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Thread: World's Happiest Places

  1. #41
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Lol Firstly, I want to say that I was actually just using this thread to talk about my whole idea of happiness in the world, and not exactly... the list of developed nations. :P

    But some of it still is important because the socialist nations on the list seem to be happier then more capitalist nations. (besides Australia, which has a "free-er" economy then we de according to the heritage institute though )

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Disagree. Feudalism is capitalism light. Only real difference between feudalism and capitalism is more inclusion of the masses. They still strive for the same thing, the acquirement of wealth and power and if they can prevent others in getting it, then they will do so. Nobles did that by keeping people dumb and driving the fear of god in the, today's capitalist use poverty to keep people in their place. No difference.
    I consider capitalism to be people who invest their money in mass amounts to try and expand their capital. However in feudalism, the nobles just wasted all of their money on dumb ass castles and stuff like that.

    The system was very different. No capital was really accumulated.

    Okay, but the whole discussion was about OECD "happiness" and no 3rd world country is in the OECD.
    Yeah, yeah...

    Yes and no. It is the economic growth of the 1st world that is putting money in the poor countries.
    EXACTLY! therefore if rich nations were more capitalist then they would get more money to invest in the poor!

    You can disagree with the rich nations sacrificing the standard of living of their poor, to help even poorer people, but I think you agree with the whole mechanism im talking about.

    However saying that, there are many other factors that keep these countries poor, usually political instability. It is ironic that the reason many poor countries are poor, is lack of transparency and accountability among the political and economic elite plus the political instability that comes from that.
    Those are other factors that aren't related to the capitalist/socialist debate.


    Not exactly factual and a bad example to be honest. Singapore's standard of living is high due to a dictatorship that forced through reforms for the majority and did not like normal dictators syphon off that much for themselves. While the standard of living in Singapore has gone up considerably, there are minorities that live in relative poverty there. You could say the same for Japan btw, however even here "capitalism" has been diluted by ancient political and social aspects, so even here capitalism cant be given the whole reason for the economic prosperity. The only place I would claim that capitalism has had an impact is in the US, and even here the economic benefits of capitalism it self have not given a financial gain for all.. aka the income inequality.
    Of course Singapore has problems, but because of their capitalism they are better off then nations that were more socialist. That is one of my only points. Capitalism helps poor nations get a higher standard of living.

    I also fine wealth inequality not bad by itself. Because the only thing that really matters if the standard of living of the poor. If the rich get $10 for the poor to get $2, that is better then the rich and poor both getting $1. Capitalism is the first one in the long run of course.

    No it aint hard to define poverty. Agreeing on a definition is another matter and comparing between countries is a whole other matter. Poverty in my opinion should always be taken in context to what you are comparing. If you are comparing poverty in the US then yes there are people who are poor. Now if you compare these people to say people in Darfur, then financially no they are not poor, but you still find people in the US and Europe that go to bed hungry because they can not afford food. That is poverty too.



    Whole other discussion
    How in the world can you can say that people in Darfur aren't poor!

    You seem to have a different definition of poor. I consider poor to be when people have a low standard of living. I think you consider it to be low wealth compared to others. I just dont see the inherent problem with what you may think poor is.


    Yes, people in America and Europe go to bed hungry, but we shouldn't sacrifice the poor around the world, for the SEMI poor in developed nations.


    Your first priority can either be poor in your own nation, or poor around the world. we should focus on helping the most needy. And capitalism does that.
    Last edited by nerv14; 05-11-09 at 01:34 PM.

  2. #42
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by dclxvinoise View Post
    How exactly is it crap? You've yet to show that.

    All you've done thus far is complain because you think that the study isn't relevant and that you don't think it is breaking news. Perhaps you should let the mods be the judge of that and instead of trying to derail the thread with your complaints, actually discuss it or keep your opinions to yourself.

    I know..I'm expecting too much.
    What a shocker that you would not comprehend your perceptions of anger and hyperbolic bloviating about others anger and arrogance isn't just that.

    Once again you blather about complaints without any concept of what a complaint is; read your own threads. They contain nothing else but whiney complaints about everyone else.

    Do you honestly think that anyone, me included, cares that the US isn't on the list of "happiness?" Do you REALLY?

