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Thread: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    They're not incompatible.
    Read the first commandment. Then read the first amendment. They are most certainly incompatible. You can not declare there to be only one God and then say you have the freedom of religion. That's like being told you can eat any kind of burger but then are told that your only 'choice' is a cheeseburger.

    In order to be a Christian you must subscribe to the First Commandment,
    And thus you can not possibly believe that Christianity is not in direct opposition to our 1st amendment.

    but nowhere does it say to force others to do so.
    And yet this is not what we're discussing. We're discussing the contradictions Christianity poses to the document that our laws are generated in accordance with. The Constitution.

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Much of the morality that went into the founding of this country was based on the morality that the founding fathers, as Christians, practiced. They did not create an anarchic society. Most laws are based on some sort of morality. Since Christianity was the main repository for morals of the day, it stands to reason that this is where many of the tenets that our country was build would come from.
    Again - what Christian values and what part of clearly Christian morality are our laws and society based on? I asked you this already and you failed to provide any answer. Only the same vague responses though. The Founding Fathers are these devoted Christian men who failed to tell people that there is only ONE God? The Christian God? What kind of Christian doesn't tell people that? What kind Christian followers forgets the 10 commandments when writing the basis for a country that is supposedly 'Christian'? I mean we're not talking about little stuff here. We're talking about the Constitution being in direct opposition/contradiction to Christianity or for that matter any religion which claims to establish their God as the only God. I mean this is like the Mullah's in Iran writting the Iranian constitution and then forgetting to tell people that they are an Islamic country that adheres to Islamic principles.
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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Easy. Christians follow the teachings of Christ and try to live our lives following the example that Christ taught.
    "Christians" are like the Pharisees. They pretend to worship Jesus Christ, but yet, they worhsip in such a way that "men can see their worship". It is not sincere and generally involves a right-wing political agenda unrelated to what Christ taught.

    Ego has nothing to do with it. What it has to to with is respecting the principles that Christ taught rather than using his name to promote an agenda.
    I wish I could thank your post more than once.
    "An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it." - Gandhi

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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by EgoffTib View Post
    The majority of Christians hardly know anything about their faith and do not even attempt to emulate Christ. I would not want to be labeled a Christian, and I have a profound appreciation for Jesus.


    links and evidence or are we just bashing here?
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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Read the first commandment. Then read the first amendment. They are most certainly incompatible. You can not declare there to be only one God and then say you have the freedom of religion. That's like being told you can eat any kind of burger but then are told that your only 'choice' is a cheeseburger.



    And thus you can not possibly believe that Christianity is not in direct opposition to our 1st amendment.



    And yet this is not what we're discussing. We're discussing the contradictions Christianity poses to the document that our laws are generated in accordance with. The Constitution.



    Again - what Christian values and what part of clearly Christian morality are our laws and society based on? I asked you this already and you failed to provide any answer. Only the same vague responses though. The Founding Fathers are these devoted Christian men who failed to tell people that there is only ONE God? The Christian God? What kind of Christian doesn't tell people that? What kind Christian followers forgets the 10 commandments when writing the basis for a country that is supposedly 'Christian'? I mean we're not talking about little stuff here. We're talking about the Constitution being in direct opposition/contradiction to Christianity or for that matter any religion which claims to establish their God as the only God. I mean this is like the Mullah's in Iran writting the Iranian constitution and then forgetting to tell people that they are an Islamic country that adheres to Islamic principles.
    Frankly, I'm getting tired of this discussion. I've already explained that there is no justification for forcing people to be Christians (it doesn't even make sense). Encoding the first commandment into the Constitution would be un-Christian and ridiculous to boot.

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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Read the first commandment. Then read the first amendment. They are most certainly incompatible. You can not declare there to be only one God and then say you have the freedom of religion. That's like being told you can eat any kind of burger but then are told that your only 'choice' is a cheeseburger.
    ‘“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.” This is the greatest and first commandment. And a second is like it: “You shall love your neighbour as yourself.” On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.’
    —Matthew 22:34-40

    Read the second commandment, Jesus explained how the two go hand in hand.

    You can declare that you believe in one God, then respect your neighbors right to not believe that. ie Freedom of Religion.
    The purpose of morality is to teach you, not to suffer and die, but to enjoy yourself and live. ~ Ayn Rand
    A politician divides mankind into two classes: tools and enemies.~ Nietzsche

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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Obama meant to say, "Now that I am in office we will no longer consider ourselves a christian nation".
    It's nothing more than X's and O's.

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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by rhinefire View Post
    Obama meant to say, "Now that I am in office we will no longer consider ourselves a christian nation".
    No, he was simply stating facts. I'm sorry that you have trouble dealing with it.
    "An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it." - Gandhi

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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    If laws are based on Christianity then that would contradict the idea of allowing people to be free to choose if they are going to follow Christian ideals or not. You could have the freedom of religion and secular government be Christian, or laws based on Christianity, but not both. I haven't seen sufficient evidence of either being the case.

    I consider Obama's statement to be accurate, we are a nation made up mostly of Christians not a Christian nation.
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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    links and evidence or are we just bashing here?
    He just bashing as usual. Still waiting.....
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: "We do not consider ourselves a christian nation", says Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    He just bashing as usual.
    Ah, yes. Ironic that you, of all people, are pointing the finger at me for bashing. Classic.

    Still waiting.....
    Continue to wait. There has not been a study done to validate or invalidate my claim.
    "An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it." - Gandhi

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