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Thread: US high school 'held cage fights'

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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeJayH View Post
    said an ass kicking, not a bitchslap
    That *SMACK* came straight from Texas the home of cage fights pansy boy

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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    When the little monkey stops fighting back. Do you really think that this new attitude towards schoolyard fights is reducing the incidence of bullying? If anything, it appears to me to be encouraging it, because the victims must add fear of punishment to their fear of whatever punishment the bully is going to inflict upon them.

    Even if you get your ass handed to you afterwards, punching a bully is a much more effective way of stopping him than telling on him. Fighting back establishes that you are not a soft target; all of the "conflict resolution" methods that they teach children in school are only effective while the adults are still watching.

    Especially considering that bullies are rarely if ever punished as a result of "conflict resolution."
    I don't think that bullying will ever be eliminated. But hasn't the bully been taught that violence is a proper response to frustration or anger? They have learned this at home, many times in violent households. Violence begets violence.

    Of course you should defend yourself and fight back against bullies.


    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    Yes, they are, which is why this case is so shocking. But that is not evidence that it is the wrong policy, only that it is incompatible with our litigation-happy and irresponsible culture.
    I would say that condoning kids fighting is irresponsible.

    Do you think we should repeal battery and assault laws for adults?


    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    In most cases, losing a fight still hurts-- and it is the risk of defeat more than defeat itself which encourages courtesy. And while the Wild West may have been more violent-- and more disorderly-- than modern society, I would argue that it was on the whole more polite.
    I don't think there is much difference between "You sir, are an asshole." and "You are an asshole." Emily Post doesn't cover fighting to the best of my knowledge.


    Quote Originally Posted by Korimyr the Rat View Post
    Neither will accepting your anger and the fact that the other man's drunkenness is out of your control. That is what the law, the small claims court, and insurance policies are for.

    On the other hand, beating him up-- or even landing a couple good shots on him-- will make you feel better, and it will leave you in a better emotional space for dealing with your anger when you see him swerving down the road again or when you get the bill from the repair shop.
    I can take my anger out on a heavy bag, free weights, or my bass guitar.

    Let's say I break the guy's jaw. He can sue me for medical expenses. I can go to jail. I may even lose my job. A battery or assault charge will prevent me from getting certain jobs. I can assure you this won't make me feel better. You are arguing for some instant gratification without consideration of the long term effects.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    Lol

    YouTube - Pee-Wee Hockey Fight


    i can show you all day.
    How very irresponsible.

    And you might as well cue up all of the Olympic fights.

    Maybe when you are done you can compile all these videos and sell them as
    "Toddler Brawl Gone Wild".
    Last edited by Thorgasm; 03-22-09 at 03:32 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Where do you draw the line between "oh they're just trying to get it out of their system", and "oh he's just trying to rip his head off"?

    If we allow kids to fight in schools, without disciplinary action, then what is to say that they are not going to think it is okay to Falcon Punch someone for accidentally spilling water on them when they're in their 40's?

    Don't have a specific source, but I have seen several mentions of the theory that the intricate social rituals and multilayered of Japanese society were developed as a response to the brutal internecine warfare that they experienced until well into the modern era. edit: And Jerry pointed out that similar forces were at work in shaping the social graces of the Victorian era.
    If we are talking about the same thing: Then I believe that the Japanese kept a strict and well-mannered society because of the illusion that was created of warfare. That it was honorable to fight other clans, and to die for your clan. Social conflicts was handled by violence and clan warfare. Of course we cannot allow this to happen in the United States, but I do think it is an almost madness to believe that violence and death for an ideal is honorable.

    " There's nothing noble about dying. Not even if you die for honor. Not even if you die the greatest hero the world ever saw. Not even if you're so great your name will never be forgotten and who's that great? The most important thing is your life, little guys. You're worth nothing dead except for speeches. Don't let them kid you any more. Pay no attention when they tap you on the shoulder and say come along we've got to fight for liberty, or whatever their word is. There's always a word" -- Dalton Trumbo

    I'm not arguing that their manners are "better" than ours, but I don't think it's controversial to claim that they have a much greater care for public decorum than we do.
    That people were afraid of getting their chests caved in if they threw a rock through a window?

    As for our own history, it may be another issue of causation versus correlation, but look at the last two centuries and the progressively less exacting standards of public behavior. It seems to follow neatly the progression from the prohibition of dueling to the slow decline of the practice, into the modern era with the increasing enforcement and stricter penalties of laws against fistfighting. As a smaller and smaller portion of young men have ever experiencing being punched in the mouth, they appear to be growing mouthier and mouthier.
    Should we allow dueling to take place? I don't know how it is in most major cities, or most cities for that matter, but the holes-in-the-walls that I have lived, unless you rip half the opponent's face-off, then you are just goign to get reprimanded.
    We watch the Pacers' basketball players rush the fans who were throwing things, and acting in an negative esteem, and we bring down punish these guys. Should we have not posted suspensions and just allow them to slug each other? I am not so sure if the violence, nor the punishment of violence helped Ron Artest and his willingness to rip someone's head off.
    Does creating a medium to channel violent tendencies deter violence from happening? Or is our objective not to deter violence, but to not allow it to get to the point of over-injury?

