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Thread: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

  1. #61
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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    My concern is that there is an obvious lack of clarity in the rules, otherwise there would not be all this debate about the legality of what was done. Those who are tasked with implementing policy deserve some clarity, so that they can know, with confidence, that what they are doing is legal. In other words, we need to protect our soldiers and intelligence people from the rats in public office.
    The "lack of clarity" is endemic to the situation--which is basically war.

    It's called "the fog of war" for a damn good reason--war is at best an imprecise and muddled business. Decisions are made on the basis of imperfect knowledge and imperfect understanding. There is a great deal of guesswork in war. Thus it is the "art" of war and not the "science" of war.

    We will not have "clarity" in the conduct of war--not today, and most assuredly not tomorrow. We should not be offended at the lack of clarity from yesterday.

    The only real "war crime" is losing. Everything after that is a question of how much carnage can you stomach.

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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    My concern is that there is an obvious lack of clarity in the rules, otherwise there would not be all this debate about the legality of what was done. Those who are tasked with implementing policy deserve some clarity, so that they can know, with confidence, that what they are doing is legal. In other words, we need to protect our soldiers and intelligence people from the rats in public office.
    The rules change with time. That was the point I was making.

    As for legal definitions, they obtained those from the DOJ and now Obama wants to crucify the DOJ lawyers for doing what lawyers do, providing opinions on the meaning of laws.

    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by celticlord View Post
    The "lack of clarity" is endemic to the situation--which is basically war.

    It's called "the fog of war" for a damn good reason--war is at best an imprecise and muddled business. Decisions are made on the basis of imperfect knowledge and imperfect understanding. There is a great deal of guesswork in war. Thus it is the "art" of war and not the "science" of war.

    We will not have "clarity" in the conduct of war--not today, and most assuredly not tomorrow. We should not be offended at the lack of clarity from yesterday.

    The only real "war crime" is losing. Everything after that is a question of how much carnage can you stomach.
    Absolute clarity is an obvious pipe dream, but better clarity is possible, and a worthwhile goal.

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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    The rules change with time. That was the point I was making.

    As for legal definitions, they obtained those from the DOJ and now Obama wants to crucify the DOJ lawyers for doing what lawyers do, providing opinions on the meaning of laws.
    To the best of my knowledge, Obama has resisted any calls to prosecute any one over this.

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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    As for legal definitions, they obtained those from the DOJ
    nah... they got those from the law as well as the ethics rules that attorneys swear to uphold.

    and now Obama wants to crucify the DOJ lawyers for doing what lawyers do, providing opinions on the meaning of laws.
    nah again. Holder, not Obama, has a legal obligation as Attorney General to pursue and report those lawyers for breaking the law and for breaking their vow to uphold the law. Those lawyers did not simply "provide opinions". They sculpted advice and memos meant to advise their client that they could break the law when those lawyers knew very well that what they were saying was legal... was in fact very illegal.

    If this was so cut and dry, as the right wingers are trying to portray, there wouldn't be so much lobbying going on to save their sorry asses.
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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by Triad View Post
    Pelosi lied and its documented.
    Prove it.

    I have read nothing that states what you seem to assume was said to her. All the assumptions of what went on behind closed doors holds water like a steel sieve.
    Thank You Barack Obama for Restoring Honor To The Presidency.
    President Obama will rank as one of our greatest presidents!

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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Prove she lied?

    Read the thread.

    ...

    Put it this way..
    For years now she has been spewing the same rhetoric you have. Difference is the documented facts of the situation make it clear she was knowingly lying while doing it.

    You have the blessing of nobody caring and your opinion being mostly irrelevant outside your lil box (iow you can lie..who cares?)..she doesn't get that.
    She is the Speaker of the House! She is expected to uphold a standard of conduct. She didn't uphold it at all... in fact she destroyed it.
    She has no business remaining speaker and little business remaining in office.
    Last edited by Triad; 05-11-09 at 06:30 PM.

  8. #68
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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'B

    To be fair the Speaker is 69 years old and at that age dementia is a sad but real problem for many of that advanced age.
    So let us revue her ever changing story so far. Paraphrasing her own words.
    1. "Waterboarding yes I'm familiar with that it's like surfing, only behind a boat, isn't it".
    2. "Enhanced Interrogations, of course, yes I'm always in favor of enhancement of any kind just look at my face & hair".
    3. "Torture? Torture! When did that happen"?
    4. "Are you saying that Waterboarding is some kind of torture? Oh My GOD no"!
    5. "Oh a briefing by the CIA, on Enhanced Interrogations that included Waterboarding. No I never heard of it"
    6. "You mean the briefing my aid attended? I was never told about that until just this minute, sorry"?
    7. "Yes I 'concurred' with Rep. Jane Harman's 2003 letter protesting the use of Waterboarding. But I can't say for sure I knew what it was about at the time. I may have thought it meant they were taking prisoners to a local lake or something".
    I may have some of the facts out of place and or context or even wrong, but cut me some slack I'm practicing to be as accurate as the Speaker and her defenders have been on this subject all along.



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    Last edited by Councilman; 05-12-09 at 08:38 AM.

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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by ADK_Forever View Post
    nah... they got those from the law as well as the ethics rules that attorneys swear to uphold.



    nah again. Holder, not Obama, has a legal obligation as Attorney General to pursue and report those lawyers for breaking the law and for breaking their vow to uphold the law. Those lawyers did not simply "provide opinions". They sculpted advice and memos meant to advise their client that they could break the law when those lawyers knew very well that what they were saying was legal... was in fact very illegal.

    If this was so cut and dry, as the right wingers are trying to portray, there wouldn't be so much lobbying going on to save their sorry asses.
    All I can say to your partisan diatribe is have another swig. After that load of crap you must be thirsty.....



    • "The America Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." -- Alexis de Tocqueville





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    Re: CIA Says Pelosi Was Briefed on Use of 'Enhanced Interrogations'

    Quote Originally Posted by Indy View Post
    Um, you somehow are confusing ONE member of the party from the house, the most extreme wing of the gov't, with that of the entire movement. Surely you can be honest with all of us an admit that you've seen democrats on here time and time again calling for her to be defeated or to resign. Tell me, how often does that happen on the other side of the fence?

    BTW adding to your post doesn't give you any more credibility, and without proper use it just looks arrogant.



    Isn't she the leader in the house?


    (I added "" to my post because the Good Reverend IS rightfully so, arrogant. )
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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