• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Senate Democrats to scrap Obama's $400 tax credit

RightinNYC

Girthless
DP Veteran
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Messages
25,893
Reaction score
12,484
Location
New York, NY
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
Senate Democrats to scrap Obama's $400 tax credit

A top Democrat in the Senate announced a budget blueprint Tuesday that would scrap Barack Obama's signature tax cut after 2010 and blends sleight of hand with modest restraint on domestic programs to cut the deficit to sustainable levels.

Senate Budget Committee Chairman Kent Conrad, D-N.D., promises to reduce the deficit from a projected $1.7 trillion this year to a still-high $508 billion in 2014. But to do so, he assumes Congress will let Obama's "Making Work Pay" tax credit delivering $400 tax cuts to most workers and $800 to couples will expire at the end of next year. Those tax cuts were included in Obama's stimulus package.

So "cut taxes for 95% of Americans" actually meant "two-time stimulus payments for something more like 80% of Americans before we allow that and the Bush tax cuts to expire, thus raising taxes on the majority of people."

Hm.
 
WASHINGTON (AP) - A top Democrat in the Senate announced a budget blueprint Tuesday that would scrap Barack Obama's signature tax cut after 2010 and blends sleight of hand with modest restraint on domestic programs to cut the deficit to sustainable levels.

Senate Democrats to scrap Obama's $400 tax credit

Hopefully we are all making enough by then to afford some taxes.
 
Senate Democrats to scrap Obama's $400 tax credit



So "cut taxes for 95% of Americans" actually meant "two-time stimulus payments for something more like 80% of Americans before we allow that and the Bush tax cuts to expire, thus raising taxes on the majority of people."

Hm.

So no tax cut is ever good unless it's permanent? Really, there's no way that Obama can win with some people unless he just abolishes all taxes and dissolves the country into anarchy... :roll:

The stimulus tax credits are designed to spur the economy during a severe recession and are not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date. Bush's tax cut was designed to do, well, I'm not quite sure what...but that also was not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date.

That does not preclude Obama or Congress from altering the tax code again when the Bush tax cuts expire. They tinker with the tax code nearly every year anyway. I would expect to see some tax cuts for the non-wealthy in the tax code after 2010.
 
So no tax cut is ever good unless it's permanent? Really, there's no way that Obama can win with some people unless he just abolishes all taxes and dissolves the country into anarchy... :roll:

The stimulus tax credits are designed to spur the economy during a severe recession and are not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date. Bush's tax cut was designed to do, well, I'm not quite sure what...but that also was not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date.

That does not preclude Obama or Congress from altering the tax code again when the Bush tax cuts expire. They tinker with the tax code nearly every year anyway. I would expect to see some tax cuts for the non-wealthy in the tax code after 2010.

The problem is that this continuous tickling of the tax code by everyone helps produce market instability.

One year your paying more the next your paying less.

No doubt we are going into another boom, bust cycle.
 
The problem is that this continuous tickling of the tax code by everyone helps produce market instability.

One year your paying more the next your paying less.

No doubt we are going into another boom, bust cycle.

Oh I agree that the politicians tinker with the tax code far too much...but that's the nature of democracy. Every time we elect a new Congress or President, they want to undo what the previous Congress or President did. And there's no easier place to do that than in the Tax Code.
 
Oh I agree that the politicians tinker with the tax code far too much...but that's the nature of democracy. Every time we elect a new Congress or President, they want to undo what the previous Congress or President did. And there's no easier place to do that than in the Tax Code.

I try to refrain from blaming Obama for everything even though I completely disagree with him.

Most of the foul stuff is coming from Congress, they have to really make some better choices like permanently fixing the tax rate.
At this point I'd accept something progressive just so we don't keep screwing with the system itself.

That should help level out the boom bust cycles we deal with, most of which can be attributed to changes in regulation and taxation.
 
Last edited:
Senate Democrats to scrap Obama's $400 tax credit



So "cut taxes for 95% of Americans" actually meant "two-time stimulus payments for something more like 80% of Americans before we allow that and the Bush tax cuts to expire, thus raising taxes on the majority of people."

Hm.

I'm not claiming that this is going to be a popular decision, but with all of the spending that's going on, I don't see how any meaningful tax cuts are going to be considered for the long term. That debt has to be paid somehow. My only hope is that the higher taxes are truly implemented across the board, including the corporate sector. No more corporate socialism, and maybe the debt will get knocked down a bit.

The stimulus payments are useless, like they always are. No one is going to care if they get $400 if their income tax is through the roof.

Another campaign promise is broken. Are we surprised? All politicians running for office say they'll cut taxes. It's universal. Do you think Obama would have been elected if he revealed his stimulus plans combined with long term higher taxation? No way Jose.
 
So no tax cut is ever good unless it's permanent? Really, there's no way that Obama can win with some people unless he just abolishes all taxes and dissolves the country into anarchy... :roll:

The stimulus tax credits are designed to spur the economy during a severe recession and are not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date. Bush's tax cut was designed to do, well, I'm not quite sure what...but that also was not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date.