    And it's not just the younger generation. A woman who appeared to be in her seventies called me a "mother****er" in public a couple of months ago. Rolled down her car window and shouted it at me.
    You should have smiled, waved, and tell her to relish her last remaining year, as God has issued a recall with her name on it.
    "I do not underestimate the ability of fanatical groups of terrorists to kill and destroy, but they do not threaten the life of the nation. Whether we would survive Hitler hung in the balance, but there is no doubt that we shall survive al-Qa'ida." -- Lord Hoffmann

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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Enemy View Post
    " There's nothing noble about dying. Not even if you die for honor. Not even if you die the greatest hero the world ever saw. Not even if you're so great your name will never be forgotten and who's that great? The most important thing is your life, little guys. You're worth nothing dead except for speeches. Don't let them kid you any more. Pay no attention when they tap you on the shoulder and say come along we've got to fight for liberty, or whatever their word is. There's always a word" -- Dalton Trumbo
    .
    We'll free every slave in every town and region. Can anybody get a bigger army than that?
    ~Dalton Trumbo

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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    Let's say I break the guy's jaw. He can sue me for medical expenses. I can go to jail. I may even lose my job. A battery or assault charge will prevent me from getting certain jobs. I can assure you this won't make me feel better. You are arguing for some instant gratification without consideration of the long term effects.
    Did you forget the part where they're using gloves, padding, helmets, mouth guards, that supervision is present and everyone has signed a waver?

    I mean for Christ's sake Nerf is making a fortune and you're still crying about it.
    Last edited by Jerry; 03-22-09 at 03:54 PM.

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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    I don't think that bullying will ever be eliminated. But hasn't the bully been taught that violence is a proper response to frustration or anger?
    Bullies aren't acting out of frustration or anger. They are expressing dominance-- and are usually quite calm and amused by their handiwork, as long as they're in control. Frustration and anger are what they experience when their victims push back, which is why they eventually move on to easier prey.

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    Do you think we should repeal battery and assault laws for adults?
    No, but I think such laws shouldn't apply to fights between equals that do not involve the intentional infliction of serious injury. If you strike someone considerably smaller or weaker than yourself, strike an unarmed person with a weapon, or continue striking someone who has ceased to defend himself, you should be charged with assault and battery at least.

    On the other hand, if you strike someone who proceeds to willingly fight with you, or strike someone once before they decline to return the favor, I don't think assault or battery charges should apply.

    If you're fighting in a place where it is going to disturb other people or lead to property damage, disorderly conduct is a perfectly appropriate charge.

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    I don't think there is much difference between "You sir, are an asshole." and "You are an asshole." Emily Post doesn't cover fighting to the best of my knowledge.
    On the other hand, knowing that calling you an asshole will give you full legal right to punch someone in the face will very likely lead to fewer people calling you an asshole-- whether they call you "asshole sir!" or not.

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    I can take my anger out on a heavy bag, free weights, or my bass guitar.
    You can, and it would likely do you some good. But I would argue that it would not do you as much good as taking your anger out on the person that provoked it-- and that a few mild injuries to your face and hands would provide a better sense of closure than muscle fatigue would.

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    Let's say I break the guy's jaw. He can sue me for medical expenses. I can go to jail. I may even lose my job. A battery or assault charge will prevent me from getting certain jobs. I can assure you this won't make me feel better. You are arguing for some instant gratification without consideration of the long term effects.
    Actually, I am arguing that in this case the instant gratification would be a desirable thing-- on a personal and societal level-- and that all of the long term consequences you are describing here would be wholly inappropriate. Those long term consequences are, in a vicious cycle, the cause and the chief symptom of cultural values I consider to be unhealthy.

    As long as he was standing up and facing you when you broke his jaw, he shouldn't be able to sue you for medical expenses or press charges, and as long as you weren't at work when you did it, you shouldn't have to worry about losing your job. Of course, he also shouldn't have to pay thousands of dollars in medical expenses, either-- but nationalized healthcare is a topic for a different thread.

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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Did you forget the part where they're using gloves, padding, helmets, mouth guards, that supervision is present and everyone has signed a waver?

    I mean for Christ's sake Nerf is making a fortune and you're still crying about it.
    Nerf?

    "I do not underestimate the ability of fanatical groups of terrorists to kill and destroy, but they do not threaten the life of the nation. Whether we would survive Hitler hung in the balance, but there is no doubt that we shall survive al-Qa'ida." -- Lord Hoffmann

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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Did you forget the part where they're using gloves, padding, helmets, mouth guards, that supervision is present and everyone has signed a waver?

    I mean for Christ's sake Nerf is making a fortune and you're still crying about it.
    You obvoiusly haven't followed the conversation. This portion you quoted was talking about a drunk driver hitting my parked car.

    Should the schools arrange safe sex with condoms and supervision?

    Children can't consent.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



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    Re: US high school 'held cage fights'

    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Enemy View Post
    Nerf?

    You know what I'm talkin about, it's not like your room isn't filled with this crap:
    Nerf

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