Page 20 of 28 FirstFirst ... 101819202122 ... LastLast
Results 191 to 200 of 277

Thread: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

  1. #191
    ANTI**ANTIFA
    ReverendHellh0und's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Temple of Solomon
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    75,740

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Basic human psychology, Reverend. When confronted with a life threatening situation, one will react in one of three ways: Fight, Flight, or Freeze. How one reacts is based on two factors: 1) the person's personality, and 2) the choice that will lead to the best chance of one's survival. This decision is not made with what one would call conscious thought, it is made instantaneously, based on an inherent assessment. Survival is the key component, here, but survival of the individual, not the group. When, unarmed, and presented with someone carrying a gun, the most likely response would be to freeze. Fleeing, in an enclosed place, which is where these people were, would draw attention to them, making them more likely targets, decreasing their potential for survival. Attempting to fight, would not only draw attention to the individual, but put them in a more aggressive situation, causing the gunman to fight back, decreasing their potential for survival. In this particular situation, freezing gave the greatest chance. though small as it was. If the situation were more even, or if there were an easier way out, another of these three "F's" might have been chosen. But these were not available, therefore, human psychology dictated how these people reacted.



    Basic human psychology


    Fight or flight. absolutely, the point is, when there was no flight available, these who i am sure had some able bodied people around them froze. maybe it is psychology. so what. Does this mean we can't overcome it? perhaps I am not as defeatist as you.

    Tell me do people ever fight back? Do you think there are ANY socilogical conditioning here?


    freezing gave the greatest chance


    WHAT?!?!?!?... freezing gave the wolf this day easy targets. this is a gunfight, you have the rest of your life to win a gunfight

    A man is there to kill everyone he sees, do you really believe the best solution for survival is to "hold still"?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  2. #192
    ANTI**ANTIFA
    ReverendHellh0und's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Temple of Solomon
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    75,740

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Let's review, Reverend, and this is where you are posting dishonestly, either on purpose or because you did not read my post carefully enough.
    This is a lie. you initially claimed my position was that those who chose not to carry a gun are meek. I explained how you were wrong numerous times numerous ways. this is where you started posting.

    In this instance, you made statements where you made similar statements re the article you dismissed in your perpetration of that lie you told about my position and ran with.

    When I say "If the sheep fear anything it is the wolves that pretend to be sheepdogs", I am not saying, "The sheep generally do not like the sheepdog." I am saying that the sheep do not like wolves that pretend to be sheepdogs. This is completely different than what Grossman says. You always have trouble with argument that are not black or white. And this is not only no exception, but further presents how you see "sheep". People who you and Grossman refer to as "sheep" do not dislike sheepdogs, not at all. Most like and respect them. However, there are wolves that pretend to be sheepdogs. These are those that "sheep" do not like. And this is the contradiction that you and Grossman make and do not get. "Sheep" are smart enough to know the difference.
    you know, you could have said that.... but lets review.


    The other quote fits right in line with this way of thinking; "The difference, though, is that the sheepdog must not, can not and will not ever harm the sheep. Any sheep dog who intentionally harms the lowliest little lamb will be punished and removed." But the sheep is suspicious, this is what you and Grossman do not get, and why I get on you about the "meek" comment. You are presenting a victim mentality. The "sheepdog" may not hurt the sheep, but the wolf pretending to be the sheep, would. You ever heard of the "wolf in sheep's clothing" fable? This is a take of on this.

    I hope this helps you to understand the error in your assumption and the fact that I, in no way contradicted myself or agreed with Grossman. His premise is overly simplistic and presents a "blaming the victim" mentality, which I do not agree with.


    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    And part of my rejection of Grossman's article is that his claim that "sheep" fear "sheepdogs" is fallacious. Few "sheep" fear "sheepdogs". This is spin created by the "sheepdogs". If the sheep fear anything it is the wolves that pretend to be sheepdogs, and the teeth the sheepdogs have. As far as most sheepdogs go, Grossman is completely mistaken.


    let me ask you, by your sentence structure, you are stating people fear the "sheepdogs" teeth. not the "wolves in sheeps clothing" if you made an error in grammar let me know. I unlike you will accept that you meant something more than what and how you wrote or something else entirelly, I wont bait you dishonestly with this for the next 4 pages. thanks
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  3. #193
    ANTI**ANTIFA
    ReverendHellh0und's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Temple of Solomon
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    75,740

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Human psychology, Reverend, in regards to survival. Read my other post for clarification to understand why you are wrong.



    Right, while I am wrong fighting for my life if we ever find ourselves together, you just "hold still".....


    There is no survival in your "psychology" argument, there is only slaughter.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  4. #194
    ANTI**ANTIFA
    ReverendHellh0und's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Temple of Solomon
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    75,740

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    I have a feeling most of these Rambos have never actually been in a situation where everyone in the room was being methodically killed. It makes them feel like he-men to lecture how easy it would have been for the victims to overpower the shooter.



    Did you curtsy at the end of this?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  5. #195
    Banned
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Whitewater, CO
    Last Seen
    04-05-16 @ 06:04 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    8,260
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    A true case of immigration rage!

