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Water not recognized as a human right

Its not a right its a resource and the "idea" presented is rather absurd.
Just the legal ramifications of what it implies alone are mind numbing.


I'd have no problem with the USA agreeing to it in principle..but agreeing to it by the letter and as binding..
Hell No.
 
Grateful Heart said:
When one individual, or corporation, starts taking too much of their 'fair share' they are taken to court by the other users.
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Define "fair share".

Therein lies the problem.
 
Orius said:
Define "fair share".

Therein lies the problem.
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You want to talk about environmental destruction and waste, just make water a "right". Universal, omnipresent. "Free".

I don't think advocates of this have a clue what it would mean in the Grand Scheme.

As a "right" people will use and abuse water. Waste of magnificent proportions would result, just as it does when health care is "Free" (OPM). If it is a Right, how do you take it away when someone is wasting it?

You cannot... if it is a "Right".

They could run a garden hose 24/7/365 for 20 years and you could do nothing to stop their "Right". In fact, they could demand MORE water... because it is their "Right".

If you tell them "NO, you cannot do that, you are denying that person their Right."

It's a very silly proposition. Water as a "Right".

And we have pinheads busying themselves with this BS.
That is a waste... they should get a real job and a life.

This is what "Rights" look like.
Omnipresent and equal for all.
Exception: Military/National Security/Inciting the masses to violence.
* First Amendment – Establishment Clause, Free Exercise Clause; freedom of speech, of the press, Freedom of Religion, and of assembly; right to petition

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

* Second Amendment – Right to keep and bear arms.

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed. [6][7]

* Third Amendment – Protection from quartering of troops.

No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.

* Fourth Amendment – Protection from unreasonable search and seizure.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

* Fifth Amendment – due process, double jeopardy, self-incrimination, eminent domain.

No person shall be held to answer for any capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

* Sixth Amendment – Trial by jury and rights of the accused; Confrontation Clause, speedy trial, public trial, right to counsel

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district where in the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defense.

* Seventh Amendment – Civil trial by jury.

In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise re-examined in any court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.

* Eighth Amendment – Prohibition of excessive bail and cruel and unusual punishment.

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

* Ninth Amendment – Protection of rights not specifically enumerated in the Bill of Rights.

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

* Tenth Amendment – Powers of states and people.

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.
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Well it's obvious that water has to be under government control in some form. That yes you can choose from buying different kinds of bottle water, but it's of course not feasible to substitute all your tap water with bottle water. That it's a natural monopoly and on a vital resource. Then it comes to poor countries the big international corporations have realized the huge profit of gaining control of this natural monopoly and they have even gone so far has to ban people from collecting the rain water. That this is a practice that needs to be stopped and international treaties are necissary. But of course you still can have a fee on water and implement conservatory measures, but it's shouldn't be a private profit hungry company that has the control to make those decisions.

CBC News - Indepth: Water Privatization

World Bank’s ICSID to Hear Case on Bolivia Water Privatization
 
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air is also a right then .. how about sunlight?
 
Orius said:
Even though bottled water is still part of the larger privatization problem, I think consumer choices can still mitigate its impact; when it comes to water bills and purified water, I also have no qualms because you are paying for a service. My main concern is corporations being given the license to own a lake or a river, preventing public access.

For instance, if I decide to collect my own water and purify it myself, the privatization of lakes and rivers would prevent that. What happens when governments, under NAFTA, begin giving corporations permits to drain lakes and transport water away from entire regions for their own private profit? This is what I'm against. It has environmental as well as socioeconomic consequences.

We already saw the consequences of the Aral Sea in Russia. North America has most of the world's fresh water... if we are not careful with the resources we have, they will be squandered away by greed like everything else.

Let water companies continue billing us for their services, but let the lakes and streams themselves remain public property.
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Antartica has most of the world's fresh water.

The draining of the Aral Sea was the consequence of socialism, not capitalism.
 
Orius said:
Water not recognized as human right in forum statement



The U.S. blocked the "right" amendment because it wants water to eventually become a commodity. The U.S. is currently experiencing forseeable water shortages across the board. Under NAFTA, it could legally begin transferring water from the Great Lakes (shared by Canada) to other area of the U.S., even via corporate means, for resale.

Say hello to the future of corporatism.
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Uh, you got some proof of this? Source or link?
 
Orius said:
Define "fair share".

Therein lies the problem.
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Well, 'fair share' was a term I tossed out. 'Reasonable use' probably would have been a better phrase.

And again, there's really nothing new about this problem. It's been a heated issue for as long as people have been around. These type of problems and conflicts are exactly what our judicial system was created for. And that's why we have so many lawyers.

Water Right in water law refers to the right of a user to use water from a water source, e.g., a river, stream, pond or source of groundwater. In areas with plentiful water and few users, such systems are generally not complicated or contentious. In other areas, especially arid areas where irrigation is practiced, such systems are often the source of conflict, both legal and physical. Some systems treat surface water and ground water in the same manner, while others use different principles for each.
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Water Rights
 
Orius said:
The U.S. blocked the "right" amendment because it wants water to eventually become a commodity.
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Water IS a commodity.

The U.S. is currently experiencing forseeable water shortages across the board. Under NAFTA, it could legally begin transferring water from the Great Lakes (shared by Canada) to other area of the U.S., even via corporate means, for resale.
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So... what?
 
danarhea said:
Dear Sir:

Your account is 3 days delinquent. We would love to keep providing service to you, but your bill must be paid. Otherwise, we will have no choice but to disconnect your service. We accept MasterCard and Visa, so call one of the registered pay stations, and pay the amount you are behind. After paying your balance, call us with the receipt number, so that we won't have to issue a disconnect order.

Have a nice day,
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How is this different than what your city does when you dont pay your water bill?
 
Orius said:
My main concern is corporations being given the license to own a lake or a river, preventing public access.
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My family used to own a lake; it was part of my grandfather's business.
We had no right to restrict the public access to that lake?
 
Goobieman said:
My family used to own a lake; it was part of my grandfather's business.
We had no right to restrict the public access to that lake?
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No, and the UN says so. :mrgreen:
 
water is a not a human right, it is a commodity or good that takes man power to collect it and transport it properly, that is why no one is entitled to water. If you can cut the labor costs than it may be a right, but water most definetly takes labor to extract it properly.
 
Goobieman said:
My family used to own a lake; it was part of my grandfather's business.
We had no right to restrict the public access to that lake?
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If the lake or pond is fully contained within your property, the public would not normally have any right to access it... unless there was some easement granted.

But if that lake is part of a ground-water system shared by other property owners, or fed by a stream or river, or spills streams or rivers onto the property of adjacent landowners, then the water in the lake is governed by Water Rights. In other words, your use of the water in the lake must be reasonable and consider the rights of other users.
 
Great tasting water is one of the few things Louisiana does well. (no pun intended)

The Japanese are buying a lot of our wells. They know what's coming.

All I know is a massive river runs by three blocks away. ;)
 
I find it mind boggling how many people feel like they are entitled to everything on this big blue planet of ours. I suggest if California is going to be continue to grow in large size, instead of feel entitled to the water of the great lakes, find a more cost effective way to change sea water to fresh water.

No one has the right to water, or entitlement to water, it is a good like anything else.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
You can substitute a lot of things for water and say someone will die and it be true.

Is food a right? Is air a right? Is soap a right?
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Doesn't seem to be in France. :mrgreen:
 
Middleground said:
Without clean drinking water, a person will die in 7 days.

Are you okay with for profit corporations having that type of control???


Trailer | FLOW
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Without food, a person will die in 3 weeks. Are you okay with for-profit corporations having that type of control?
 
It seems that the concern of some is that 'corporate' control of water is dangerous.

Here's an interesting web site that discusses the pros and cons of public vs. private water providers, complete with a 200+ page report.

Aguanomics
 
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