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Thread: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    First off then, we had a world war that was being fought in trenches. The flu hit the troops very hard due to the conditions and many historians and experts actually say that the Spanish flu had more to do with the German surrender than anything else. These troops were sent to the rear when sick, which spread the flu even more.
    World War I was mostly fought in Europe, yet the flu pandemic afflicted the entire world.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU
    Secondly our understanding of the flu was no where near as good as it is today. Back then we did not know how it was spread for one.
    Yes we did. We just couldn't stop it. Likewise, it's unlikely that we would be able to contain a pandemic today...we aren't even able to contain the normal seasonal flu outbreaks.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU
    Thirdly back then we did not have any medicine to combat flu. We do today.
    This is true. Tamiflu helps treat the symptoms, and there should be a vaccine within a few months. However, it may not be soon enough to contain it, and even with those things there could still be a lot of fatalities from a bona fide pandemic.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU
    And finally, sanitation back then was no where near as good as it is today. Most houses did not have indoor plumbing and such back then.
    Plumbing is not really a big factor in whether or not the flu spreads. Granted, we have hand soap nowadays...but most people don't use it as much as they should anyway. Additionally, we have a lot more people working in closed office spaces today where they can catch it from one another.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU
    There are more differences of course, but those are the key differences that will probably mean that this new swine flu will be no where near as bad as the Spanish flu of 1918.
    I think this is a false comfort. The main reason that we haven't yet seen an outbreak as bad as the 1918 pandemic is that we have just been lucky.
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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    World War I was mostly fought in Europe, yet the flu pandemic afflicted the entire world.
    And? Having millions of men in dirty wet ditches filled with rats dont help the situation does it now? And when those sick men are sent to the rear of the line, among population centres, then it does not help either does it now? When US troops or just normal people get on big steamliners and travel to the US, and get sick, that does not help either does it?

    Yes we did. We just couldn't stop it. Likewise, it's unlikely that we would be able to contain a pandemic today...we aren't even able to contain the normal seasonal flu outbreaks.
    No we did not understand flu then especially compared to today.

    This is true. Tamiflu helps treat the symptoms, and there should be a vaccine within a few months. However, it may not be soon enough to contain it, and even with those things there could still be a lot of fatalities from a bona fide pandemic.
    Containment is near impossible. Lessening the spread is our only option. Travel bans, prevention, quarantine and so on is the only way.

    Plumbing is not really a big factor in whether or not the flu spreads. Granted, we have hand soap nowadays...but most people don't use it as much as they should anyway. Additionally, we have a lot more people working in closed office spaces today where they can catch it from one another.
    Of course it does. People have to go to the bathroom. If you have to share it with 40+ other people, in insanitary conditions, then yes it does matter. Touching the damn toilet door can get you infected for example. In fact the most common form of transmission is from door nobs, ATM machines and such, because people sneeze or cough into their hands but dont wash them right after.. or touch a surface, which then becomes a transplantation point for the next infected.

    I think this is a false comfort. The main reason that we haven't yet seen an outbreak as bad as the 1918 pandemic is that we have just been lucky.
    But we have seen outbreaks almost every decade since WW2. They have not been as bad as the 1918 one yes, but several 10s of thousands have died and even up to two million estimated in the 1957 Asian flu pandemic.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Speak for yourself, ape.
    Homo Sapiens are apes. Get use to it.

    You see what the Russians are doing. They're checking all American planes for swine flu, and banning imports of meat from Mexico and some US states.
    Which seems to be pretty standard these days. Basic precautions. The problem is, last we checked, we don't exactly know the gestation period.
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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Factors effecting the death rate in Mexico include poor sanitation, lower standards of health care generally than here, the pollution effects the immune system, and people wait till it's too late to go to the hospital. Also the closer you are to an outbreak the more virulent the stain. The facts so far do not indicate that this flu is any more deadly than we see every year when 35.000+ Americans and 250.000 people in the rest of the world die from the flu.
    It also has nothing what ever to do with the way animals a raised. It is being reported this is not really the Swine flu because it is a mutation of the H1N1 and H5N1 or bird flu and a human variant. It has also been said by two doctors it can not happen in nature by it's self. Pigs systems are very close to ours and it's therefore easy for pathogens to make the jump to humans.
    It's too early to be panicking people over it. Take steps to avoid contact with crowds wash your hands and look up other things you can do.