    Do you REALLY think that it makes someone like me angry? REALLY?

    A large piece of glass could not be more transparent than your whiney diatribes. Yet as is typical of your whiney babble, you offer NOTHING to support your typically empty headed hyperbole and blather. I am hardly surprised, but what really amazes me is that you actually think you add ANYTHING substantive to any thread you enter and blather with your whiney hyperbolic nonsense.

    It defiantly would be expecting too much to expect you to just shut up unless you have something substantive to say; whining about perceptions of anger and arrogance from those you politically disagree with really isnít substance; get a freaking clue already.

    Good lord, if the OBVIOUS walked up and smacked you in your head, you would claim it was an angry arrogant attempt to wake you out of this obvious stupor you wallow in.

    Do you want to know what REALLY makes me angry? It is IGNORANCE.

  3. #43
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    What a shocker that you would not comprehend your perceptions of anger and hyperbolic bloviating about others anger and arrogance isn't just that.
    Hmm...nope. There's nothing in there that appropriately addresses anything that I said.

    Once again you blather about complaints without any concept of what a complaint is; read your own threads. They contain nothing else but whiney complaints about everyone else.
    Nope. Nothing there either.

    Do you honestly think that anyone, me included, cares that the US isn't on the list of "happiness?" Do you REALLY?
    I think that there are others that care. I think you, however just like to stir crap up with people on the left on a regular basis.

    Do you REALLY think that it makes someone like me angry? REALLY?
    Who's the one foaming at the mouth here?

    A large piece of glass could not be more transparent than your whiney diatribes. Yet as is typical of your whiney babble, you offer NOTHING to support your typically empty headed hyperbole and blather. I am hardly surprised, but what really amazes me is that you actually think you add ANYTHING substantive to any thread you enter and blather with your whiney hyperbolic nonsense.
    Nothing relevant. Just insults.

    It defiantly would be expecting too much to expect you to just shut up unless you have something substantive to say; whining about perceptions of anger and arrogance from those you politically disagree with really isnít substance; get a freaking clue already.


    Good lord, if the OBVIOUS walked up and smacked you in your head, you would claim it was an angry arrogant attempt to wake you out of this obvious stupor you wallow in.
    More insults. Still nothing relevant.
    Do you want to know what REALLY makes me angry? It is IGNORANCE.
    Dude, come on. You could have at least put even a sliver of relevance in that post. It was certainly long enough.
    Last edited by Dr_Patrick; 05-11-09 at 01:54 PM.

  4. #44
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    the ten happiest nations in the world are:

    1. Denmark
    2. Finland
    3. Netherlands
    4. Sweden
    5. Ireland
    6. Canada
    7. Switzerland
    8. New Zealand
    9. Norway
    10. Belgium
    Wessexman is right when he quotes "family, social and community networks" as major factors. I also agree a certain level of social contract regarding health, work and social care as mentioned by others.

    I would just add that many of the same countries also came out highly on the UN Child Wellbeing report 4-5 years ago. These were all countries which allowed children equal access as standard with both parents after divorce. UK and France came pretty low on those lists too - I beleive it's not just working conditions that make people happy but how the lawmakers view people's lives and how they treat each other outside work.

  5. #45
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    I am constantly fascinated by farcical arguments like this where NO facts are available to support them.

    First off, there is no one slipping through the healthcare crack in the US. It is even MANDATORY that health clinics and hospitals give ILLEGAL aliens care if they come in and here in California, have to provide someone who can interpret Spanish.

    Secondly, the notion that it is the Governments job to confiscate someone else's hard earned wealth and RE-DISTRIBUTE it is a Communistic notion that can only be expressed by those who have been bullschitted by the educational system and their Governments that this is the most efficient way of caring for the poor.

    Its stunning to me that anyone with a Jr. College level education can even think that Government is the answer and that it is okay to STEAL from someone and give it to someone else.

    The EU and Canada are suffering from the weight of their own largess and finding it harder and harder to support their Socialist programs. Canadians have to wait some times over a month just to see a doctor for something as simple as acid reflux; yet here in this country we can get that same care today.