But this wasn't sold as a stimulus tax credit, it was sold as a "tax cut."

I'm not saying it needs to be permanent, but when someone says they will "cut taxes," that IMO does not mean "two-time stimulus payment."
 
But this wasn't sold as a stimulus tax credit, it was sold as a "tax cut."

I'm not saying it needs to be permanent, but when someone says they will "cut taxes," that IMO does not mean "two-time stimulus payment."

What makes you think that the two-time stimulus payment was what he had in mind when he offered tax cuts to the middle class? He was talking about middle-class tax cuts even BEFORE the economy imploded last fall.

It sounds to me like two completely different policy items. The fact that he's doing one does not preclude him from also doing the other.
 
Ahh, change from politics as usual. All this Administration has done is reaffirm to me that the trick to politics is simple. Lie your ass off, tell people exactly what they want to hear, don't give two ****s about principles unless you think those principles are what people want to hear, and then when you get in always find some reason to go back on those promises and you're die hard supporters will always be there to make excuses for you.

Thank you Barak Obama, you've TRULY brought CHANGE to Politics as Usual. :roll:
 
Zyphlin posted(Thank you Barak Obama, you've TRULY brought CHANGE to Politics as Usual.)

And the amazing thing about this is because a Lawyer (who is extremely proficient with language as well as the technical ability to persuade people that this time it will be different) gives the message "Change---Something we can believe in" an alarming number of people are stupid enough to believe it.

A Politician is always a liar, else one would never be elected.
A Lawyer uses words to bend peoples perception of the actuality of life to his/her way of thinking.
In a way they are very similar to Advertisers.
Do Americans trust Lawyers?
Seemingly the answer is a resounding YES.
The electorate has it in their remit to change politics, they will never unite to do it.
 
Remember Bush 1 he said read my lips that he would not raise taxes in his campaign then raised them.That was good for 1 term,the next election the people dumped him.
 
What makes you think that the two-time stimulus payment was what he had in mind when he offered tax cuts to the middle class? He was talking about middle-class tax cuts even BEFORE the economy imploded last fall.

It sounds to me like two completely different policy items. The fact that he's doing one does not preclude him from also doing the other.

I'm assuming that "A top Democrat in the Senate announced a budget blueprint Tuesday that would scrap Barack Obama's signature tax cut after 2010" means that he's not doing the latter.
 
I'm assuming that "A top Democrat in the Senate announced a budget blueprint Tuesday that would scrap Barack Obama's signature tax cut after 2010" means that he's not doing the latter.

Considering Obama does not yet even HAVE a signature tax cut to scrap, that sounds more like ****ty reporting than a renunciation of a campaign promise.
 
Considering Obama does not yet even HAVE a signature tax cut to scrap, that sounds more like ****ty reporting than a renunciation of a campaign promise.

? I don't think there's that much more to it.

He campaigned on a promise to cut taxes for 95% of families.
The way in which that was going to happen was via his "Making Work Pay" tax credit.
The tax credit was supposed to be included in the budget.
The tax credit was cut from the budget, with no indication that it will be restored.

I'm not saying that he called up Harry Reid and told him to cut it, I'm just saying that as it stands, he will not be cutting taxes for 95% of families as was promised.

If he somehow manages to convince Reid to add it back in, or if he says "hey guys, things are tight, we'll add it back next year" and then does, then by all means, I'll update this. I just don't see either of those happening.
 
Senate Democrats to scrap Obama's $400 tax credit



So "cut taxes for 95% of Americans" actually meant "two-time stimulus payments for something more like 80% of Americans before we allow that and the Bush tax cuts to expire, thus raising taxes on the majority of people."

Hm.

I had to LMAO at this one: Chairman Kent Conrad, D-N.D., promises to reduce the deficit from a projected $1.7 trillion this year to a still-high $508 billion in 2014

By the way, who in here really thinks the Dems can get the cuts they need through efficiency and eliminating Government waste? :rofl
 
Remember Bush 1 he said read my lips that he would not raise taxes in his campaign then raised them.That was good for 1 term,the next election the people dumped him.

There's more to the story too. He was dealing with a Democrat Congress that forced him to go back on his words.

It was unfortunate that after he lost the election, his predecessor did just that again, raised taxes. It is ironic that Democrats seem to get away with the indefensible and are very good at pinning the blame in the citizen’s minds that it's the Republicans fault.
 
So no tax cut is ever good unless it's permanent? Really, there's no way that Obama can win with some people unless he just abolishes all taxes and dissolves the country into anarchy... :roll:

That is not the point; tax cuts are great in my opinion when NOT accompanied by careless Government spending and are across the board and meaningful.

But it is the epitome of irresponsibility to pass $1.7 trillion in spending deficits without an HONEST open debate about how to pay for it all.

