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Thread: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    Companies must compete on cost, if US automakers are to start producing products in which customers are interested, they must be flexible and efficient. Our union system is bloated and inefficient by default. The UAW's state-sanctioned monopoly allows them to make unrealistic demands which divert funds from business operations. Usually the first thing a company will ditch to remain price competitive is R&D.

    I'm not going to deny that the management at GM and Chrysler have made some poor business decisions. I'm just saying it's not the only problem.
    Again, if you make a quality part for say $15 and say it is American, while foreign countries are making a quality part for $12, you will always get those willing to buy American.

    But if you make a ****ty part for $12 while the foreign companies are making a quality part for $12, you will get those wanting the quality component.

    The focus of GM is making a ****ty part for the same price as a foreign quality part. It simply isn't going to pan out.

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Again, if you make a quality part for say $15 and say it is American, while foreign countries are making a quality part for $12, you will always get those willing to buy American.
    The "buy American" contingent is not large enough to keep the industry alive. Nor should it be. Getting the most bang for your buck is what capitalism is all about.

    But if you make a ****ty part for $12 while the foreign companies are making a quality part for $12, you will get those wanting the quality component.
    The disparity in quality between American and foreign automobiles has closed. Ford in particular makes some great cars. The problem is they're stuck in a time warp because they can't be as flexible and adaptive as companies that aren't weighted down with the waste of the UAW.

    The focus of GM is making a ****ty part for the same price as a foreign quality part. It simply isn't going to pan out.
    What'll drive the American automobile if it is to be preserved is fresh ideas and innovation. We've lost that edge.

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A bill to let Big Government set your salary

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    The "buy American" contingent is not large enough to keep the industry alive. Nor should it be. Getting the most bang for your buck is what capitalism is all about.
    It would be greater than what they got now is my point. I won't say if it will be enough, simply it would put them in a better position than now.


    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    The disparity in quality between American and foreign automobiles has closed. Ford in particular makes some great cars. The problem is they're stuck in a time warp because they can't be as flexible and adaptive as companies that aren't weighted down with the waste of the UAW.
    IMO, at least Ford (At least for now) has refused the bailout money which makes them a company for Americans to support. The ball is in their court to innovate now and play on the fact they didn't accept a bailout. Personally, I think any of the companies that accepted the bailout money are done for.


    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    What'll drive the American automobile if it is to be preserved is fresh ideas and innovation. We've lost that edge.
    I can't argue there and right now Ford is in the prime position for this to work for them, but I agree they need to spend money on innovation.

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

    Why are we arguing about the Constitutionality of this? The bill is predicated upon an unconstitutional bailout. It's like telling someone not to take your plasma screen after they've raped your wife. The damage is already done. The Constitution means nothing to these people.

    I mean, as long as they're going to engage in unconstitutional practices they might as well stick it to these panhandlers. You want government money? Well guess what, the government is going to stick its collective arm so far up your ass you'll wish you'd never asked. It's a good message to send to American businesses. Don't ask for a bailout unless you want the government breathing down your neck.

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Why are we arguing about the Constitutionality of this? The bill is predicated upon an unconstitutional bailout. It's like telling someone not to take your plasma screen after they've raped your wife. The damage is already done. The Constitution means nothing to these people.

    I mean, as long as they're going to engage in unconstitutional practices they might as well stick it to these panhandlers. You want government money? Well guess what, the government is going to stick its collective arm so far up your ass you'll wish you'd never asked. It's a good message to send to American businesses. Don't ask for a bailout unless you want the government breathing down your neck.
    Well if it is unconstitutional, why don't you make up a lawsuit and prove it.

    There are hundreds of thousands of CONSERVATIVE lawyers that can't bring a lawsuit of ANYTYPE of unconstitutionality. But I guess you as an internet poster know more than they do.

    Carry on.

    BTW just for record I don't agree with what Obama is doing on the bailouts, but it obviously isn't unconstitutional or it would have been brought up and knocked down.

    So as an internet poster, sorry, you carry no credibility to your claims.