    The nationís families and PEOPLE have always done a much better job caring for themelves and making decision for themselves with MORE choice, and with competition, competitive prices than any other form of Government in the world. We just need Government to do TWO things to enable us to prosper; (1) defend the nation from its enemies; and (2) administer its laws. Everything else is nothing more than wasteful pandering to ignorant voters who think they can get something for nothing and create a dependent class of citizens who suckle off the Government teat at others expense and hard work.
    I think the level of happiness can be measured by the number of illegals that come and stay; or the number of people that seek to enter said country, and/or want to leave.

    .


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    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

  6. #46
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    I think the level of happiness can be measured by the number of illegals that come and stay; or the number of people that seek to enter said country, and/or want to leave.

    .


    .
    I think that's a horrible argument.

    People around the Great Lakes, as Vonnegut would say, are not some of the happiest people for no reason. The family structure, being able to stay away from that pesky spouse and drink beer/appletinis/ with family/friends.

    I think happiness also comes from hard work. You know, after you get done running six miles, you sit down and feel satisfied with yourself. You finish a 40 page portfolio piece, without having to kill yourself, and you feel satisfied with yourself-- That's how I try to stay happy.

    All the illegal immigrants i've come into contact with have not depressed me or stopped me from happiness, and I live in an immigrant enriched environment.
    "I do not underestimate the ability of fanatical groups of terrorists to kill and destroy, but they do not threaten the life of the nation. Whether we would survive Hitler hung in the balance, but there is no doubt that we shall survive al-Qa'ida." -- Lord Hoffmann

  7. #47
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    I think this thread is begging for a point. Could you help me with what is the point of such studies and why they are even relevant?
    Well, such studies seem useful to me because if one can identify what nations consider themselves the happiest (e.g. Scandinavian and Central American nations) and what nations consider themselves the unhappiest (e.g. Eastern Europe, UK, France), then one can try to figure out what, if anything, the happy nations have in common that the unhappy nations don't. Geography? Climate? Family structure? Religion? Education? Work-related issues? Ethnic homogeneity? Economic system? Political system? Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector
    Nations can't be happy.
    When I say "the happiest nations," it's shorthand for "the nations where the highest percentage of people consider themselves happy."
    Last edited by Kandahar; 05-11-09 at 06:03 PM.
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  8. #48
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by Glinda View Post
    This is only slightly off topic, but I think about it often and wonder if it might have some impact on "national happiness."

    My folks have a friend that was born and raised in Sweden. He lived there until about 20 years ago, then moved to the US. I don't know the specifics of it, but the man (and others just like him) gets some kind of lifetime income from Sweden - not a disability thing, just money for being a (former) citizen. He's in his 70s now and will continue getting money from the Swedish government until he dies.

    Now, I can't speak for everyone, but if I got a monthly check from the government just for having been born here, I'd be pretty happy too. Wouldn't you?
    Not necessarily, unless there was some specific reason that getting the check made me happy. I really don't see how money can buy happiness (although a lack of money can cause unhappiness). People quickly adjust their lifestyles and their expectations to their new level of income.
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  9. #49
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    Why is it that if someone believes a poll like this is obvious BS crapola, they are automatically arrogant and angry in your view? Do you ever get tired of such hyperbolic bloviating?
    Uhh well I was thinking the same thing he was, when I read your post. I don't understand why you are getting so angry and defensive about this thread...unless, of course, you are pissed off that the United States was not at the top of the list.

    I didn't start this thread with any political agenda in mind. I merely asked a question. It's not as though Forbes Magazine is a bastion of left-wing politics eager to usher in a new era of Marxism. Besides, while it's true that some nations with larger safety nets rank higher than nations without them (e.g. Finland vs the United Kingdom), the reverse is also true (e.g. Canada vs France). Many surveys I've seen indicate that the United States is a middle-of-the-road country in terms of happiness. So I'm completely bewildered by your response.

    I was merely asking what you think causes nations to be happy or unhappy. The fact that YOU somehow interpreted it as an attack indicates that you are defensive about something. What are you so upset about?
    Last edited by Kandahar; 05-11-09 at 05:58 PM.
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  10. #50
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    Re: World's Happiest Places

    When I say "the happiest nations," it's shorthand for "the nations where the highest percentage of people consider themselves happy."
    Then we're essentially discussing what makes people happy. I'd say doing as little as possible and recieving the most in return is what makes most people happy.

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