The stimulus tax credits are designed to spur the economy during a severe recession and are not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date. Bush's tax cut was designed to do, well, I'm not quite sure what...but that also was not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date.

These tax credits will do NOTHING to spur spending. Do yuo honestly think that giving people what amounts to less than $100 a month will somehow miraculously spur economic growth?

That does not preclude Obama or Congress from altering the tax code again when the Bush tax cuts expire. They tinker with the tax code nearly every year anyway. I would expect to see some tax cuts for the non-wealthy in the tax code after 2010.

Tax cuts for the "non-wealthy" are a waste of time and effort because the "non-wealthy" pay little or nothing in taxes and spend little or nothing on goods and invest little or nothing in the economy.

This is emotional populist pabulum spewed to the masses of ignorant to appeal to the sense of goodness thus permitting an irresponsible level deficit spending and vast expanses of Government intrusion into almost every facet of our lives.
 
He campaigned on a promise to cut taxes for 95% of families.
The way in which that was going to happen was via his "Making Work Pay" tax credit.

No, the way in which it was going to happen was via an income tax rate cut.

RightinNYC said:
The tax credit was supposed to be included in the budget.

Perhaps I'm wrong about this, but I don't even remember him campaigning on this Making Work Pay thing. As far as I know, that was solely a response to the financial crisis and was formulated entirely AFTER the election. And from everything I can find about this issue, I don't see any indication that it was ever supposed to be permanent in the first place.

RightinNYC said:
The tax credit was cut from the budget, with no indication that it will be restored.

That does not preclude Obama and Congress from altering the income tax rates. In fact, they almost certainly will.

RightinNYC said:
I'm not saying that he called up Harry Reid and told him to cut it, I'm just saying that as it stands, he will not be cutting taxes for 95% of families as was promised.

Chillax. He's been in office for two months.

RightinNYC said:
If he somehow manages to convince Reid to add it back in, or if he says "hey guys, things are tight, we'll add it back next year" and then does, then by all means, I'll update this. I just don't see either of those happening.

The purpose of an economic stimulus is to stimulate the economy. If he wants to add a tax credit as an economic stimulus, it wouldn't make sense to wait until next year when the economy will likely be better.
 
No, the way in which it was going to happen was via an income tax rate cut.

Perhaps I'm wrong about this, but I don't even remember him campaigning on this Making Work Pay thing. As far as I know, that was solely a response to the financial crisis and was formulated entirely AFTER the election. And from everything I can find about this issue, I don't see any indication that it was ever supposed to be permanent in the first place.

That does not preclude Obama and Congress from altering the income tax rates. In fact, they almost certainly will.

Chillax. He's been in office for two months

The purpose of an economic stimulus is to stimulate the economy. If he wants to add a tax credit as an economic stimulus, it wouldn't make sense to wait until next year when the economy will likely be better.

The Making Work Pay Tax Cut was the cornerstone of his campaign promise to cut taxes. It's not some new stimulus proposal.

From his campaign website:

Obama’s Comprehensive Tax Policy Plan for America will:

* Cut taxes for 95 percent of workers and their families with a tax cut of $500 for workers or $1,000 for working couples.
 
Bush's tax cut was designed to do, well, I'm not quite sure what...but that also was not intended to be permanent, hence the expiration date.

Let me ask you:

1. What do regions and countries do to entice jobs and development?
2. What did Reagan do to unlock masses of wealth and the prosperity that followed?
3. Since when is it government's money?

So, as we begin, let us take inventory. We are a nation that has a government--not the other way around. And this makes us special among the nations of the Earth. Our government has no power except that granted it by the people. It is time to check and reverse the growth of government, which shows signs of having grown beyond the consent of the governed. Ronald Reagan-First Inaugural Address

YouTube - Ronald Reagan`s Funny answer
 
Yeah Right! "chillax"! They will let us know when critisizm of dear leader will be tolerated. ;)

So did you honestly expect him to have fulfilled every single campaign promise he made within the first two months of his administration?
 
1. What do regions and countries do to entice jobs and development?

Educate their people, oppose unionization, crack down on corruption, develop an infrastructure, and strike a good balance between oppressive regulations and a corporate free-for-all.

zimmer said:
2. What did Reagan do to unlock masses of wealth and the prosperity that followed?

Cut taxes from a punitive 70% top rate, and increased government spending. And even so, I wouldn't say that these policies were the principle causes of that. The main cause was globalization, driven by the collapse of communism (which opened up half the world to trade) and the internet.

zimmer said:
3. Since when is it government's money?

What do you mean? :confused:
 
The Making Work Pay Tax Cut was the cornerstone of his campaign promise to cut taxes. It's not some new stimulus proposal.

From his campaign website:

Fair enough. However, this is one of several bullet points on that website. If he fulfills the other bullets, it is still possible to cut taxes for the vast majority of Americans. Regardless, I don't see where he promised to do this all in the first two months of his administration.
 
Back
Top Bottom