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Saudi judge upholds man's marriage to 8-year-old

Lets start with the Grand Mufti. In Sunni muslim countries such as Syria, Saudi Arabia, etc. The Grand Mufti is the religious leader of that country. In Saudi Arabia Grand Mufti Sheikh Abdulaziz Al al-Sheikh would be part of this hierarchy.

In Shia muslim countries such as Iran Grand Ayatollah Ali Khamenei who is the supreme leader with more power than the president is at the top of the Shia hierarchy in Iran.

Much like the pope is a christain religious leader, these men are islamic religious leaders.


I like you Sgt but you seem confused.

My sect has no heirachy and no one can lead Islam apart from the Prophets.
We have no equivalent of a Pope and never will do.

Every Imam, cleric, Sheikh and man can interpret the Qu'ran their own way and each their view holds equal weight.
 
I like you Sgt but you seem confused.

My sect has no heirachy and no one can lead Islam apart from the Prophets.
We have no equivalent of a Pope and never will do.

Every Imam, cleric, Sheikh and man can interpret the Qu'ran their own way and each their view holds equal weight.

This is blatant BS. If everybody's views held equal weight than the Ayatollah and his hierarchy would not be able to dictate law according to their interpretation of the Koran.
 
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I like you Sgt but you seem confused.

My sect has no heirachy and no one can lead Islam apart from the Prophets.
We have no equivalent of a Pope and never will do.

Every Imam, cleric, Sheikh and man can interpret the Qu'ran their own way and each their view holds equal weight.

The pope is at the top of christain hierarchy. He is not a prophet. Are you saying that a mufti or ayatollah are not religious leaders?


hierarchy
- 6 results
hi⋅er⋅ar⋅chy   /ˈhaɪəˌrɑrki, ˈhaɪrɑr-/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [hahy-uh-rahr-kee, hahy-rahr-] Show IPA
–noun, plural -chies. 1. any system of persons or things ranked one above another.
2. government by ecclesiastical rulers.
3. the power or dominion of a hierarch.
4. an organized body of ecclesiastical officials in successive ranks or orders: the Roman Catholic hierarchy.
5. one of the three divisions of the angels, each made up of three orders, conceived as constituting a graded body.
6. Also called celestial hierarchy. the collective body of angels.
7. government by an elite group.
8. Linguistics. the system of levels according to which a language is organized, as phonemic, morphemic, syntactic, or semantic.


So there is no hierarchy amongst religious leaders say in Iran. There is no pecking order? No chain of command so to speak? They all have the same power?

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The pope is at the top of christain hierarchy. He is not a prophet. Are you saying that a mufti or ayatollah are not religious leaders?


hierarchy
- 6 results
hi⋅er⋅ar⋅chy   /ˈhaɪəˌrɑrki, ˈhaɪrɑr-/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [hahy-uh-rahr-kee, hahy-rahr-] Show IPA
–noun, plural -chies. 1. any system of persons or things ranked one above another.
2. government by ecclesiastical rulers.
3. the power or dominion of a hierarch.
4. an organized body of ecclesiastical officials in successive ranks or orders: the Roman Catholic hierarchy.
5. one of the three divisions of the angels, each made up of three orders, conceived as constituting a graded body.
6. Also called celestial hierarchy. the collective body of angels.
7. government by an elite group.
8. Linguistics. the system of levels according to which a language is organized, as phonemic, morphemic, syntactic, or semantic.


So there is no hierarchy amongst religious leaders say in Iran. There is no pecking order? No chain of command so to speak? They all have the same power?

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Really? I am Protestant, and therefore do not recognize the Pope's authority.
 
Of course it is the truth. But what is the point of posting things like that again and again, if it is not to demonize Islam?

I think that is purely their intent. There are many religions where situations like this have happened. I'm just thankful we have a secular government here in the USA. And I'm not sure where you are bub but I think you feel the same way about your government to some extent.
 
