• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

No, this certainly is not. And I'm far enough Left (on economic issues, at least) that I don't mind being called a "socialist."
 
Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

www.washingtonexaminer.com >> Politics

But now, in a little-noticed move, the House Financial Services Committee, led by chairman Barney Frank, has approved a measure that would, in some key ways, go beyond the most draconian features of the original AIG bill. The new legislation, the "Pay for Performance Act of 2009," would impose government controls on the pay of all employees -- not just top executives -- of companies that have received a capital investment from the U.S. government. It would, like the tax measure, be retroactive, changing the terms of compensation agreements already in place. And it would give Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner extraordinary power to determine the pay of thousands of employees of American companies.
The purpose of the legislation is to "prohibit unreasonable and excessive compensation and compensation not based on performance standards," according to the bill's language. That includes regular pay, bonuses -- everything -- paid to employees of companies in whom the government has a capital stake, including those that have received funds through the Troubled Assets Relief Program, or TARP, as well as Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac.
Click to expand...

What's the purpose of this?
Rep. Alan Grayson, the Florida Democrat who wrote the bill, told me its basic message is "you should not get rich off public money, and you should not get rich off of abject failure." Grayson expects the bill to pass the House, and as we talked, he framed the issue in a way to suggest that virtuous lawmakers will vote for it, while corrupt lawmakers will vote against it.
Click to expand...



Scared yet Comrades?
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

/subscribe
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

I have doubts this will actually ever come to pass... however, the fact it made it through committee... that's scary.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

MrVicchio said:
I have doubts this will actually ever come to pass... however, the fact it made it through committee... that's scary.
Click to expand...
HOW did it get through committee? Who was chairing?
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

Well, the groundwork is being well prepared for the Anti-Dog-Eat-Dog Rule. After the feds nationalize the major banks and auto-manufacturers, they'll be moving to eliminate competition from the independent banks and the non-nationalized auto-makers, probably by making it illegal to offer for sale products competitively priced with their nationalized providers.

If Barney gets a hankering for some more rear den I'll expect he'll move to take over the nation's steel mills. How could a real man like Barney resist a steel worker wearing a hard-hat? When will the airlines fall?
 
Last edited:
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

MrVicchio said:
I have doubts this will actually ever come to pass... however, the fact it made it through committee... that's scary.
Click to expand...

If they can keep the uniongoons currently wrecking GM for the Messiah from seeing it, it has a good chance of passing.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

MrVicchio said:
www.washingtonexaminer.com >> Politics



What's the purpose of this?
[/b]


Scared yet Comrades?
Click to expand...

If companies take our money, Government not only has a right, but they have an obligation to oversee how its spent. Once they restructure,get their ducks in order, and start paying back the money, then the restrictions come off.

This is not socialism. It's a de-facto bankruptcy based on an economic equation--if the the demise of company xyz would result in the loss of employment for 1million persons, then government can step in a hopefully stave off an economic meltdown which result in massive poverty, crime.

Get a dictionary and look up socialism and marxism. Then loan it to Glen Beck and Sean Hannity.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

hazlnut said:
It's a de-facto bankruptcy based on an economic equation--if the the demise of company xyz would result in the loss of employment for 1million persons, then government can step in a hopefully stave off an economic meltdown which result in massive poverty, crime.
Click to expand...

It can?

Funny, the Constitution doesn't allow the government to do that. The Constitution says the Congress shall pass laws regulating bankruptcy. Read Article 1, Section 8.

It doesn't say the Congress can play games with the public treasury to prevent their friends from going bankrupt. And by the Tenth Amendment, that means the federal government can't do that.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

hazlnut said:
If companies take our money, Government not only has a right, but they have an obligation to oversee how its spent. Once they restructure,get their ducks in order, and start paying back the money, then the restrictions come off.

This is not socialism. It's a de-facto bankruptcy based on an economic equation--if the the demise of company xyz would result in the loss of employment for 1million persons, then government can step in a hopefully stave off an economic meltdown which result in massive poverty, crime.

Get a dictionary and look up socialism and marxism. Then loan it to Glen Beck and Sean Hannity.
Click to expand...

How about you look up the Constitution and explain where the US Government is deriving this power from? I can't seem to find it... can you?

