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Thread: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by Felicity View Post
    The sin was original sin, and the result is part of the struggle that is people not treating others with the respect they are due, and people not being treated with respect. In other words (as JPII thoroughly explains in his letter): Both man and woman are wounded by sin and one of the wounds to both is misogyny--it harms BOTH the misogynist, an those on the receiving end.
    Right, but rather than rid the church of misogyny you defend its practice. Make excuses for it, apologize for it, fail to see it for what it is, and presume I'm a bigot for not accepting rhetoric such as, "Women are different and they can't hold the same jobs as men in the church. Don't worry this doesn't mean men are better it just means women are barred from reaching any significant level within the male dominated hierarchy in the Catholic faith. This is not prejudice, it is God's will..."

    This is like saying women can't be President. Not because we are discriminating against women but because it is NOT in their womanly nature to be President. For all of history Presidents have been men in the US. But don't worry women can do other things.

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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post

    When women wanted to vote and were not allowed I'm sure it didn't mean diddly squat to them that there were plenty of things they were allowed to do other than voting.
    http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive...679C946296D6CF

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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    Right, but rather than rid the church of misogyny you defend its practice. Make excuses for it, apologize for it, fail to see it for what it is, and presume I'm a bigot for not accepting rhetoric such as, "Women are different and they can't hold the same jobs as men in the church. Don't worry this doesn't mean men are better it just means women are barred from reaching any significant level within the male dominated hierarchy in the Catholic faith. This is not prejudice, it is God's will..."

    This is like saying women can't be President. Not because we are discriminating against women but because it is NOT in their womanly nature to be President. For all of history Presidents have been men in the US. But don't worry women can do other things.
    Religion is not politics.

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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by Felicity View Post
    Name calling, my dear. You call the Church hateful and misogynistic. I am part of that Church. Do you consider me a "woman hater?"
    I know lots of people in the Catholic faith. I know many women who will readily admit it's a male dominated hierarchy and they just put up with it while hoping and praying the church eventually evolves into something that is relevant in this century.

    I don't consider you a woman hater. I'm not sure if you believe a woman's role is to be submissive or if you are just so blind by loyalty that you will defend your church in the face of any and all criticism. But it really doesn't matter as my criticisms are of the church and not yours to be taken personally. If you can't separate yourself from the church so much so that any arrow thrown in their direction pierces your heart - that's not my problem.

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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    That's discrimination.
    I would take that up with God then.

    Same could be asked of many men within the church's hierarchy.
    As I said, the people IN the Church are not perfect and even the Pope himself is only perfect when speaking ex cathedra (which is exceptionally rarely).

    Sure. But I'm free to comment on it all I like.
    Never said you couldn't, but don't expect not to be called on anything you post either.
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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    It's laughable that the church has a rigorous process that pedophiles can slip through yet women cannot.
    Talk about a non sequitur. A little easier to tell the difference between a man and a woman than it is to tell a man who will take the responsibilities of being a priest responsibly (which is the vast majority) and one who may commit a crime against a child. Nice try though.

    The bible is a collection of old writings that someone siphoned through cherry picking which would make it in and which wouldn't.
    A little more than Cherry Picking. That was Martin Luther, NOT the Catholic Church. The Church went through an extended process of determining which books made the cut and which did not.

    When women wanted to vote and were not allowed I'm sure it didn't mean diddly squat to them that there were plenty of things they were allowed to do other than voting.
    What does voting have to do with the service of God?
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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    This is laughable. Large segments of the Catholic faith openly opposed womens suffrage in the 19th century. Just because 1 priest supported the right for women to vote means NOTHING.

    There are priests TODAY who support the right for women to lead within the church. There are priests today who are kicked out of the Catholic Church for allowing female priests.

    Vatican city TODAY is one of the few last remaining places where women STILL CANNOT VOTE TODAY!!!!

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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    I know lots of people in the Catholic faith. I know many women who will readily admit it's a male dominated hierarchy and they just put up with it while hoping and praying the church eventually evolves into something that is relevant in this century.
    Of COURSE the hierarchy is full of males--as I've said REPEATEDLY, Jesus was male. That does not mean that the Church is misogynistic. A male hierarchy does not equate to misogyny.



    I don't consider you a woman hater. I'm not sure if you believe a woman's role is to be submissive or if you are just so blind by loyalty that you will defend your church in the face of any and all criticism.
    Do I come off "submissive?" It's not about being "less than"--it's about being empowered by who you are. I am powerful in my position precisely BECAUSE I utilize that which is God-given gift of femininity. Femininity in this regard is not the cliche "girliness"--but rather what it is that I was made to be.

    But it really doesn't matter as my criticisms are of the church and not yours to be taken personally. If you can't separate yourself from the church so much so that any arrow thrown in their direction pierces your heart - that's not my problem.
    Ironic that you would say arrow piercing my heart. Ludahai will probably understand why I take that as a compliment.

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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    This is laughable. Large segments of the Catholic faith openly opposed womens suffrage in the 19th century. Just because 1 priest supported the right for women to vote means NOTHING.

    There are priests TODAY who support the right for women to lead within the church. There are priests today who are kicked out of the Catholic Church for allowing female priests.
    Once again, the Church is NOT a Democracy.

    Vatican city TODAY is one of the few last remaining places where women STILL CANNOT VOTE TODAY!!!!
    Of course, you mean besides places where NO ONE can vote. The Church is not a democracy, nor was it ever meant to be. BTW, just HOW MANY people are citizens of the Vatican?
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    Re: Pope condemns sexual violence against women

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    The Church went through an extended process of determining which books made the cut and which did not.
    And by the church you mean a collection of fallible men.

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