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Thread: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style Attac

  1. #341
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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by Slippery Slope View Post
    I would say that the lack of specifics is enough evidence. If you don't come right out and say what people are asking, there's probably a reason.
    But the reason my not be what you are assuming it is.

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by Slippery Slope View Post
    Yes it is, it's faith of a sort. You have no evidence that it works yet you're willing to give it a try, just in case. Like prayer.
    Not really. Asking nicely is most definitely not going to work in the scenario I described. That would be akin to praying. Doing something you know won't work, but doing it anyway because you HOPE it'll work.

    Whereas cutting off a testicle and shoving it down his throat... Well, there is more of a chance that the simple threat of doing that might yield more results than asking nicely would.
    Last edited by Tucker Case; 04-28-09 at 05:37 PM.

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Not really. Asking nicely is most definitely not going to work in the scenario I described. That would be akin to praying. Doing something you know won't work, but doing it anyway because you HOPE it'll work.

    Whereas cutting off a testicle and shoving it down his throat... Well, there is more of a chance that the simple threat of doing that might yield more results than asking nicely would.
    Apparently the vast majority of intelligence agents disagree with that.

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    But the reason my not be what you are assuming it is.
    Or it may be exactly what I think it is. What I think it is, is more plausible than some other undisclosed reason.

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by Slippery Slope View Post
    What you seem to be saying Tucker is, that in a moment of desperation you would turn to desperate measures without the confidence that those measures would work. It's a bit like belief in god. Are you going to pray right before you torture someone just so you cover your bases?
    bad analogy

    Once you die there is no do over. You face either god, the devil, oblivion or whatever.

    If the intel is bad you just ask again. Who what where when type questions for the most part are easily verified. Thats all you really need. You ask the same questions over and over to develop a record of answer changes.

    It isnt cool to just complain without offering an alternative solution.
    KSM was laughing at US "interregation" backrubs and gourmet coffee until the waterboard came out and then generated actionable intel.
    Are you upset because it succeeded or that the CIA were willing to take the PR hit at all?
    Thank you

  6. #346
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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by akyron View Post
    KSM was laughing at US "interregation" backrubs and gourmet coffee until the waterboard came out and then generated actionable intel.
    The politicians who say that are the same ones who say KSM provided intelligence that foiled a plot on the Liberty Tower in 2002, even though KSM wasn't even captured until 2003. Not saying they're lying, just saying they could be.

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by Binary_Digit View Post
    The politicians who say that are the same ones who say KSM provided intelligence that foiled a plot on the Liberty Tower in 2002, even though KSM wasn't even captured until 2003. Not saying they're lying, just saying they could be.
    Its justice department memos recently declassified. What politicians are you talking about?


    Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style Attack

    The Library Tower attack Planning allegedly began as early as October 2001.
    Last edited by akyron; 04-28-09 at 07:50 PM.
    Thank you

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by akyron View Post
    Its justice department memos recently declassified. What politicians are you talking about?
    Team Bush. I admit I'm biased and could be wrong, but he's cried wolf too many times for me to take anything that administration says at face value.

    Quote Originally Posted by akyron View Post
    The Library Tower attack Planning allegedly began as early as October 2001.
    Right, and the plot was derailed in early 2002 according to Bush:

    President Bush Speaks on Terrorism

    Yet KSM was not captured until March 2003:

    CNN.com - Officials: Alleged al Qaeda paymaster in custody - Mar. 4, 2003

    So if what Bush says is true, there's no way KSM could have provided any intelligence to help disrupt the London Tower plot. Contrary to the assertions of the CIA in that article.
    Last edited by Binary_Digit; 04-28-09 at 08:08 PM.

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by Binary_Digit View Post
    Team Bush. I admit I'm biased and could be wrong, but he's cried wolf too many times for me to take anything that administration says at face value.


    Right, and the plot was derailed in early 2002 according to Bush:

    President Bush Speaks on Terrorism

    Yet KSM was not captured until March 2003:

    CNN.com - Officials: Alleged al Qaeda paymaster in custody - Mar. 4, 2003

    So if what Bush says is true, there's no way KSM could have provided any intelligence to help disrupt the London Tower plot. Contrary to the assertions of the CIA in that article.
    Objectively I have no idea why you are dragging "Team Bush" into clear cut declassified memos. Are you saying once a target has been cleared it wont ever be attacked or targeted again? If it was targeted in 2001 it was never going to be attacked again? That really does not sound accurate.

    Cried wolf?

    Terrorist Attacks
    (within the United States or against Americans abroad)



    Didnt happen eh?
    Last edited by akyron; 04-28-09 at 08:40 PM.
    Thank you

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    Re: CIA Confirms: Waterboarding 9/11 Mastermind Led to Info that Aborted 9/11-Style A

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Am I the only one that sees the irony in many of those that scream fascism, tyranny, and socialism with every bailout, environmental protection, or social safety-net, are also some of the biggest defenders of government sanctioned torture, denial of habeas corpus, and warrantless wiretaps?

    You don't trust the government to bail out a bank, but you trust them with torture? You don't trust the government to administer say, unemployment extensions, but you trust them with selectively denying habeas corpus?

    You guys that defend this crap are the very enablers of tyranny and you don't even know it.
    This has to be the most overlooked post in the entire thread. QFT.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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