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Religious tend to support torture more often

talloulou said:
Sure it can be, but it is not necessary.
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All things being equal, it must be.

It's only unnecessary if all things are NOT equal, and some other agent of socialization has risen to fulfill the void.

talloulou said:
To say I have an underdeveloped moral compass because I'm irreligious is unvalidated rot.
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I haven't made any claim about you.

talloulou said:
Then that assertion should be easy to prove. Go ahead, support the claim.
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The OP itself is evidence.

When asked for an alternative rational, you offered only mental disorder, and your argument was dismantled.

I invite you again to offer an alternative reasoning for the findings of the poll, and strongly suggest that you STOP personalizing the arguments you read.
 
Jerry said:
All things being equal, it must be.

It's only unnecessary if all things are NOT equal, and some other agent of socialization has risen to fulfill the void.



I haven't made any claim about you.



The OP itself is evidence.

When asked for an alternative rational, you offered only mental disorder, and your argument was dismantled.

I invite you again to offer an alternative reasoning for the findings of the poll, and strongly suggest that you STOP personalizing the arguments you read.
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This is untrue. My mental illness argument was offered ONLY as a counter to your claim that the religious have more ethically sound minds.

To the poll I offered one and only one argument and that was that conservatives are more likely to not see waterboarding and other things as unacceptable forms of torture. Religious folks are overwhelmingly conservative and people are sheep. So as the party blowhards go on tv and mock waterboarding the sheeple follow along. Now that's not to say that there aren't conservatives who researched it, thought about it deeply, and arrived at the same conclusion as the loudest blowhards on the right. However it's easy to see why the religious more often support torture, it's because conservatives more often support torture. I don't think God has anything to do with it. Just like more ice cream being sold in July in the US has nothing to do with the month of July and everything to do with the weather here in July. Somewhere else it might be cold in July and icecream sales are down. So July is not the cause of higher ice cream sales. Make sense?
 
Just curious, I wonder what would happen if I started a thread "Athiests/non-believers commit crimes more often".....

;)

Just sayin
 
Truth Detector said:
The presumption that Communists are NOT atheists requires a stunning level ignorance. What part of the Communist manifesto regarding religion do you NOT comprehend?
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He asked someone to prove that the killings were done in the name of atheism. Please do so or rescind your ad homs.
 
Quote:Originally Posted by Truth Detector
The presumption that Communists are NOT atheists requires a stunning level ignorance. What part of the Communist manifesto regarding religion do you NOT comprehend?
EgoffTib said:
He asked someone to prove that the killings were done in the name of atheism. Please do so or rescind your ad homs.
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So you believe that a clever play on words is a substitute for honest debate?
 
Truth Detector said:
So you believe that a clever play on words is a substitute for honest debate?
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Deflection noted. Feel free to support the argument that Stalin, Mao, etc. killed people in the name of atheism. I won't hold my breath.
 
EgoffTib said:
It would probably be incorrect. How much of the prison population is religious? :mrgreen:
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Um...having some experience with the prison system, I would say that most convicts GET religion sometime between arrest and trial...and that 90% of the them lose it again about four days after getting released.

G.
 
Goshin said:
Um...having some experience with the prison system, I would say that most convicts GET religion sometime between arrest and trial...and that 90% of the them lose it again about four days after getting released.

G.
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Hence the smiley in my post!
 
EgoffTib said:
He asked someone to prove that the killings were done in the name of atheism. Please do so or rescind your ad homs.
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They were done in the name of Atheistic, social engineering and attempts to completely uproot past social structures and belief systems.
 
Goshin said:
Um...having some experience with the prison system, I would say that most convicts GET religion sometime between arrest and trial...and that 90% of the them lose it again about four days after getting released.

G.
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BTW, the religion that most prisoners are getting these days, by far, is Islam. Mostly of the Louis Farrkhan variety.

Just sayin'.
 
Goshin said:
BTW, the religion that most prisoners are getting these days, by far, is Islam. Mostly of the Louis Farrkhan variety.

Just sayin'.
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I don't think that is true. Most converts in prison are of the Christian variety as they have a huge presence in prisons around the country. Support programs etc.
 
Wessexman said:
They were done in the name of Atheistic, social engineering and attempts to completely uproot past social structures and belief systems.
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Again, please support your claim. I'm not asking for much.
 
EgoffTib said:
Again, please support your claim. I'm not asking for much.
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Asking someone to re-hash history is hardly a substitute for coherent debate; you continue to obfuscate and avoid the OBVIOUS.

In other words, your feigning to be ignorant of the events leading to the take over of the Russian Government by the Communists and their subsequent pogroms and murders is disingenuous.
:roll:
 
Truth Detector said:
Asking someone to re-hash history is hardly a substitute for coherent debate; you continue to obfuscate and avoid the OBVIOUS.

