of asstertiveness on the global stage.

    The following stages promise to be even more dramatic.
    Quod scripsi, scripsi

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Quote Originally Posted by celticlord View Post
    Saddam Hussein did everything he could to stay in power, including running the Mother of All Bluffs about weapons of mass destruction...which resulted in him getting his neck stretched.

    Governments will generally act to preserve and enlarge their power. What is far from certain, however, is which choices will accomplish that and which choices will accomplish their demise.

    The concern should be less that North Korea will behave irrationally and more that North Korea will behave rationally but erroneously.
    Saddam Hussein faced a determined and assertive United States. That is not the case for the regime in North Korea. Barring action from China, or Russia, they are as safe and secure as a babe in its mother's arms.

    They may even win concessions and aid (tribute) from this exercise.
    Quod scripsi, scripsi

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test



    It's a damn shame we have to continue to put up with this loon. His people starve to death while he fulfill his dreams of glory.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    Saddam Hussein faced a determined and assertive United States. That is not the case for the regime in North Korea. Barring action from China, or Russia, they are as safe and secure as a babe in its mother's arms.

    They may even win concessions and aid (tribute) from this exercise.
    They may.

    Truth be told, however, is that some form of aid is what's needed in North Korea. It's a country that has lost its ability to feed its own people. As Moon already pointed out, it is a dying country. At some point, the world either finds a way to feed the North Koreans or deal with a mass of refugees at the 38th parallel and the Yalu River.

    The complicating factor is not so much North Korea's nuclear weapons, but the cult of personality surrounding Kim himself. I have read of speculation by some that the North Korean government would likely keep his death a secret should he have another stroke and die. As long as that cult prevails--as long as Kim has the loyalty of the military, basically--North Korea will prefer nuclear posturing and bellicose rhetoric over engaging the rest of the world in resolving its internal problems.

    The dilemma that creates is that any saber rattling on our part merely feeds into that cult and strengthens Kim's control over North Korea.

    Personally, what I would do is have the CIA mock up some aircraft with chinese markings and do a couple low-level flights over Pyongyang dropping food packets stamped with something like "a gift from the People's Republic of China and the United States of America to the great people of North Korea." Don't strike at North Korea, strike at Kim and his cult of personality. Undermine his image with the North Koreans.

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Quote Originally Posted by celticlord View Post
    They may.

    Truth be told, however, is that some form of aid is what's needed in North Korea. It's a country that has lost its ability to feed its own people. As Moon already pointed out, it is a dying country. At some point, the world either finds a way to feed the North Koreans or deal with a mass of refugees at the 38th parallel and the Yalu River.

    The complicating factor is not so much North Korea's nuclear weapons, but the cult of personality surrounding Kim himself. I have read of speculation by some that the North Korean government would likely keep his death a secret should he have another stroke and die. As long as that cult prevails--as long as Kim has the loyalty of the military, basically--North Korea will prefer nuclear posturing and bellicose rhetoric over engaging the rest of the world in resolving its internal problems.

    The dilemma that creates is that any saber rattling on our part merely feeds into that cult and strengthens Kim's control over North Korea.

    Personally, what I would do is have the CIA mock up some aircraft with chinese markings and do a couple low-level flights over Pyongyang dropping food packets stamped with something like "a gift from the People's Republic of China and the United States of America to the great people of North Korea." Don't strike at North Korea, strike at Kim and his cult of personality. Undermine his image with the North Koreans.
    Sadly though, the United States cannot in good conscience instruct anyone on the evils of personality cults, not anymore.

    We have elected a cult figure to the Presidency, who would not have been hired to run a discount shoe store.
    Quod scripsi, scripsi

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    We have elected a cult figure to the Presidency, who would not have been hired to run a discount shoe store.
    The only ones who have made Obama a cult figure is conservatives. Now that is sad I agree.

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Quote Originally Posted by Oftencold View Post
    Sadly though, the United States cannot in good conscience instruct anyone on the evils of personality cults, not anymore.
    Who gives a damn about "instructing" anyone? I'm not suggesting we go to the North Koreans sounding like Mr Rogers and saying "won't you be my neighbor?" I'm suggesting we find ways to give the North Korean people the opportunity to choose between a full belly and Kim's insanity. If that means toppling Kim and accepting some other dictator in his place, I'm ok with that.

    The goal is (or should be) a de-nuclearized North Korea. A democratic North Korea would be a bonus, but that's all.

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Ya'll are all missing the big picture here.

    2006, NK fires a squib shot nuclear test. This was in reaction to the US stance towards the country at the time. We reacted strongly and got NK to shut it's program down. Obama comes along and they decided to test him, so they fired that long ranged missile. Our response was weak.. nothing really happened. So they said "We're starting back up the Nuclear program" and now they've figured out how to do a crude A-bomb.

    This was to get our attention.

    They have not proven they can actually deliver the device, but NK, while rather insane, is not a country of suicidal maniacs. This was more to get "respect" and concessions from the US and others. No the real fear here, that they are working with, as they have in the past, Iran, and Iran is using NK to cover for it's own nuclear program.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Countries with nukes are safe from US invasions. More power to 'em

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    Re: North Korea conducts nuclear test

    Quote Originally Posted by CrusaderRabbit08 View Post
    Countries with nukes are safe from US invasions. More power to 'em
    Do you hate the US?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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