The pope is at the top of christain hierarchy. He is not a prophet. Are you saying that a mufti or ayatollah are not religious leaders?


hierarchy
- 6 results
hi⋅er⋅ar⋅chy   /ˈhaɪəˌrɑrki, ˈhaɪrɑr-/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [hahy-uh-rahr-kee, hahy-rahr-] Show IPA
–noun, plural -chies. 1. any system of persons or things ranked one above another.
2. government by ecclesiastical rulers.
3. the power or dominion of a hierarch.
4. an organized body of ecclesiastical officials in successive ranks or orders: the Roman Catholic hierarchy.
5. one of the three divisions of the angels, each made up of three orders, conceived as constituting a graded body.
6. Also called celestial hierarchy. the collective body of angels.
7. government by an elite group.
8. Linguistics. the system of levels according to which a language is organized, as phonemic, morphemic, syntactic, or semantic.


So there is no hierarchy amongst religious leaders say in Iran. There is no pecking order? No chain of command so to speak? They all have the same power?

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Shi'ite Islam, by its very nature, is hierarchical. That is because it firmly believes in the divinity of the Prophet's lineage. It is complete bullsh*t, as is the idea of the Prophet wielding divinity of any kind, but that's the way it has been practiced for nearly 1400 years, and it has led to severe exploitation of the system by people like the Iranian/Iraqi/Bahrain/Saudi/Pakistani/North African Shi'ite Ayatollahs.

Sunni Islam, Sufi Islam, the Druze, and basically every other sect in Islam is firmly against the concept of hierarchy. Hence, the very notion that Islam is an 'organized religion' is, by the religion's VERY NATURE, utter bullsh*t.

I am not saying these muftis don't wield influence. They do, and the Muslim World is stuck in the 7th century precisely BECAUSE of that very fact.

Nevertheless, lumping 'ayatollahs and muftis' together like you have done for several posts now is utterly ludicrous. They are not alike at all, and anyone with a basic knowledge of Islam would know that. Hence, your attacks are invalid.
 
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By bad, I guess I'll have to chauk this one up to ignorance on my part. Well you know what they say, live and learn.
 
What if she hits puberty at the age of 9 as Aisha did when Muhammad consumated that marriage. Are you ok with that? More importantly as a society should this be allowed? Garza would you consider marriage to an 8 year old? Or like most of the civilized world would you find the thought of having sex with a little girl repulsive and disgusting?

Like I said I don't condone it, I find it terrible. You have to understand that most of the world isn't civilised. It happens in many parts of the world unfortunately. I think it has to do with poverty and low life expectancy rate, rather than religion.

If Muslim people in Europe were getting married to 8 years olds, then I might agree with you that Islam promotes marriage to children. But I don't see that.
 
It's not a religion. It's a child rape cult.

Ahem. If Islam is a child rape cult so is Christainity. Those randy priests/pastors/ministers.

You will also find that having sex with children is not prohibited in the Bible.

Don't get mad at me sazerac, im just using your logic.
 
Ahem. If Islam is a child rape cult so is Christainity. Those randy priests/pastors/ministers.

You will also find that having sex with children is not prohibited in the Bible.

Don't get mad at me sazerac, im just using your logic.

But at the same time, I don't know of any biblical character who boinked a nine year old. Muslims are taught to emulate Mohammed, who boinked a nine year old girl.
 
But at the same time, I don't know of any biblical character who boinked a nine year old. Muslims are taught to emulate Mohammed, who boinked a nine year old girl.

Numbers 31:17-18 (New International Version)

17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.
 
Ahem. If Islam is a child rape cult so is Christainity. Those randy priests/pastors/ministers.

You will also find that having sex with children is not prohibited in the Bible.

Don't get mad at me sazerac, im just using your logic.

Christians deeply disapprove of such behavior. That's a huge difference.

There are no judges or priests or ministers preaching that it's ok.
 
Numbers 31:17-18 (New International Version)

17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

And? Did it say to **** them? Didn't think so... Also, this gives no indication as to age.

