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Thread: Call for higher circumcision rate

  1. #171
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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Incorrect. It simply said "Degradation of appearance or function". Said nothing about "change of appearance = degradation of appearance", you just added that in there yourself. Cutting off part of the penis that has a function most certainly degrades the appearance and function.
    Yes, it says degradation of appearance. The issue here is there is no clear cut degradation of appearance. Degradation means being changed to a lower or less respected state. However, this is a completley subjective term as has been shown here many feel it enhances, not degrades, the appearance of the penis.

    The only way one can say that the snipping of the foreskin unequiviocally equals a degradation of appearance is to have the stance that ANY change to somethings appearance is considered to be a degradation, in which case the above examples apply.

    Elsewise, it does not. YOU may feel it degrades the appearance, while others do not. In that case it would be functionally factual for you to say that YOU believe it is Mutiliation, but it would be factually INCORRECT to state that categorically it is TECHNICALLY Mutilation because it does not adhere to the definition of it.

    YOU may view it as mutilation all you want, many people view piercing ears as mutilation as well. However, it is factually incorrect to state it as an absolute FACT that it is mutilation because it is not a majorly held opinion that it degrades the appearance of said organ.

  2. #172
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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Yes, it says degradation of appearance. The issue here is there is no clear cut degradation of appearance. Degradation means being changed to a lower or less respected state. However, this is a completley subjective term as has been shown here many feel it enhances, not degrades, the appearance of the penis.

    The only way one can say that the snipping of the foreskin unequiviocally equals a degradation of appearance is to have the stance that ANY change to somethings appearance is considered to be a degradation, in which case the above examples apply.

    Elsewise, it does not. YOU may feel it degrades the appearance, while others do not. In that case it would be functionally factual for you to say that YOU believe it is Mutiliation, but it would be factually INCORRECT to state that categorically it is TECHNICALLY Mutilation because it does not adhere to the definition of it.

    YOU may view it as mutilation all you want, many people view piercing ears as mutilation as well. However, it is factually incorrect to state it as an absolute FACT that it is mutilation because it is not a majorly held opinion that it degrades the appearance of said organ.
    Appearance or function. It degrades BOTH. You cut off something that does have a function, thus not only degrading the function of it, but eliminating it altogether.

    You can try all you want to make cutting off a body part sound "okay", but it's just not. Especially not for someone who cannot consent to it. If adolescents or adults want to cut off part of their own penis, so be it. They can have at it. Just like they can get tattooed or pierced, etc. But parents should not be making PERMANENT decisions like that for their child for non-medical reasons. We would balk at a parent who pierced their infant's penis. We would balk at a parent who pierced their infant's nipples. Or bellybutton (and those things aren't permanent!!) We would balk at a parent who performed female circumcision. (Which is exactly the same as male circumcision) We would balk at a parent who would tattoo their infant. There's no reason to just accept a parent who would remove part of their infant boy's penis for no life threatening reason.
    Last edited by rivrrat; 03-31-09 at 12:42 PM.

  3. #173
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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    ...a parent who would remove part of their infant boy's penis...
    When you put it that way, it sounds so bad.

    I mean, really, who in their right mind would sign-up to have part of their penis removed?

  4. #174
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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Balking is one thing. It all comes down to you (general you, not you personally) judging the decisions of other people. And it's really none of anyone's business. It comes down to parental rights to make choices for their children. I chose when to cut his hair for the first time. I choose when he gets to eat candy. I choose his bed time. I make choices on his education. I make choices on his medical care. He's in my care, and I make responsible choices for his well being.

    I assume you're a pro-choice woman (I am, too). We make sure women have the right to end the life of a fetus without any concern as to whether or not that child wanted their LIFE. Yet, we're hung up here on the choice to remove a foreskin. I'd ask every man here whose had a circumcision: Would you rather have made the choice yourself and faced the procedure tomorrow, or are you glad it's over and done with and you have no memory of it? I have never met a man yet who wishes he had his foreskin back. To be fair, I know men who have the skin and are glad. The only guys who ever seem to want to make a change are the ones uncut. Frankly, as long as it gets the job done, I think most don't really care one way or the other.
    Quote Originally Posted by soccerboy22 View Post
    You guys are weird.

