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Chavez seizes oil service firms

Harry Guerrilla

Harry Guerrilla

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BBC NEWS | Americas | Chavez seizes oil service firms

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez has sent troops to take over companies that provide services for the oil industry.

"This is a revolutionary offensive," he told workers near Lake Maracaibo, Venezuela's main oil-producing area.
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The move places hundreds of boats, several ports and an estimated 8,000 oil workers under state control.

The state-owned oil company PDVSA has recently clashed with foreign and local service providers over the prices they charge.

The service companies are owed billions of dollars by PDVSA. But the state firm says lower oil prices mean the contractors are being paid too much.
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He is at it again. :doh
 
Yes. Except for the fact that the people who elected him love him and he's a hero in Latin America, he's a real dictator and stuff.
 
Catman said:
It is time for a revolution down yonder. Chavez is really a dictator in every sense of the word.
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And maybe he is doing something for the working man.
The wealthy conservative business men hate this..
Check the popularity of each in our nation and in the South American nations..
 
The Jovial One said:
Yes. Except for the fact that the people who elected him love him and he's a hero in Latin America, he's a real dictator and stuff.
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No doubt the people like him, he's a populist but in terms of things like property rights you could draw a parallel of authoritarian rule with his seizure of private property.
 
Chavez was elected. The people are behind him. This is what the people want. Why should we even care?
Those people are tired of the worker being slaves to large corp structures. They are tired of The US interfering with their lives as well.

Chavez is the man the people want. Just who do Americans think they are to judge him by our failing standards?
 
Inferno said:
Chavez was elected. The people are behind him. This is what the people want. Why should we even care?
Those people are tired of the worker being slaves to large corp structures. They are tired of The US interfering with their lives as well.

Chavez is the man the people want. Just who do Americans think they are to judge him by our failing standards?
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I agree that the people want him and that we shouldn't interfere.

I always question the motives of people in leadership positions especially those that others wish to import to the U.S.

Something to remember though is that these large corporate structures mostly exist because the government interferes to keep them alive.
 
This could be a promising move; it will be interesting to see how this is handled by PSUV, and whether this will take on a form of management in terms of central state ownership or more direct rule.
 
I knew you would be. Anyways, I haven't had any time to look into this as of late (in fact, I have been much too busy with other matters lately to even follow Venezuelan politics, unfortunately), but I'll probably be able to respond later this week after I get some time freed up.

Until then, cue the canned "Chavez = dictator" posts.:2razz:
 
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Khayembii Communique said:
I knew you would be. Anyways, I haven't had any time to look into this as of late, but I'll probably be able to respond later this week after I get some time freed up.

Until then, cue the canned "Chavez = dictator" posts.:2razz:
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I'm just having fun with you. :twisted:

I dropped dictator for authoritarian. I think its more accurate.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
I agree that the people want him and that we shouldn't interfere.

I always question the motives of people in leadership positions especially those that others wish to import to the U.S.

Something to remember though is that these large corporate structures mostly exist because the government interferes to keep them alive.
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Oh I do agree that the governments hold up the Corps. They bail them out and give tax benefits. This is the way that the leadership continues to beat on the little guy and give to the owner class. The worker at the low end is seen as less and gets less.

When the average worker needs a hand I hear so many say well we don't want to do that. It is never fair.
 
Inferno said:
Chavez was elected. The people are behind him. This is what the people want. Why should we even care?
Those people are tired of the worker being slaves to large corp structures. They are tired of The US interfering with their lives as well.

Chavez is the man the people want. Just who do Americans think they are to judge him by our failing standards?
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Maybe your standards are failing, but the Americans' stantards are not. Then again, not one American voted for Obama, so maybe you're just not sure of who we are anymore.

The Germans loved Hitler, all the way until he started WWII. Even after that it took them a while to figure out the problem.

Why should peasants in Venezueala be different from educated Germans?
 
Khayembii Communique said:
This could be a promising move; it will be interesting to see how this is handled by PSUV, and whether this will take on a form of management in terms of central state ownership or more direct rule.
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I see this as a great move. If the people get a fair shake that will be what is telling. How much will the workers benefit by this move?
 
Scarecrow Akhbar said:
Maybe your standards are failing, but the Americans' stantards are not. Then again, not one American voted for Obama, so maybe you're just not sure of who we are anymore.

The Germans loved Hitler, all the way until he started WWII. Even after that it took them a while to figure out the problem.