Bush will go down in History as the President that did some good things, did a few dumb things... and was hated for all the wrong reasons. He opened Pandora's Box, and now the Dems are holding it upside down and shaking everything out...

And people like you blindly cheer it on.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

You know I would like to hear from the liberals who voted for these oath breakers who are now running Congress. People like Barney Frank are practically communist, based on this latest ploy. Please defend this, I think we all need to hear the logic.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

MrVicchio said:
How about you look up the Constitution and explain where the US Government is deriving this power from? I can't seem to find it... can you?

Bush will go down in History as the President that did some good things, did a few dumb things... and was hated for all the wrong reasons. He opened Pandora's Box, and now the Dems are holding it upside down and shaking everything out...

And people like you blindly cheer it on.
Click to expand...

Article I, the general-welfare/commerce clause. It's written broadly enough to justify anything. Your beef is with Madison and Hamilton -- good capitalists.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

Scarecrow Akhbar said:
If they can keep the uniongoons currently wrecking GM for the Messiah from seeing it, it has a good chance of passing.
Click to expand...

Union goons? LOL. It was management which wrecked the Big Three. They had thirty freakin' years to build cars that could compete with Toyota and refused to do it.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

HelloDollyLlama said:
Union goons? LOL. It was management which wrecked the Big Three. They had thirty freakin' years to build cars that could compete with Toyota and refused to do it.
Click to expand...
With a 40% wage anchor dragging them down, it's hard to compete.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

American said:
With a 40% wage anchor dragging them down, it's hard to compete.
Click to expand...

It's a combination of things. Unions, management (especially in the case of GM), and the generally high cost of labor in the US. The way it's supposed to work now is labor should be getting cheaper and some clever entrepreneurs should be able to take the risk, raise some capital, and start a new business based on fresh ideas. If anything the government should be offering grants to start-ups. Instead we subsidize failure and reward bloated and inefficient businesses.

We've known about this for at least a decade.

I read an article by a guy in Japan where he blamed Japan's problem on a lack of entrepreneurial spirit. That's exactly what's wrong with our country. We're unwilling to take risks and cease opportunities. Perhaps a little failure is the best way to foster this spirit.
 
Last edited:
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

BulletWounD said:
It's a combination of things. Unions, management (especially in the case of GM), and the generally high cost of labor in the US. The way it's supposed to work now is labor should be getting cheaper and some clever entrepreneurs should be able to take the risk, raise some capital, and start a new business based on fresh ideas. If anything the government should be offering grants to start-ups. Instead we subsidize failure and reward bloated and inefficient businesses.

We've known about this for at least a decade.

I read an article by a guy in Japan where he blamed Japan's problem on a lack of entrepreneurial spirit. That's exactly what's wrong with our country. We're unwilling to take risks and cease opportunities. Perhaps a little failure is the best way to foster this spirit.
Click to expand...
This is the Obama Change, you can only hope for success(with government support of course), and failure is too painful to consider.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

MrVicchio said:
This is the Obama Change, you can only hope for success(with government support of course), and failure is too painful to consider.
Click to expand...

Yes, but Obama's policies can only lead to greater and more systemic failure. When ever there's a failure, intelligent people are forced to ask themselves "How could I have done that better?" Perhaps a little Obamania is just what this country needs. I can only hope that it doesn't become so ingrained and systemic that it leads to our failure as a nation.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

American said:
With a 40% wage anchor dragging them down, it's hard to compete.
Click to expand...

It's hard to compete in general without innovation like GM has done. They lag in quality, safety, and innovation.

The corporate decisions in GM are what caused it to fail.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

TheNextEra said:
It's hard to compete in general without innovation like GM has done. They lag in quality, safety, and innovation.

The corporate decisions in GM are what caused it to fail.
Click to expand...

You sure it's not paying the janitor $70k a year to mop the floor?

Or the fender installer guy getting close to six figures, because he operates a little machine that screws bolts into a car body all day?

How about the GM forklift driver that makes $103k a year?

GEE. While I don't discount the fact that the CEOs bare a lot of the blame for the failure of their companies... it's not like they didn't have help from the UAW.
 
Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

stevenb said:
You sure it's not paying the janitor $70k a year to mop the floor?
Click to expand...

Which janitor is that?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom