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Thread: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

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    Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    1) Illegal aliens use fake ID inside the US.

    2) Supreme Court rules that illegal aliens cannot be prosecuted for ID theft.

    I do not understand this ruling, which says that the illegal alien had to be aware that his fake ID was coming from another person. Fake ID's have to come from somewhere. Otherwise, there would no Social Security record of his existence, and he would be caught. That is why fake ID's are typically made by stealing the good ID's of real people. So an illegal alien is not supposed to understand that, when he got his fake ID, he was stealing someone else's identity? BS - Ignorance of the law is no excuse. But since illegal aliens broke the law when they crossed the border, what makes you think that they would respect the law at all?

    I am very disappointed with the court's decision.

    Article is here.

    NOTE: I think I will carry some weed with me wherever I go, then when I get caught, just say "I didn't know that was weed". That ought to get me off the hook. If it doesn't, I will just appeal to my good friends, the Supreme Court.
    Last edited by danarhea; 05-04-09 at 07:24 PM.
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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    1) Illegal aliens use fake ID inside the US.

    2) Supreme Court rules that illegal aliens cannot be prosecuted for ID theft.

    I do not understand this ruling, which says that the illegal alien had to be aware that his fake ID was coming from another person. Fake ID's have to come from somewhere. Otherwise, there would no Social Security record of his existence, and he would be caught. That is why fake ID's are typically made by stealing the good ID's of real people. So an illegal alien is not supposed to understand that, when he got his fake ID, he was stealing someone else's identity? BS - Ignorance of the law is no excuse. But since illegal aliens broke the law when they crossed the border, what makes you think that they would respect the law at all?

    I am very disappointed with the court's decision.

    Article is here.

    NOTE: I think I will carry some weed with me wherever I go, then when I get caught, just say "I didn't know that was weed". That ought to get me off the hook. If it doesn't, I will just appeal to my good friends, the Supreme Court.
    No, many (if not most) fake social security numbers are just completely made up. The people who use them won't be getting a tax refund, but a random number is usually sufficient for a job application.
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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    1) Illegal aliens use fake ID inside the US.

    2) Supreme Court rules that illegal aliens cannot be prosecuted for ID theft.
    I cannot perceive of any way that being in a country illegally should make you immune from any law of that country. I am just absolutely blown away by this.

    Oh, ok, here it is:

    The ruling in Flores-Figueroa v. United States, No. 08-108, was written by Justice Stephen G. Breyer and relied heavily on the wording of the statute, specifically its language regarding when a defendant can be properly accused of “knowingly” and unlawfully using another person’s identification.
    I guess I can see that. it's not being an illegal alien that makes them immune, any one who does not know that their ID is stolen is safe. Still stupid, but the problem is with the law itself, not the SCOTUS decision.

    Guess I should start reading the article before I start posting.

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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    No, many (if not most) fake social security numbers are just completely made up. The people who use them won't be getting a tax refund, but a random number is usually sufficient for a job application.
    OK, if the numbers are made up, then let's see how far you get using the fake Social Security to get a driver's license or state ID. Many illegals have them, and the government DOES check out Social Security cards against a data base before issuing an ID card.
    Last edited by danarhea; 05-04-09 at 07:45 PM.
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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    OK, if the numbers are made up, then let's see how far you get using the fake Social Security to get a driver's license or state ID. Many illegals have them, and the government DOES check out Social Security cards against a data base before issuing an ID card.
    Right, the GOVERNMENT (sometimes) checks them when you apply for some kind of ID. But a lot of employers don't check them when you apply for a job. And that's generally what the fake social security numbers are used for.

    The Court is correct in this case. Proving identity theft should require evidence that the defendant KNOWINGLY harmed someone else (hence the "theft" part of identity theft). Writing down a random number that happens to be someone else's SSN# is just bad luck.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 05-04-09 at 07:49 PM.
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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    I agree with the court. Identity theft should require proof that you actually intended to steal someone elses identity. However, knowingly using a fake SSN number should be a crime of its own. Prosecution should still happen, just not for ID theft.

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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    Quote Originally Posted by rathi View Post
    I agree with the court. Identity theft should require proof that you actually intended to steal someone elses identity. However, knowingly using a fake SSN number should be a crime of its own. Prosecution should still happen, just not for ID theft.
    Now I disagree with that. If you engage in an activity that could result in you breaking the law, you should be punished if you do. The whole reason the law was overturned was the wording of the law, which stated that the person had to know they where stealing an identity.

    The simple solution as I see it is to change the wording of the law to take away the wording that the defendant has to knowingly be stealing an identity. Though, wouldn't it be cheaper just to ship illegal aliens back to their native country than to prosecute and jail them? I hate to spend more money than absolutely necessary on illegals.

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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    Another example of a prosecutor going after a criminal for the wrong crime! Idiot!

    Why charge "Aggravated Identity Theft"???
    Last edited by ADK_Forever; 05-04-09 at 08:12 PM.
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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Right, the GOVERNMENT (sometimes) checks them when you apply for some kind of ID. But a lot of employers don't check them when you apply for a job. And that's generally what the fake social security numbers are used for.

    The Court is correct in this case. Proving identity theft should require evidence that the defendant KNOWINGLY harmed someone else (hence the "theft" part of identity theft). Writing down a random number that happens to be someone else's SSN# is just bad luck.
    What happened to ignorance of the law is no excuse?
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    Re: Supreme Court Rules Against Government in Identity-Theft Case

    So when it came to Identity Theft, there wasn't really any intentional identity theft going on.

    He was only an illegal immigrant, not a identity theft con-artist.

    Am I getting this right?
    Last edited by Lightdemon; 05-04-09 at 08:17 PM.
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