Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 62

Thread: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

  1. #21
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    That is a serious problem, it makes me rethink any notion I have of donating to an African charity.
    I suppose, but it is a good cause to help stop the bleeding as if we cannot stop that the entire cause is doomed. What I won't support is donating to a cause that helps an area that has tribal tensions that aren't being addressed. When all of the good work can evaporate literally overnight due to tribal tensions, what long term good is there?

    They need to help fix it and not band aid it.
    It's a bit of both. Stop the bleeding while fixing the underlying problem.

    Using materials available would be a much wiser option in my opinion.
    This is how Sachs views it. Give villages the tools they need, rudimentary electricity, transportation and sanitation and they'll take care of themselves.

    Using to much technology in an non technological world has a short term life.
    Africa isn't that backward.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  2. #22
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    I suppose, but it is a good cause to help stop the bleeding as if we cannot stop that the entire cause is doomed. What I won't support is donating to a cause that helps an area that has tribal tensions that aren't being addressed. When all of the good work can evaporate literally overnight due to tribal tensions, what long term good is there?
    I would love to start a charity to deal with issues like that.
    I don't believe in messing with people that are usually described as natives though.

    The people who are already successful with their less technological society.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    It's a bit of both. Stop the bleeding while fixing the underlying problem.
    If a larger majority were taught how to slow many of their own problems then it could lead to advances in their communities I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    This is how Sachs views it. Give villages the tools they need, rudimentary electricity, transportation and sanitation and they'll take care of themselves.
    I agree for the most part. Depending on where it is I may exclude electricity and motorized transportation.

    Overall that is exactly what needs to happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Africa isn't that backward.
    I'd say some parts are mainly because no one can afford to maintain those things when aid workers leave.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  3. #23
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I agree for the most part. Depending on where it is I may exclude electricity and motorized transportation.
    Well, kids need electricity at night to study. And motorized transportation is often required to bring their crops to market. One truck for the whole village is sufficent.

    I'd say some parts are mainly because no one can afford to maintain those things when aid workers leave.
    Hence why in the process of aid, it's development. Cutting food aid would allow prices to rise allowing viable agriculture and thus revenue streams to maintain the technology. Many African nations while supporting Obama were very worried about his stance on Free Trade as much of their agriculture exports went to the US.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  4. #24
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Well, kids need electricity at night to study. And motorized transportation is often required to bring their crops to market. One truck for the whole village is sufficent.
    I think I'd start slowly, instead opting for the basics before we got to formal education. Of course that is only working with one village at a time.

    In place of a truck which requires maintenance to, I think I'd opt for draft animals.

    Goats and cows can do the same thing albeit slower. Plus they provide the benefit of food and milk.

    I'm into primitive skills as a personal hobby, so as much as it is a benefit to their survival it would just be fun to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Hence why in the process of aid, it's development. Cutting food aid would allow prices to rise allowing viable agriculture and thus revenue streams to maintain the technology. Many African nations while supporting Obama were very worried about his stance on Free Trade as much of their agriculture exports went to the US.
    They have to really start with some sort of internal sufficiency before they should think of exports, that would bring in money but you want to make sure that the money is going to the people actually doing the work.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  5. #25
    Equal Opportunity Hater
    obvious Child's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    0.0, -2.3 on the Political Compass
    Last Seen
    12-09-14 @ 11:36 PM
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,883

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I think I'd start slowly, instead opting for the basics before we got to formal education. Of course that is only working with one village at a time.
    Well, if a country doesn't have formal schooling for their kids, it's hard to produce the educated stock to develop. It doesn't need to go beyond 6 grade equivalent.

    In place of a truck which requires maintenance to, I think I'd opt for draft animals.
    I think that depends where they are. If they are 20 miles out of Nairobi, it's probably fine for a truck. If you're in the boonies well away from any city, then an animal is a better choice.

    Goats and cows can do the same thing albeit slower. Plus they provide the benefit of food and milk.
    Speaking of which, I think the charities which provide livestock are excellent ideas. $10 for a pair of Geese which find their own food and reproduce quickly into a flock. Good idea. $500 for a cow which produces milk and can breed more cows? Good idea. Charity cash and food never help development. Livestock can form a basis for agricultural development.

    They have to really start with some sort of internal sufficiency before they should think of exports, that would bring in money but you want to make sure that the money is going to the people actually doing the work.
    I suppose, but restoring the agricultural market will cause a lot more people go back into farming which solves that problem. And it's not just exports, but a farmer taking his crop and selling it in the cities. Communication like a village cell phone is great for this as it maximizes their profits by selling when prices are high.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  6. #26
    Sage
    Harry Guerrilla's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Not affiliated with other libertarians.
    Last Seen
    09-01-17 @ 02:38 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    28,955

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Well, if a country doesn't have formal schooling for their kids, it's hard to produce the educated stock to develop. It doesn't need to go beyond 6 grade equivalent.
    That is true.

