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Thread: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

  1. #61
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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    So you openly admit that you lack the power of critical thought? Duly noted
    Non sequitur. There's no necessary relationship between not reconsidering your opinions and lacking the power to think critically.

    So what?
    And you talk about ME lacking the power to think crticially...

    Your are thanking the masser for not beating you today, not because he thinks beating you is wrong, but because his wife wont give him any if he does.

    Actually, it is his job to serve the people. That's the whole idea of democracy.
    Now is the time for you to use your powers of critical thinking, and re-consider your opinion...

    No... the whole idea of democracy is to get the people we like into the government. The whole idea of government is to protect the rights of the people. By not going forward with the AWB, The Obama is NOT protecting your rights, He is protecting HIS power.

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Non sequitur. There's no necessary relationship between not reconsidering your opinions and lacking the power to think critically.
    Nice word play, however irrelevant it may be... You openly admitted that you do not question your own opinions. In other words, you do not exercise the power of critical thought.

    Your are thanking the masser for not beating you today, not because he thinks beating you is wrong, but because his wife wont give him any if he does.
    Whatever... There is a legitimate question in regards to the limitations of the right to bear arms. In it's pure form, that means we have the right to bear nuclear weapons. It's possible to support the AWB without being a "gun grabber."

    Now is the time for you to use your powers of critical thinking, and re-consider your opinion...
    I question my opinion constantly. You'd be well advised to do the same. People who do not are called "sheeple."

    No... the whole idea of democracy is to get the people we like into the government.
    The whole idea of democracy is to insure that the government is in line with the will of the people. Four-eight years is relatively long timescale and a president who is not willing to bend can cause serious trouble (Ahem, GWB).

    The whole idea of government is to protect the rights of the people. By not going forward with the AWB, The Obama is NOT protecting your rights, He is protecting HIS power.
    That's your opinion.

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    George Bush was a man who threw public opinion to the wind.
    Precisely why he was a two term President.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Obama's showing himself willing to listen to the people.
    Indeed, and he looked cozy with Chavez as he listened.



    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    He's starting to unroll the police state
    Oh yeah, he's unrolled an even more vast eavesdropping program.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    cut spending,
    How you typed this with a straight face is beyond the wildest imagination of any rational thinking person.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    slim down the bureaucracy
    He's added 7-8 czars. Even the left wingnut Robert Byrd is calling it into question, you know, circumventing the confirmation process. They're all crooks.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    and now he's backing off on AWB II.
    Translation:

    He has no support from either party. You know when Pelosi runs away it's got to be bad.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Good news all around
    Yes, N.Korea, Iran & AQ are in party time mode.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    conveniently ignored as usual....
    No one is ignoring Obama and his floundering ways.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Oh yeah, and he's ending the perpetual war.
    Yes, yes, they're still there. Talk is cheap, August 2010 will tell the tale.
    Pain can be such a beautiful thing

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    The most obvious was staying the course in Iraq.
    Exactly. The liberals just don't understand.
    Pain can be such a beautiful thing

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Nice word play, however irrelevant it may be... You openly admitted that you do not question your own opinions. In other words, you do not exercise the power of critical thought.
    Again:
    There's no necessary relationship between not reconsidering your opinions and lacking the power to think critically.

    Whatever... There is a legitimate question in regards to the limitations of the right to bear arms. In it's pure form, that means we have the right to bear nuclear weapons. It's possible to support the AWB without being a "gun grabber."
    So much for using YOUR 'powers of critical thought'.

    I question my opinion constantly
    Not that you have shown here.

    That's your opinion.
    On the contrary -- both statements are fact.

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by GottaHurt View Post
    Precisely why he was a two term President.
    He was a two-term president because the alternative was John Kerry.

    Indeed, and he looked cozy with Chavez as he listened.

    I think Obama is a genuinely friendly guy. I think Chavez's goals are much more nefarious. Hint: it involves crazy right-wingers going nuts.

    Oh yeah, he's unrolled an even more vast eavesdropping program.
    Source?

    How you typed this with a straight face is beyond the wildest imagination of any rational thinking person.
    He's cutting spending within the areas in which he exercises executive power.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaki...m-cabinet.html

    He's added 7-8 czars. Even the left wingnut Robert Byrd is calling it into question, you know, circumventing the confirmation process. They're all crooks.
    Dunno about all this...

    Translation:

    He has no support from either party. You know when Pelosi runs away it's got to be bad.
    Sure...

    Yes, N.Korea, Iran & AQ are in party time mode.
    AQ's ability to strike the US has been effectively disabled. Not much we can do about the other two right now... Or do you want to start a 4-front war?

    No one is ignoring Obama and his floundering ways.


    Yes, yes, they're still there. Talk is cheap, August 2010 will tell the tale.
    I'm talking about the state of perpetual war we've been in since 1941.

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    He was a two-term president because the alternative was John Kerry.
    Then obviously the public stood with Bush.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    I think Obama is a genuinely friendly guy.
    Yep, and as I've already pointed out, he's cozying up with the bad guys.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Source?
    Obama: No warrantless wiretaps if you elect me | News Blog - CNET News

    NSA Exceeds Legal Limits In Eavesdropping Program - WSJ.com

    U.S. phone intercepts go beyond legal limits: report | Reuters

    NSA Found Improperly Spying on Americans - Presidential Politics | Political News - FOXNews.com


    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    He's cutting spending within the areas in which he exercises executive power.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaki...m-cabinet.html
    Keyword: seeks

    He's cut nothing.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Dunno about all this...
    Obama's Czars Spark Concerns Among Some Lawmakers - First 100 Days of Presidency - Politics FOXNews.com

    FOXNews.com - 'Car Czar' in Pay-for-Play Scandal - Hannity

    Khabrein.info

    Obama to Name Border 'Czar' | 44 | washingtonpost.com

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    AQ's ability to strike the US has been effectively disabled.
    Thanks George W Bush. Truly a great American.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Not much we can do about the other two right now... Or do you want to start a 4-front war?
    You said good news all around.

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    I'm talking about the state of perpetual war we've been in since 1941.
    And they're still perpetual. He hasn't ended anything.
    Pain can be such a beautiful thing

  8. #68
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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    The most obvious was staying the course in Iraq.
    Ignore the elephant in the room that is the fact we should have never invaded in the first place. He never "stayed the course." He completely botched it and then went through multiple spasms of trying to get it right. His first step should have been to listen to his military and national security staff and NOT INVADE.

    In terms of making sure the GOP retians power in Congress and the White House?
    Nope.
    Yeah, you keep telling yourself that.

    You have one.
    You can refuse to accept it as an example if you want, but nothig changes the fact that it IS an example.
    Wrong again. You have presented an example that you and some others feel was "the right thing." Millions of others disagree with you because it's been proven to have been a horrible mistake. "Staying the course" in Iraq was not "the right thing" to do. There was nothing "right" about the whole affair. The "right thing" to do would have been to not invade. It's like saying "well the robber did the right thing when he apologized to the victim so...."

    Try again.
    *insert profound statement here*

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by Lerxst View Post
    Ignore the elephant in the room that is the fact we should have never invaded in the first place.
    Irrelevant to the issue, but do rant on...

    He never "stayed the course."
    Really? When did we leave?
    When did we decide to stop trying to win?

    Yeah, you keep telling yourself that.
    If I were to do so, I would only be re-stating the obvious -- GWB did what -he- thought was the right thing to do in terms of defending the country, and did so knowing that it would cost his party. Impossible to show otherwise, and as such, impossible to argue otherwise.

    Wrong again.
    To be wrong again, I have to have been wrong a first time -- which isn't the case. The problem here is that you do not understand what is being argued.

    You have presented an example that you and some others feel was "the right thing." Millions of others disagree with you because it's been proven to have been a horrible mistake.
    The issuse here is doing what YOU think is the right thing, regardess of what others think or what it will do to your political power. Given that, what 'millions of others' think was the right thing to do, in this regard, is meaningless. GWB did what -he- thought was the right thing to do.

    "Staying the course" in Iraq was not "the right thing" to do.
    Your opinion here, as noted above, is meaningless.

    So... try again.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 04-20-09 at 03:31 PM.

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    Re: Obama Backs Away From Assault Gun Ban in Push to Stop Flow to Mexico

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Irrelevant to the issue, but do rant on...
    Absolutely relevant to the issue since you are citing his "staying the course" as the right thing to do. Staying the course is directly linked to the unnecessary invasion of Iraq.
    Really? When did we leave?
    When did we decide to stop trying to win?
    This is your convenient way of ignoring all the things Bush got wrong with his strategies. The ones that changed over time. "Staying the course" is a euphemism for "we broke it, we can't walk away until we figure out a way to fix it in some way that benefits us."
    If I were to do so, I would only be re-stating the obvious -- GWB did what -he- thought was the right thing to do in terms of defending the country,
    Oh horse ****. This is where you try to mask what he did as some kind of necessary act. Defend our country? This isn't even laughable. It's actually very depressing that people still hang on to this myth even though it's been proven to be a lie. For you to sit here and say "he did the right thing by staying the course" and "he did what he thought was right" does not make it right.
    and did so knowing that it would cost his party. Impossible to show otherwise, and as such, impossible to argue otherwise.
    Just as it's impossible for you to prove you know what his intentions were. Stop trying to think you can play your double standard against me in this thread if you are going to be so obvious about it. This is nothing but your opinion. The facts of how the whole thing played out are very much against your theory.

    To be wrong again, I have to have been wrong a first time -- which isn't the case. The problem here is that you do not understand what is being argued.
    I absolutely understand what is being argued and you are wrong. You believe GWB did the right thing despite the political ramifications because he thought it was best for the country. I'm countering your assertion and claiming he did it to forward an agenda as Iraq was NOT necessary and therefore not right and staying the course was NOT the right thing to do. It absolutely matters whether or not the act you are using as an example was truly the right thing to do when you say "he did the right thing despite the political ramifications." Don't try to church this up.

    The issuse here is doing what YOU think is the right thing, regardess of what others think or what it will do to your political power. Given that, what 'millions of others' think was the right thing to do, in this regard, is meaningless. GWB did what -he- thought was the right thing to do.
    No, this is where you move the goal posts in order to back out of your illogical defense of Bush's actions in Iraq. What's at issue here is Obama backing off of the AWB. Which is a good thing. It doesn't really matter why he did it, the fact is he did it. You think that's going to win him any votes with his mainline supporters? He walked away from something that was obviously important to him and many in his party because he knew it was going to be a major political blunder and cause more loss of confidence in the administration and the Democratic party.

    Wow, God forbid a Democrat walk away from a liberal idea because it's unpopular with the rest of the country. He got this one right. Who would have thought it, a political leaders actually being cognizant of the big mistake he was about to make and then decide not to make it. Last I checked politicians don't run for office with the sole purpose of being able to do whatever they want just so they can throw it all away during the next election. The idea is to do the right things when you can, do the smart things when you can. If you do that, chances are you will retain office and continue to be allowed to try and do good things. There is a huge difference with regard to invading another nation and killing thousands unnecessarily and pushing an economic plan that you and your adviser believe will actually work to the benefit of society. There are things that are obviously the right thing to do...like drop the damned love affair with the AWB. There are things that are obviously not the right thing to do...going to war without a truly just cause. And there are things that are debatable in terms of whether or not they are right or wrong...such as certain economic policies.

    You can play this out any way you want. But the difference between the examples given here (Bush doing a bad thing for what he believed was the right reasons and Obama doing a good thing simply because it was the politically right or safe thing to do) is that in the end, what Obama is actually doing is truly the right thing to do for this country. What Bush did was truly bad for this country. Reasons be damned.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman
    Some people believe in 'doing the right thing' regardless of the political consquences (see: GWB) and other people put 'doing the right thing' behind the retention of political power.

    Of the two, I'll take the former, even if I disagree with them
    Given your reference to Bush's actions I'd say that you would probably follow an idiot off a cliff so long as he truly felt it was the right thing to do. Well good luck with that. The only thing that really matters is that the right thing is done. If the right thing is done and it's for the good of this nation, what do you care with regard to the motive? The nation was taken care of.

    Your opinion here, as noted above, is meaningless.

    So... try again.
    Right back at there Goobieman. The only difference is that my opinion is logical, yours not so much.
    Last edited by Lerxst; 04-20-09 at 05:03 PM.
    *insert profound statement here*

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