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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Enemy View Post
    the death toll could be 10% of the world's population.
    .
    Confine that to Washington DC and the flu may be beneficial to the US and the world in general.
    Thank you

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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    And? Having millions of men in dirty wet ditches filled with rats dont help the situation does it now? And when those sick men are sent to the rear of the line, among population centres, then it does not help either does it now? When US troops or just normal people get on big steamliners and travel to the US, and get sick, that does not help either does it?
    Jeez, buy The Great Influenza and figure it out. Almost all of the people who died from that bug weren't in the trenches. The trenches served as the incubator of a disease that apparently first showed in Kansas.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    No we did not understand flu then especially compared to today.
    We can't stop the spread of flu today.

    Hell, we couldn't stop the spread of a disease that required direct and intimate exchanges of bodily fluid. Good luck "stopping" the spread of a cough and sneeze driven pandemic.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Containment is near impossible. Lessening the spread is our only option. Travel bans, prevention, quarantine and so on is the only way.
    Weren't you the one that bitched at me for demanding the US seal the border with Mexico?

    No, you commented, but Kandahar made the obligatory leftist "You're a racist" remark. Never mind.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteEU View Post
    Of course it does. People have to go to the bathroom. If you have to share it with 40+ other people, in insanitary conditions, then yes it does matter. Touching the damn toilet door can get you infected for example. In fact the most common form of transmission is from door nobs, ATM machines and such, because people sneeze or cough into their hands but dont wash them right after.. or touch a surface, which then becomes a transplantation point for the next infected.
    I'm just going to have to stop licking doorknobs...

    Especially those touched by illegal invaders in my country.

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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Weren't you the one that bitched at me for demanding the US seal the border with Mexico?

    No, you commented, but Kandahar made the obligatory leftist "You're a racist" remark. Never mind.
    Sealing the border doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. The only reason you even brought it up was because you saw the word "Mexico" in the title of the thread and thought you could turn this into an excuse to bash immigrants.

    Is there any evidence at all that Mexican immigrants are responsible for the spread of the swine flu from Mexico City to anywhere else in the world? Or are you suggesting that "sealing the border" entails quarantining all American citizens within our borders?
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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Sealing the border doesn't make the slightest bit of sense. The only reason you even brought it up was because you saw the word "Mexico" in the title of the thread and thought you could turn this into an excuse to bash immigrants.

    Is there any evidence at all that Mexican immigrants are responsible for the spread of the swine flu from Mexico City to anywhere else in the world? Or are you suggesting that "sealing the border" entails quarantining all American citizens within our borders?
    The border ought to closed anyway.
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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarecrow Akhbar View Post
    Jeez, buy The Great Influenza and figure it out. Almost all of the people who died from that bug weren't in the trenches. The trenches served as the incubator of a disease that apparently first showed in Kansas.
    Never said that they were. All I stated was that the trenches of WW1 were a great place for the flu to spread fast and be devastating, which it was.

    We can't stop the spread of flu today.

    Hell, we couldn't stop the spread of a disease that required direct and intimate exchanges of bodily fluid. Good luck "stopping" the spread of a cough and sneeze driven pandemic.
    Never said we could.

    Weren't you the one that bitched at me for demanding the US seal the border with Mexico?

    No, you commented, but Kandahar made the obligatory leftist "You're a racist" remark. Never mind.
    Nope. In fact it might be a sensible thing to do, but I question how effective it would be. And there is a difference between saying they should close the boarder for medical reasons, than what you and others have stated... infected invaders, dirty people and whatnot. Your intent, as well as a few others, was very clear.. very anti illegal immigrant and very anti Mexican.

    I'm just going to have to stop licking doorknobs...

    Especially those touched by illegal invaders in my country.
    Where does it say "licking doorknobs"? You touch a doorknob, then later pick up a baggle without washing your hands, and congrats you are infected. And again you show your true colours.
    PeteEU

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    Re: Swine flu is worse in Mexico, but why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Councilman View Post
    Factors effecting the death rate in Mexico include poor sanitation, lower standards of health care generally than here, the pollution effects the immune system, and people wait till it's too late to go to the hospital. Also the closer you are to an outbreak the more virulent the stain. The facts so far do not indicate that this flu is any more deadly than we see every year when 35.000+ Americans and 250.000 people in the rest of the world die from the flu.
    It also has nothing what ever to do with the way animals a raised. It is being reported this is not really the Swine flu because it is a mutation of the H1N1 and H5N1 or bird flu and a human variant. It has also been said by two doctors it can not happen in nature by it's self. Pigs systems are very close to ours and it's therefore easy for pathogens to make the jump to humans.
    It's too early to be panicking people over it. Take steps to avoid contact with crowds wash your hands and look up other things you can do.
    Regardless of your opinions of the quality of Mexican sanitation, the fact is this epidemic began in a US owned hog farm in Mexico. So it could have started in the Hamptons, if that's where the hog farm was. Would you have cast dispersions on the sanitary habits of Hamptons residents? I suspect not.

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