Sahih Muslim Book 008, Number 3310:
'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house when I was nine years old.

Sahih Bukhari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64
Narrated 'Aisha:
that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old, and then she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death).
 
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I'm sure the virgins were saved for the convent:roll:

"Virgins" could be anything from infants to 90 year old women. When does a girl turn into a woman? And once again, it just says "keep them alive for yourself." It doesn't say "rape them" or even "fornicate with them."
 
"Virgins" could be anything from infants to 90 year old women. When does a girl turn into a woman? And once again, it just says "keep them alive for yourself." It doesn't say "rape them" or even "fornicate with them."

LOL, yeah they were for the convent:lol:

The point really is that if one wants to rip apart any religion and posit it as evil there is more than enough material.
 
LOL, yeah they were for the convent:lol:

The point really is that if one wants to rip apart any religion and posit it as evil there is more than enough material.

What do you mean "for convent?" You don't think it's possible to take them into your tribe and not rape/fornicate with them?

I'm not saying Islam is evil, I'm just saying Mohammed was a pedophile, a pretty logical position to take.
 
But at the same time, I don't know of any biblical character who boinked a nine year old. Muslims are taught to emulate Mohammed, who boinked a nine year old girl.

Child Marriage however is not confined to the Muslim world. If what you say is true then we should be seeing secret child marriages in the Western world. We see no such thing. Child marriage is more to with poverty and low expentancy rate.

Think about it, your an African with 10 children, you can barely feed them. Marriage as soon as possible mean thats daughter will get free food from her new husband and their will be more food for her siblings. I'm not saying its right, but those are the struggles these people face.

Its all fair and good and look through idealistic glasses from your own armchair. These people unlike us struggle to survive.

Like I said child marraiges are not confined to the Islamic world, but the poor world.

map.jpg


Christians deeply disapprove of such behavior. That's a huge difference.

There are no judges or priests or ministers preaching that it's ok.


Yeah nowadays. Except from Christain tribes in Sub-Sahara Africa and South America. Like I said, its poverty, not religion that is the cause of child marriage.
 
What do you mean "for convent?" You don't think it's possible to take them into your tribe and not rape/fornicate with them?

I'm not saying Islam is evil, I'm just saying Mohammed was a pedophile, a pretty logical position to take.

When they were ripping pregnant woman open and killing all males I highly doubt they were not raping and fornicating with the virgins.
 
Child Marriage however is not confined to the Muslim world. If what you say is true then we should be seeing secret child marriages in the Western world. We see no such thing. Child marriage is more to with poverty and low expentancy rate.

Think about it, your an African with 10 children, you can barely feed them. Marriage as soon as possible mean thats daughter will get free food from her new husband and their will be more food for her siblings. I'm not saying its right, but those are the struggles these people face.

Its all fair and good and look through idealistic glasses from your own armchair. These people unlike us struggle to survive.

Like I said child marraiges are not confined to the Islamic world, but the poor world.

map.jpg





Yeah nowadays. Except from Christain tribes in Sub-Sahara Africa and South America. Like I said, its poverty, not religion that is the cause of child marriage.

Marriage is one thing. It's possible to marry a girl and not have sex with her until she's at least somewhat sexually mature. 9 year olds do not meet that qualification.
 
Marriage is one thing. It's possible to marry a girl and not have sex with her until she's at least somewhat sexually mature. 9 year olds do not meet that qualification.

I agree. But like I said, its not religion, but POVERTY that is the cause of this. When you only reach 30-40 years old before you die (like in Mohammeds time) the margin of time to give birth and raise the kid is pretty low.
In these peoples lives, a girl is sexually mature when she recieves her period. Mental maturity is not questioned.
 
Frankly, no. I haven't spent that much time on the Torah. You'd be better off talking to a Jew about this.

And the Christians call it the Old Testament *shrug*

Here is what was going on

"They fought against Midian, as the LORD commanded Moses, and killed every man........Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man. (Numbers 31:7,17-18)"
 
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