In other words, your feigning to be ignorant of the events leading to the take over of the Russian Government by the Communists and their subsequent pogroms and murders is disingenuous.
:roll:
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I wonder how many were killed under the Czars
 
Truth Detector said:
I am hardly surprised you would read “life” from lives” and would feel compelled to ask the OBVIOUS based on your incoherent rants displayed in this thread.
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:roll: could you be more trite?

"Innocent lives" equates to the people who were working in the World Trade Center who were murdered by desperate terrorists whom people like you appear to defend, for no other reason than they were Americans.
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But you don't give 2 ****es about the 10s of thousands of innocent lives wasted in Iraq... funny how that works out.

I find your desperate rhetoric specious in that you presume to suggest that these murderous thugs even had a reason to do what they do. You keep referring to OUR actions as if these thugs even need a reason to conduct their murder and terror, other than we are Americans and not Muslim.
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I find your desperate rhetoric specious in that you presume to suggest that these murderous thugs just woke up one morning and decided, for no reason to get together and kill some Americans by hijacking a few planes... give me a break, the intellectual dishonesty is strong in this one.
Hmm... I'd never heard that they want to kill us because we are Americans... I thought it was because they hate our freedom?

There are plenty of xians who hate muslims simply because they are muslim. Why don't they go fly a plane into a mosque? Lack of religious conviction? I mean, you gotta hand it to the jihadists, that do have religious conviction... As far as I can tell, that and liberalization of xianty... You can thank the liberal mind for for that change in aggressive attitude in xianity.

You’re profound only in your own mind, but your arguments suggest someone who has little information, is historically ignorant and most likely to operate on an emotional level rather than intellectual.
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You’re profound only in your own mind, but your arguments suggest someone who has little information, is historically ignorant and most likely to operate on an emotional level rather than intellectual.
 
Truth Detector said:
The presumption that Communists are NOT atheists requires a stunning level ignorance. What part of the Communist manifesto regarding religion do you NOT comprehend?
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I'm not sure if it's your ignorance or your intellectual dishonesty that knows no bounds...

The fact is Atheism itself isn't a principle, cause, philosophy, or belief system which people fight, die, or kill for. Being killed by an atheist is no more being killed in the name of atheism than being killed by a tall person is being killed in the name of tallness.

People were killed in communist nations for a lot of different reasons. Some were communists who disagreed with those in power and were killed because of that. Some were anti-communists and opposed the government and were killed for that. Some were simply in the way or inconvenient and were killed for that. These are political disagreements that people were being killed over, not murder in the name of atheism. Communists typically regarded religious organizations as a hinderance towards the creation of a worker's paradise. Even if some people were killed simply because they followed a religion, that doesn't mean they were killed in the name of atheism.

To further illustrate this point, take the Inquisition, how many people were killed during the Inquisition in the name of theism? None. Those doing the killing acted not because of theism, but rather because of xian doctrines.

Communism is not, inherently atheistic. It is possible to hold communist or socialist economic views while being a theist and it isn't at all uncommon to be an atheist while staunchly defending capitalism. Their existence alone demonstrates, without question, that atheism and communism are not the same thing.

Perhaps it's Christianity which is inherently communistic? After all, there is nothing in the gospels which even so much as suggests a divine preference for capitalism. On the contrary, quite a bit of what Jesus said directly supports many of the emotional foundations of socialism and even communism. He specifically said that people should give all they could to the poor and that "it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God."

Do you think that these mass killings could have occurred in a Democracy? Do you honestly want to argue that the Nazi’s were the result of democratic processes?
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Sure, I'll argue that with you, you start.

What mass killings are you referring to? Could you provide examples of the mass killings, as in, -on X date, in X country/city etc. X number of people were killed by communist forces.

Chapter 11: Communism and Religion
§ 89. Why religion and communism are incompatibleNikolai Bukharin and Evgenii Preobrazhensky: The ABC of Communism - Chapter XI : Communism and Religion
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Nonsense, as I've already shown above.
 
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jallman said:
You learned nothing in all that time because Catholic charities, by and large, do not involve proselytizing at all.

But you can keep lying about your experiences if you want to do so. It wouldn't be much of a deviation from anything else you spew.
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"Catholic charities, by and large, do not involve proselytizing at all."
Meaning that sometimes they do. :2wave: you can try to paint xianity with your fantasy but history is rather available in this area. :roll:
 
Wessexman said:
They did it as part of Atheistic social engineering and an attack on the traditional belief structures of their nations.
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No, it was political social engineering. Religion was attacked to usurp the power the church held and to exploit the inherent nature of the religious.
 
cherokee said:
Extreme patriotism? You're goddamn right!
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Most intelligent people can agree that extremes are dangerous.

Yes they are. Just like your family is more important to you then mine.
So is it a ****ing crime to love MY country now? .......:roll:

**** off slick.
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Awww, are you gonna kick the dog now too? Hey, Mr. tantrum, please quote where I said it's a crime to love your country.

Being preferential to ones own family is a moon shot away from - the lives of people who weren't born in my country are of less value -.

There's a good reason why Marine infantry are called Jarheads. :doh Now get back in the intellectual kiddy pool before you go under again.
 
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