Why should peasants in Venezueala be different from educated Germans?
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We didn't torture now under Bush it became the thing to do. The right has given up on anyone that is an American citizen. They would rather put all the money into foreign lands. They have tea parties to tell government that we don't want any spending here. We love corps that outsource American jobs. Yes Our standards are falling.

Obama was elected by a lot of Americans. Those that did not vote for him may well be questionable.
 
Inferno said:
We didn't torture now under Bush it became the thing to do.
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Waterboarding isn't torture.

Inferno said:
Obama was elected by a lot of Americans. Those that did not vote for him may well be questionable.
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Not one single American voted for Obama. A lot of US citizens did.

There's a difference.

American's aren't socialists.


The people that voted for Obama may think they're American, but since they don't recognize the American values of self-reliance, freedom, and justice, they're not Americans.
 
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I dropped dictator for authoritarian. I think its more accurate.
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It is, indeed. However, I'm still not a huge fan of the word used in the negative context, simply because of the emotional connotations it brings along with it.

I am proudly authoritarian, for example.

I see this as a great move. If the people get a fair shake that will be what is telling. How much will the workers benefit by this move?
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Well that's the thing. It could be a great move in some ways, but in others it could be detrimental. I am not only concerned with the economic victories of the workers, but political victories as well, specifically political rule. In terms of economic victories this could lead to better pay and/or benefits for the workers in those firms, but it could also lead to a tighter crackdown on management when the state assumes control. I have seen both happen in various state-owned Venezuelan industries, and so "state ownership" is not inherently good.

In terms of political rule this could go either way. For years Chavez and his supporters have been playing a very precarious balancing game, whereby they must satisfy both the demands of the Venezuelan working classes as well as both the small and large bourgeoisie. This crisis I have a feeling, once it picks up again, is going to have a huge effect on that balance, and could cause the balance of power to tip in either direction. For a while I've been concerned that Chavez was going to shift towards the side of capital, but lately (at least, until I stopped following Venezuelan politics) he has been shifting slightly towards the working classes. At this point it's really difficult to tell which way he will probably go.

EDIT: I just reread this last part of this post and it sounds incredibly stupid. The shifting of power is not simply due to the whims of Chavez but much broader forces and much broader movements in an incredibly broad and complex struggle.
 
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Scarecrow Akhbar said:
Maybe your standards are failing, but the Americans' stantards are not. Then again, not one American voted for Obama, so maybe you're just not sure of who we are anymore.

The Germans loved Hitler, all the way until he started WWII. Even after that it took them a while to figure out the problem.

Why should peasants in Venezueala be different from educated Germans?
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Not one American voted for Obama?
 
Khayembii Communique said:
It is, indeed. However, I'm still not a huge fan of the word used in the negative context, simply because of the emotional connotations it brings along with it.

I am proudly authoritarian, for example.
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Some of my beliefs are considered authoritarian so I know what your saying.

For instance, I'm staunchly against universal voting rights, to the extent that I want them severely regulated.
 
Scarecrow Akhbar said:
Waterboarding isn't torture.



Not one single American voted for Obama. A lot of US citizens did.

There's a difference.

American's aren't socialists.


The people that voted for Obama may think they're American, but since they don't recognize the American values of self-reliance, freedom, and justice, they're not Americans.
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I'm an American and a socialist as well. the problem with Obama is that he is not a socialist but he is a fine president anyway. You may want to look up the difference between social programs and a socialistic government. Has Obama asked you for all the land yet? I don't think he will so he is not a socialist. Thanks
 
Inferno said:
I'm an American and a socialist as well. the problem with Obama is that he is not a socialist but he is a fine president anyway. You may want to look up the difference between social programs and a socialistic government. Has Obama asked you for all the land yet? I don't think he will so he is not a socialist. Thanks
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Last I heard, he was a socialist AND a fascist. Neat trick!
 
the problem with Obama is that he is not a socialist but he is a fine president anyway.
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How is he a "fine president"? Most of his administration's fiscal policies are going to be devastating to the economy, to the point where they could be (probably will be) irreversible.
 
The Jovial One said:
Not one American voted for Obama?
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Wow. My parrot doesn't learn that fast. How'd you teach yours to catch on so quick?

Not.

One.

American.

Voted.

For.

Obama.

The logical corollary is, thereforre, that people who voted for Obama weren't Americans. As I pointed out, already, they may have been US citizens, but that doesn't make them Americans.
 
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