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    When you put it that way, it sounds so bad.

    I mean, really, who in their right mind would sign-up to have part of their penis removed?
    Dude, this is the internet. I bet there's a lot of wierdos out there who would sign up for that and youtube it.
    Quote Originally Posted by soccerboy22 View Post
    You guys are weird.

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by StandUpChuck View Post
    I'd ask every man here whose had a circumcision: Would you rather have made the choice yourself and faced the procedure tomorrow, or are you glad it's over and done with and you have no memory of it?
    I would rather have been able to make the choice and not face circumcision tomorrow.


    With this question, you're assuming that men with foreskins would actually choose circumcision. That's highly unlikely, since the vast majority of uncircumcised men flat-out cringe at the very idea of circumcision.

    The problem here is, that the circumcised men are offered no choice, while uncircumcised men would almost never make teh choice that is made for circumcized men.

    I have tons of family from Ireland, and they think it's barbaric.

    But then again, they all have theirs.

    The arguments about cleanliness and such are totally moot with them because, unlike the vast majority of those who support circumcision, they actually know exactly what having a foreskin entails and that teh arguments for it are almost all total bull****.

    I watched a friend argue this issue with a woman who told him that it was uncleanly and that it cases urinary tract infections and such and his response was "Odd. I've never had to deal with anything remotely close to that stuff!"

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by StandUpChuck View Post
    Dude, this is the internet. I bet there's a lot of wierdos out there who would sign up for that and youtube it.
    I bolded the important word there. Nobody of sound mind would sign-up.

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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    I would rather have been able to make the choice and not face circumcision tomorrow.


    With this question, you're assuming that men with foreskins would actually choose circumcision. That's highly unlikely, since the vast majority of uncircumcised men flat-out cringe at the very idea of circumcision.

    The problem here is, that the circumcised men are offered no choice, while uncircumcised men would almost never make teh choice that is made for circumcized men.

    I have tons of family from Ireland, and they think it's barbaric.

    But then again, they all have theirs.

    The arguments about cleanliness and such are totally moot with them because, unlike the vast majority of those who support circumcision, they actually know exactly what having a foreskin entails and that teh arguments for it are almost all total bull****.

    I watched a friend argue this issue with a woman who told him that it was uncleanly and that it cases urinary tract infections and such and his response was "Odd. I've never had to deal with anything remotely close to that stuff!"

    I'm reading your serious response and thinking, and then I looked up and saw your title line under your name.

    My question would have been posed to those who have already been cut.

    Europe has different ways of keeping clean than most American households. And they have different standards of clean (not saying better or worse). I don't know if one cleans their foreskin in a bidet (I hope never to find out) or IIRC most have handheld showers where one can get at various body parts easier. Europeans might not wash their hair everyday like Americans do, but they do tend to keep their genitals pretty darned clean.

    I also think no matter what your customs or standards, some people are more prone to infection or other nasty genatalia issues (cannot specify as I'm eating at the moment), so for some, it may be in their best interest to take precautions that other might not have to.
    Last edited by StandUpChuck; 03-31-09 at 01:42 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by soccerboy22 View Post
    You guys are weird.

  9. #179
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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Farts with Chunks = = Sharts

    Human Taxidermist - - now offering his services for all your loved ones
    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    How the hell did you just tie in a retroactive reparative measure with a proactive preventative measure. Not even close to being the same thing.

  10. #180
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    Re: Call for higher circumcision rate

    Quote Originally Posted by StandUpChuck View Post
    I'm reading your serious response and thinking, and then I looked up and saw your title line under your name.

    My question would have been posed to those who have already been cut.

    Europe has different ways of keeping clean than most American households. And they have different standards of clean (not saying better or worse). I don't know if one cleans their foreskin in a bidet (I hope never to find out) or IIRC most have handheld showers where one can get at various body parts easier. Europeans might not wash their hair everyday like Americans do, but they do tend to keep their genitals pretty darned clean.

    I also think no matter what your customs or standards, some people are more prone to infection or other nasty genatalia issues (cannot specify as I'm eating at the moment), so for some, it may be in their best interest to take precautions that other might not have to.
    I answered the question as someone who had been snipped, and then expanded on it based on what I've heard from friends and family who have a complete wanger.

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