    Basic math and reading combined with relevant technical skills should be sufficient.

    Later after they have developed past the basics they could go further themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    I think that depends where they are. If they are 20 miles out of Nairobi, it's probably fine for a truck. If you're in the boonies well away from any city, then an animal is a better choice.
    Your right. It really depends on the local.

    I like goats though, most people don't think of them as a beast of burden but they are pretty utilitarian.

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Speaking of which, I think the charities which provide livestock are excellent ideas. $10 for a pair of Geese which find their own food and reproduce quickly into a flock. Good idea. $500 for a cow which produces milk and can breed more cows? Good idea. Charity cash and food never help development. Livestock can form a basis for agricultural development.
    Guineas are native to Africa and they have been used in the states and Europe as a sort of free range meat animal.

    There are also more robust breeds of chickens that rival even the most vicious goose.

    McMurray Hatchery - Guineas

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    I suppose, but restoring the agricultural market will cause a lot more people go back into farming which solves that problem. And it's not just exports, but a farmer taking his crop and selling it in the cities. Communication like a village cell phone is great for this as it maximizes their profits by selling when prices are high.
    It wouldn't be a bad start. I get disappointed when I see charities wasting money on one brick building when they could be doing things such as this to improve quality of life.

    Using readily available materials to help construct buildings or introducing bamboo would help more than anything else while focusing the monetary efforts on long lasting changes every one can benefit from.

    Bamboo is a utilitarian species of plant eat it, build with it, and more.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  7. #27
    Libertarian socialist

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Staffs, England
    Last Seen
    12-01-17 @ 11:26 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    6,730

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    I think I'd start slowly, instead opting for the basics before we got to formal education. Of course that is only working with one village at a time.

    In place of a truck which requires maintenance to, I think I'd opt for draft animals.

    Goats and cows can do the same thing albeit slower. Plus they provide the benefit of food and milk.

    I'm into primitive skills as a personal hobby, so as much as it is a benefit to their survival it would just be fun to me.



    They have to really start with some sort of internal sufficiency before they should think of exports, that would bring in money but you want to make sure that the money is going to the people actually doing the work.
    Already been done. [with some sucess]. We,ve had this thing in the UK for a while called "Present Aid" where instead of buying someone a present for christmas, mothers day or whatever you buy a card representing a goat, a cow, a bicyle or something else useful and the money you pay towards that card goes towards sending the item in question to a family in the third world.

    Present Aid - Buy an ethical gift

  8. #28
    Educating the Ignorant
    zimmer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Last Seen
    Today @ 04:33 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    14,414
    Blog Entries
    12

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa - WSJ.com
    MARCH 21, 2009I have been thinking this for quite some time although I think most charity should also be removed to help reign in the populations of Africa.

    What do you think?
    I think President Obama set the example with his half-bro in Kenya.
    A buck a month ought to be enough.
    Zero coming from The President himself.

    Seriously, I had a friend who spent three decades working all over the African continent for the UN, and I suggested he write a book about his experiences... He said he'd end up dead if he did, and I could clearly see he wasn't making a lighthearted statement.

    After listening to him for hours speak about his experiences, the first thing that that comes to mind is to get rid of the rampant corruption. A monumental task that will take generations if they are lucky.

    Then there is education, also a challenge that will take generations.
    Culture: some parts need to be civilized, there no other way to put it.

    It's not a money problem, it's a matter of wholesale change.

    Part of the solution is to get the masses working in agriculture where possible, and this is where genetically altered crops are brilliant.
    For that the US and EU have to realize Africa could and should be a major competitor.
    Time to slash subsidies on both sides of the Atlantic.

    Such a continent of riches, such a long way to go.

    I haven't been there but it looks like I'll be on my way there shortly.

    Should prove interesting, especially the region I'm heading to.

    .
    Last edited by zimmer; 03-22-09 at 12:36 PM.
    The Clintons are what happens...
    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

  9. #29
    Professor

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:41 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    1,610

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    Then it comes to Africas problem you also have to recognize the responsibility that EU and USA have. That EU and USA gives massive aid to their own agricultural sector. That at the same time they protect their own markets with tarrifs and quotas. So making international trade fairer would do a lot to increase international trade and development. That at the same time aid becomes more efficient and focused.

  10. #30
    Sage
    Laila's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Last Seen
    04-28-17 @ 01:48 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    10,095

    Re: Why Foreign Aid Is Hurting Africa

    I'd cut all aid to Africa tbh, as long as the West gives them aid for nothing then they will grow dependent on it and will not be pushed to become self reliant.
    Everything else will fall into place, yes i'm sure people will suffer but in the long run ... You have to be cruel to be kind

    I'd also quit giving aid to Somalia, all it does is fund more guns for the warlords. Rarely does aid actually get to those who need it. I recall times where US and UN food had to be brought by the Somalis when it was meant to be for free just so some warlords could get money


Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •