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Thread: Call for higher circumcision rate

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Canadian-bloke View Post
    I already refuted them you you refusing to aacknowledge that Intact Europe and Japan has the lowest STD rates in the world
    No, you did not refute them. You showed that there are lower STD rates in other countries that happen to practice circumcision less. That does not refute anything. You need to show causation, not just correlation.

    the foreskin is an integral part of the penis with blodd vessels, lymph vessels and nerves I and and another poster already listed the functions looks like you ignored them
    I saw them. I also pointed out that most on that list were not applicable to humans because we wear clothing that performs the same functions.

    I don't care about blood and lymph vessels nor do I care about nerves. Those structures do not determine usefulness of a flap of skin.

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    Female circumcision removes the functionality of the genitals. It is a total excision of the clitorus for the express purpose of stopping pleasure from sex.

    Male circumcision does no such damage to sexual functions and even has hygeine benefits.
    you are making the same exact excuses like the FGM happy folks in Africa and some parts of the islamic world

    "It's our religion. We pray, we do fasting, we do circumcision. For 14 centuries of Islam, our mothers and grandmothers have performed this operation. Those who are not circumcised get AIDS easily."

    [Sheik Yusef Badry, in news report "Egyptian Court Allows Female Circumcision," Toronto Globe & Mail, June 25, 1997]


    Common Denominators Between Male & Female "Circumcision"

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    "One (doctor) said that he talked to every woman who came to him for this purpose (circumcision of their daughter), explaining the consequences and saying that it was unnecessary, but found they insisted upon having it done, so he complies. His justification was that he did it in a hygienic way and lost nothing by it, on the contrary, he gained money. But he overlooked the fact that he is acting unethically…instead of being a model of enlightenment for others; one can only assume that he is simply pursuing his own interests. The negative effect of this is that when we try to convince women that this operation is not necessary, they immediately reply that doctors do it, therefore it must be a good thing."

    [Dr. Asma El Dareer, Sudanese physician, interview, p. 99, Prisoners of Ritual: Odyssey into Female Genital Circumcision in Africa, Hanny Lightfoot-Klein, 1989]

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    No, you did not refute them. You showed that there are lower STD rates in other countries that happen to practice circumcision less. That does not refute anything. You need to show causation, not just correlation.
    circumcision does not reduced the chances of STDs contraception and sex education and monogamy is more effective



    I saw them. I also pointed out that most on that list were not applicable to humans because we wear clothing that performs the same functions.

    I don't care about blood and lymph vessels nor do I care about nerves. Those structures do not determine usefulness of a flap of skin.

    how are they not applicable to humans? that useless flap of skin averages 15 square inches in adult men and how is it not usefull? i list the functions appearently you don't like anything that contradict your obsession in removing foreskins
    Last edited by Canadian-bloke; 06-23-09 at 05:56 PM.

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Canadian-bloke View Post
    you are making the same exact excuses like the FGM happy folks in Africa and some parts of the islamic world

    "It's our religion. We pray, we do fasting, we do circumcision. For 14 centuries of Islam, our mothers and grandmothers have performed this operation. Those who are not circumcised get AIDS easily."

    [Sheik Yusef Badry, in news report "Egyptian Court Allows Female Circumcision," Toronto Globe & Mail, June 25, 1997]


    Common Denominators Between Male & Female "Circumcision"

    Template

    "One (doctor) said that he talked to every woman who came to him for this purpose (circumcision of their daughter), explaining the consequences and saying that it was unnecessary, but found they insisted upon having it done, so he complies. His justification was that he did it in a hygienic way and lost nothing by it, on the contrary, he gained money. But he overlooked the fact that he is acting unethically…instead of being a model of enlightenment for others; one can only assume that he is simply pursuing his own interests. The negative effect of this is that when we try to convince women that this operation is not necessary, they immediately reply that doctors do it, therefore it must be a good thing."

    [Dr. Asma El Dareer, Sudanese physician, interview, p. 99, Prisoners of Ritual: Odyssey into Female Genital Circumcision in Africa, Hanny Lightfoot-Klein, 1989]
    No, those are not even close to the same arguments I have made for circumcision.