    How sad!

    The system is so backlogged I can see why it could be frustrating. To kill over such a thing is just sad.

    I hope the hostages come out unharmed.

  6. #196
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Last Seen
    03-22-15 @ 02:36 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    17,343

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    I have a feeling most of these Rambos have never actually been in a situation where everyone in the room was being methodically killed. It makes them feel like he-men to lecture how easy it would have been for the victims to overpower the shooter.
    Ad-homs are no substitute for a sound position...

  7. #197
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ!
    stevenb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Gilbert, Az
    Last Seen
    11-28-09 @ 08:32 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    1,560

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    The plain and simple truth is that you do not understand the situation and how suvival instincts based on situations affect people.
    I've already had my trial by fire, not in a massacre such as the one we're talking about.. but in a similar situation.

    I know how I will act, I care not how others act.

    I will do what it takes to survive, or help others survive.

    I'm not a flee'er or a freeze'er.

    My experience was the primary reason for my getting, and carrying a ccw firearm at all times... irregardless of where I am.
    George Washington didn't use his freedom of speech to win the war with Britain... He shot them.

  8. #198
    ANTI**ANTIFA
    ReverendHellh0und's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Temple of Solomon
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:22 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    75,740

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    I would like to add, the Captain spent several posts dishonestly claiming my point was that people who choose not to carry guns are meek. Specifically this post:

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/1057981162-post61.html

    "Anyone who chooses to not have a gun is being or has been taught to be meek."


    Even after correcting his error he insisted on fighting me on this point I did not make. Not only have I posted my position clearly several times, I linked an article, a you tube, and other information, that most others got except for skycore, will rockwell, and Captian"Courtesy". He then tried to morph his statement into something else.

    This and only this is the issue regarding my pointing out the Captain's blatant dishonesty in this discussion with me. If he wants to continue to obfuscate in order to weasel out of his baiting behavior so be it. I care not. But when he follows through with his threats he made to me in PM regarding calling ME dishonest in other threads (has happened already) because I laughed at his demand for a public apology to him. Lets remember when the **** hits the fan, and everyone is all pissed off. THIS is were the Captain started it.


    I will tell him here now publicly. You sir, will get what you give. Please act accordingly.


    The discussion and a good description of my true feelings on this topic, to which I was attacked dishonestly over, can be continued at the link below. Lets endeavor to keep this one sane.


    http://www.debatepolitics.com/Death-...s-victims.html
    Last edited by ReverendHellh0und; 04-09-09 at 02:58 PM.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  9. #199
    Global Moderator
    The Hammer of Chaos
    Goshin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Dixie
    Last Seen
    Today @ 07:31 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    44,178

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by WillRockwell View Post
    Problem is, your sense of responsibility does not extend to help us figure out how to keep guns out of the hands of mass murderers, so instead of saving us from dangerous criminals you are enabling and encouraging them.

    Okay, cutting to the chase, about keeping guns out of the hands of mass murderers; the short version is, you can't. Not entirely, and probably not even the majority.

    1. If you banned guns entirely, criminals would still get them. They'd be smuggled in like drugs are now...if there was even any need, since there are over 200 million guns in private hands in the USA right now, and you'd never get rid of all of them. AK47's and many other firearms can be made in any decent machine shop. Ammo can be manufactured in secret without much more trouble. There will ALWAYS be guns for those who want them and are willing to break the law to get them, and BY DEFINITION those willing to commit mass murder are lawbreakers.
    2. No law ever stopped a person who was willing to die to accomplish his goal. JFK's assassination in the middle of Secret Service protection is one example. A major gun control act followed this assassination, prohibiting certain kinds of sales and transfers. This did not stop President Reagan from being shot a couple decades later, in the midst of Secret Service guards.
    3. No other scheme will work either. Registration does not work; serial numbers can be removed, so could RFID tags etc...what one man can make, another can find a way around.
    4. Those cities with the most draconian anti-gun laws are also those cities with the highest rates of violent crime...DC, Chicago, etc.
    5. Nutcase mass-murder groups like Aum Shin Ryo, in Japan, used nerve gas instead of guns.

    The argument quoted is bogus because the fundamental thesis of it, that more gun control will mean less murder, is flat out wrong.

    Unless you can find a way to outlaw the will to murder, you will never have a utopian land where these things never happen.

    G.

  10. #200
    Advisor
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Last Seen
    04-12-09 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    342

    Re: Reports: 4 shot, hostages taken in Binghamton, NY

    Quote Originally Posted by stevenb View Post
    I've already had my trial by fire, not in a massacre such as the one we're talking about.. but in a similar situation.

    I know how I will act, I care not how others act.

    I will do what it takes to survive, or help others survive.

    I'm not a flee'er or a freeze'er.

    My experience was the primary reason for my getting, and carrying a ccw firearm at all times... irregardless of where I am.

    Sounds like an admission of being paralyzed by fear for life, from one event.

Page 20 of 28 FirstFirst ... 101819202122 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •