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Thread: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

  1. #181
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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    Agreed. However something that causes no physical damage when you're talking war and terrorists isn't one of them.
    Waterboarding certainly is, the rest I don't know. A gentlemen, or Tory one at least, would not be involved or support waterboarding because he knows that once you shed honour and chivalry and you sink to the level of such a low enemy you taint even the sweetest victory.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 04-21-09 at 09:50 PM.
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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    There are some things a gentleman will not do or support for almost any end.
    Manners might get you a special dessert at the dinner table, or prehaps a little something extra in the bedroom from a lovely lady you might be courting. In a war manners are of little use with the enemy.

    Since when has war ever been gentlemanly(excepting Hollywood and romance novel renditions).
    "Loyalty only matters when there's a hundred reasons not to be-" Gen. Mattis

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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    Agreed. However something that causes no physical damage when you're talking war and terrorists isn't one of them.
    & if, when the facts come out, they prove that physical damage & even murder did take place....Will you still defend them?

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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by WI Crippler View Post
    Manners might get you a special dessert at the dinner table, or prehaps a little something extra in the bedroom from a lovely lady you might be courting. In a war manners are of little use with the enemy.

    Since when has war ever been gentlemanly(excepting Hollywood and romance novel renditions).
    Even war has accepted limits under international law. Does Nuremberg ring a bell? ....the Geneva Conventions?....They are the law of the land in our country.

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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    & if, when the facts come out, they prove that physical damage & even murder did take place....Will you still defend them?
    You got proof of murder and physical damage inflicted from waterboarding as used by our troops?

    If not perhaps you should hold off yourself on calling them nazis and monsters.

    At such time that any such evidence does come out we can both look at it then.

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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    Even war has accepted limits under international law. Does Nuremberg ring a bell? ....the Geneva Conventions?....They are the law of the land in our country.
    Geneva conventions don't apply in this topic.
    "Loyalty only matters when there's a hundred reasons not to be-" Gen. Mattis

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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    & if, when the facts come out, they prove that physical damage & even murder did take place....Will you still defend them?



    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    You got proof of murder and physical damage inflicted from waterboarding as used by our troops?

    If not perhaps you should hold off yourself on calling them nazis and monsters.

    At such time that any such evidence does come out we can both look at it then.

    So you refuse to answer my question? (note the word IF)

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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by Devil505 View Post
    So you refuse to answer my question? (note the word IF)
    I don't see the point in engaging in your hypothetical. If such evidence came out I'd certainly read it and see if my position needed to be re-evaluated.

    However I have a gut feeling that if the military killed anyone via waterboarding the news would be all over the place such is the hysteria of the anti-waterboarding crowd.

    I do know our troops supposedly killed a guy doing the cold cell thing in Afghanistan. They left him naked, wet, and cold and he died of hypothermia. I don't support that. I don't think they intended on killing the guy but at the same time they should be schooled enough on the techniques they're using to see to it they don't accidentally off people.

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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by WI Crippler View Post
    Manners might get you a special dessert at the dinner table, or prehaps a little something extra in the bedroom from a lovely lady you might be courting. In a war manners are of little use with the enemy.

    Since when has war ever been gentlemanly(excepting Hollywood and romance novel renditions).
    Well before the modern era it had some of the qualities of honour and gentlemanlyness. Gentlemanlyness is not anything soft, Henry V instilled honour in his men by hanging those who did any looting, even his prized archers. It can be firm and even brutal but it is not dishonourable, that is the key.

    But the point is yes sure war is dirty and nasty but there are still honourable ways of doing it and they don't include torture in almost all circumstances. I very much doubt you believe that everything is acceptable in war.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 04-21-09 at 10:25 PM.
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    Re: Obama Rules Out Charging C.I.A. Agents in Interrogations

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post

    However I have a gut feeling that if the military killed anyone via waterboarding the news would be all over the place such is the hysteria of the anti-waterboarding crowd.

    I do know our troops supposedly killed a guy doing the cold cell thing in Afghanistan. They left him naked, wet, and cold and he died of hypothermia. I don't support that. I don't think they intended on killing the guy but at the same time they should be schooled enough on the techniques they're using to see to it they don't accidentally off people.
    I don't really think that is the point, it is an extremely distressing method, one that few can put up with for more than afew seconds it seems, and is certainly torture.

    It is dishonourable.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

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