    I have not made the first religious argument.

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Canadian-bloke View Post
    circumcision does not reduced the chances of STDs contraception and sex education and monogamy is more effective
    Studies disagree with you. STD transmission rate is reduced by 50% in circumcised males.

    Just because one practice is more effective, the effectiveness of the other practice is not negated. Try logic.



    how are they not applicable to humans? that useless flap of skin averages 15 square inches in adult men and how is it not usefull? i list the functions appearently you don't like anything that contradict your obsession in removing foreskins
    I know you need to use ad homs such as "obsession with removing foreskins" to feel like you are making a point, but I assure you, it's not helping your argument. An attempt to vilify rather than rationally debate the points is noticed. Now if you please, keep it to the topic. Helpful debating hint: I am not the topic.

    Now moving on, of the functions you listed, the majority were for protective purposes. Those same purposes are achieved by the wearing of clothing rendering the usefulness of the foreskin void. I also don't care about the size of the foreskin on an adult male. Size of the foreskin does not translate into usefulness.

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Studies disagree with you. STD transmission rate is reduced by 50% in circumcised males.

    Just because one practice is more effective, the effectiveness of the other practice is not negated. Try logic.

    bogus studies used on African males where poverty, lack of education, lack of health care, poor hygeine and superstitions are large factors in spreading of STDs





    I know you need to use ad homs such as "obsession with removing foreskins" to feel like you are making a point, but I assure you, it's not helping your argument. An attempt to vilify rather than rationally debate the points is noticed. Now if you please, keep it to the topic. Helpful debating hint: I am not the topic.

    Now moving on, of the functions you listed, the majority were for protective purposes. Those same purposes are achieved by the wearing of clothing rendering the usefulness of the foreskin void. I also don't care about the size of the foreskin on an adult male. Size of the foreskin does not translate into usefulness.
    yes you do have a strong obsession with foreskin removal treating like it is a disease that must be removed from all males and is shocked and disgusted that there are people that defends to right of males to remain intact

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Canadian-bloke View Post
    bogus studies used on African males where poverty, lack of education, lack of health care, poor hygeine and superstitions are large factors in spreading of STDs
    Well point to some specific methodology in the studies which makes them bogus, otherwise, you are just presenting opinion. Facts, please.



    yes you do have a strong obsession with foreskin removal treating like it is a disease that must be removed from all males and is shocked and disgusted that there are people that defends to right of males to remain intact
    I'm neither shocked nor disgusted that you defend against circumcision. I don't really care what your motivations are as I am not discussing you, but the topic of circumcision.

    Your presentation of me as obsessed belies a position which is long on emotional hysteria and short on facts. Otherwise, you would be discussing the thread topic and not me.

    Would you like to return to the topic or would you like to make suppositions about my mental health that will subsequently find the report feature being used to curb the ad homs you toss out?

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Well point to some specific methodology in the studies which makes them bogus, otherwise, you are just presenting opinion. Facts, please.

    Circumcision and HIV

    Circumcision and HIV






    I'm neither shocked nor disgusted that you defend against circumcision. I don't really care what your motivations are as I am not discussing you, but the topic of circumcision.

    Your presentation of me as obsessed belies a position which is long on emotional hysteria and short on facts. Otherwise, you would be discussing the thread topic and not me.

    Would you like to return to the topic or would you like to make suppositions about my mental health that will subsequently find the report feature being used to curb the ad homs you toss out?


    i am discussing the facts

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Canadian-bloke View Post

    A perusal of the one link that did work at "circumstitions.com" (no bias there), did not reveal any analysis of the methodology of the studies I quoted. What I saw were restatement of the study that attempted to mitigate it's findings with emotion and hysteria. Much like the counter arguments in this thread.

    Now if I missed something, because admittedly I'm not going to read that entire website mining for a quote that backs you up in your argument, please point me to the specific sections which show why you think the methodology is faulty.


    i am discussing the facts
    If we kep it that way from here on, there won't be any problems, now will there?

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    they are faulty because they use Africa where poverty, and lack of modern facilities, lack of education and superstitions and diseases like malaria contribute to the spread of STDs. poverty breeds diseases that's common sense

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