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Thread: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    You mean like your "Gays don't deserve any rights because they are homos" attitude that you have presented?
    That's one way to grossly misrepresent my position, sure.

    You are at least consistent in your sophistry.

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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    That's one way to grossly misrepresent my position, sure.

    You are at least consistent in your sophistry.
    You stated that the "right thing" is for gays to stop pushing for marriage as well as civil unions. What is your justification for that?
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    You stated that the "right thing" is for gays to stop pushing for marriage as well as civil unions. What is your justification for that?
    First, context: That was a response to...
    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    You mean like your "Gays don't deserve any rights because they are homos" attitude that you have presented?
    This is not a position I have ever held. On many occasions I have pointed out that I firmly believe that Gays are fully entitled to be free from harassment, employment and housing discrimination, and should remain completely free to associate and cohabitate with whomever they choose.

    Far from TheNextEra's assertion that I believe that gays are not entitled to any rights at all what so ever, I in fact support several gay rights.

    It is only in marriage where I take any issue, and even then I do not actively oppose gay-marriage. I have never and do not intend to vote against it and I hold that neutral position for purely religious reasons.

    On a cultural, sociological level, I object to gay-marriage.
    Marriage is a behavior, and state sanctioning of any form of marriage is encouragement of that behavior.

    Since my opinion is that homosexuality is the result of a biological error where the brain interprets the pheromones of the same gender as an opposite gender, it is my opinion that the practice of homosexuality and gay-marriage by extension is self destructive. I can not support state encouragement of self destructive behavior.

    However, since there are children who can benefit from gay parents, neither can I oppose gay marriage.

    I am unresolved on the issue.

    My arguments on gay-marriage are my attempts to explore the issue further and hopefully arrive at a firm position.

    At this time, the only resolution I see is for gays to simply stop perusing state support for their behavior, just as I think “right-to-die” avocets should simply stop perusing state support of suicide.

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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    First, context: That was a response to...
    No, it obviously wasn't, considering that that post came later than this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry
    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra
    The right solution is:
    ....for gays to stop pursuing marriage or civil unions in any way.
    .

    It is only in marriage where I take any issue, and even then I do not actively oppose gay-marriage. I have never and do not intend to vote against it and I hold that neutral position for purely religious reasons.

    On a cultural, sociological level, I object to gay-marriage.
    Marriage is a behavior, and state sanctioning of any form of marriage is encouragement of that behavior.

    Since my opinion is that homosexuality is the result of a biological error where the brain interprets the pheromones of the same gender as an opposite gender, it is my opinion that the practice of homosexuality and gay-marriage by extension is self destructive. I can not support state encouragement of self destructive behavior.
    What are you basing this opinion on? Considering that it's directly contradicted by pretty much all the scientific literature, I don't really give it much weight.

    However, since there are children who can benefit from gay parents, neither can I oppose gay marriage.

    I am unresolved on the issue.

    My arguments on gay-marriage are my attempts to explore the issue further and hopefully arrive at a firm position.

    At this time, the only resolution I see is for gays to simply stop perusing state support for their behavior, just as I think “right-to-die” avocets should simply stop perusing state support of suicide.
    So because you can't figure out how you should come out, you don't think that states should be free to decide to grant civil unions or marriage rights to gay couples?
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    What are you basing this opinion on? Considering that it's directly contradicted by pretty much all the scientific literature, I don't really give it much weight.
    My opinion is based on my interpretation of that literature.

    The evidence shows a difference. I am calling that difference an error because the resulting behavior is incongruent with the function of that individual’s reproductive system (that's the nice way of saying "gay men are instinctively trying to impregnate each other in the ass", but I'm making some effort not to be to crude here).

    The APA base’s it’s diagnostic criteria of a “disorder” on an individual’s ability to function day-to-day, whereas I base my argument on biological congruency. This is why I call it an “error” and not a “disorder”. The reproductive system is unique in that it is the one system any individual could live without, so it make sense that there would be some lesser form of Transexuality where an individual could function with the error.

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    So because you can't figure out how you should come out, you don't think that states should be free to decide to grant civil unions or marriage rights to gay couples?
    Pro-GM doesn't think it should be a state issue either, so perhaps that's one aria where pro-gm and I actually agree.

  6. #46
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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    My opinion is based on my interpretation of that literature.

    The evidence shows a difference. I am calling that difference an error because the resulting behavior is incongruent with the function of that individual’s reproductive system (that's the nice way of saying "gay men are instinctively trying to impregnate each other in the ass", but I'm making some effort not to be to crude here).

    The APA base’s it’s diagnostic criteria of a “disorder” on an individual’s ability to function day-to-day, whereas I base my argument on biological congruency. This is why I call it an “error” and not a “disorder”. The reproductive system is unique in that it is the one system any individual could live without, so it make sense that there would be some lesser form of Transexuality where an individual could function with the error.
    You're entitled to think whatever you want, but I'm just saying that I give it no weight and don't think that there's anything to support it beyond your own feelings and beliefs.

    Pro-GM doesn't think it should be a state issue either, so perhaps that's one aria where pro-gm and I actually agree.
    "Pro-GM" is not a monolithic entity. If you'd read any of my posts in this thread, you'd see that I think it is most certainly a state issue (if not solely a private one) and that it should be governed by the various state legislatures.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    You're entitled to think whatever you want, but I'm just saying that I give it no weight and don't think that there's anything to support it beyond your own feelings and beliefs.
    So true, but my feelings and beliefs dictate my vote, which does carry some consequence, so you might not want to dismiss the feelings and beliefs of others so quickly.

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    "Pro-GM" is not a monolithic entity. If you'd read any of my posts in this thread, you'd see that I think it is most certainly a state issue (if not solely a private one) and that it should be governed by the various state legislatures.
    Mainstream GM are taking the issue to SCOTUS just as mainstream PL are taking the issue to SCOTUS. It's the same strategy.

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    Re: [NY Gov.] Will Introduce Same-Sex Marriage Bill

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    So true, but my feelings and beliefs dictate my vote, which does carry some consequence, so you might not want to dismiss the feelings and beliefs of others so quickly.
    As I helpfully noted earlier, your stance is only shared by around 1/3 of the country. The other 2/3 of us don't need your vote to get it passed. All the marriage folks have to do is work on shifting the civil unioners a bit farther.

    Mainstream GM are taking the issue to SCOTUS
    Link?

    just as mainstream PL are taking the issue to SCOTUS.
    PL?
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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