    As much as I agreed the Patriot Act was unconstitutional, it was deemed constitutional. Saying it is unconstitutional, doesn't make it so.
    Last edited by TheNextEra; 04-01-09 at 10:14 PM.

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

    Well if it is unconstitutional, why don't you make up a lawsuit and prove it.
    Since when is winning a lawsuit a determination of proof?

    There are hundreds of thousands of CONSERVATIVE lawyers that can't bring a lawsuit of ANYTYPE of unconstitutionality. But I guess you as an internet poster know more than they do.
    These CONSERVATIVE lawyers certainly could initiate a lawsuit. The only problem is the Supreme Court's understanding of the US Constitution is almost as bad as yours. Wait, let me guess, is this the part where you make an appeal to authority by aggrandizing the sage wisdom of the Supreme Court? I mean, it's not like the SCOTUS has ever been wrong...

    Carry on.
    Okay?

    BTW just for record I don't agree with what Obama is doing on the bailouts
    Don't care.

    but it obviously isn't unconstitutional or it would have been brought up and knocked down.
    Oh, obviously, because we all know every unconstitutional practice or program was immediately struck down by the SCOTUS.

    So as an internet poster, sorry, you carry no credibility to your claims.
    Ad hominem.

    As much as I agreed the Patriot Act was unconstitutional, it was deemed constitutional.
    Of course, because the SCOTUS says so. They're infallible.

    Saying it is unconstitutional, doesn't make it so.
    Unless it's the SCOTUS.
    Last edited by Ethereal; 04-01-09 at 11:13 PM.

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    These CONSERVATIVE lawyers certainly could initiate a lawsuit. The only problem is the Supreme Court's understanding of the US Constitution is almost as bad as yours. Wait, let me guess, is this the part where you make an appeal to authority by aggrandizing the sage wisdom of the Supreme Court? I mean, it's not like the SCOTUS has ever been wrong...
    The problem is the politicization of the Supreme Court which has happened since presidents started blatantly and actively breaking the rule of law established by the Constitution (*cough*cough*Roosevelt*cough*)

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    Since when is winning a lawsuit a determination of proof?
    According to those that said what Bush did was illegal in regards to the Iraq War, the opposition said take him to court and if they couldn't Bush was innocent. So what is this any different?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    These CONSERVATIVE lawyers certainly could initiate a lawsuit. The only problem is the Supreme Court's understanding of the US Constitution is almost as bad as yours. Wait, let me guess, is this the part where you make an appeal to authority by aggrandizing the sage wisdom of the Supreme Court? I mean, it's not like the SCOTUS has ever been wrong...
    So you are saying you have a better understanding of the Constitution than ALL of the Supreme court justices?

    The rest of your post shows your lack of understanding about the legal system of America. I'll leave it at that. If there was something illegal, it would have been brought up at least.

    Only you, a simple internet poster, is challenging the claims among all other conservative lawyers that would love to crucify Obama for anything.

    So don't take this the wrong way, but you mean NOTHING your partisan claims. Thank you for playing.

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

    Quote Originally Posted by BulletWounD View Post
    The problem is the politicization of the Supreme Court which has happened since presidents started blatantly and actively breaking the rule of law established by the Constitution (*cough*cough*Roosevelt*cough*)
    Um Ex-President Bush had 2 appointments. So you can't excuse the Supreme court of being liberal, especially since one of the appointments was to replace a judge that voted liberal most of the time (Rehnquist)

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    Re: Beyond AIG: A Bill to let Big Government Set Your Salary

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    Um Ex-President Bush had 2 appointments. So you can't excuse the Supreme court of being liberal, especially since one of the appointments was to replace a judge that voted liberal most of the time (Rehnquist)
    The Supreme Court needs to go back to it's intended purpose, to interpret the Constitution as strictly as possible. It's the conservative view which is closest to what the founders intended. American Liberals tend to believe that the Constitution is a "living document" and can be interpreted any way they please, essentially making it meaningless. We might as well just tear it up right now and throw it in the trash.

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