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Pelosi Tells Illegal Immigrants That Work Site Raids are Un-American

It is anti-American to encourage illegal immigration. Which is basically encouraging another country to invade yours seeing how the vast majority of the 20 plus million illegals in this country are from Mexico.
Technically it is treason as crossing borders without a passport is an illegal activity, not quite an act of war but an invasion nonetheless. While I realize it is all in the semantics a case could be made for the charge of treason with a creative prosecuter, "the illegals are invaders, therefore enemies of the state, Mrs. Pelosi's statements give aid and comfort to said enemy".
 
We are in partial agreement here, but what I want to know is who is "pushing" these people to work illegally in the US? Did someone FORCE them to illegally cross the border and "illegally" find work?

By forcing people to wait months and years before that are granted a work visa.

There is no reason to have people wait in a digital line for months or years just so they can cross the border and perform some minimum wage job.
 
By forcing people to wait months and years before that are granted a work visa.

There is no reason to have people wait in a digital line for months or years just so they can cross the border and perform some minimum wage job.

But this is not "forcing" them to violate our laws unless you are of the belief that they have some kind of "right" to work here.

Like I stated, I think we are on the same page, but we disagree when it comes to making excuses for illegal activity.

Yes, we definitely need modernization and reform in this department beyond building sophisticated fences and surveillance. But I am not going to make excuses that the system is a cause and effect of illegal activity.

The illegal(s) we see never had the intentions of properly filing their immigration papers and jump ahead of the line for those who do.

You do realize that there is also a LARGE population of illegal aliens who came legally and had visas that expired and then CHOSE not to renew or leave the country after the expiration right? It's not just those farm workers picking strawberries.
 
By forcing people to wait months and years before that are granted a work visa.

There is no reason to have people wait in a digital line for months or years just so they can cross the border and perform some minimum wage job.

Try being an illegal in Mexico from the U.S. and see how you are treated.

As long as people enter the country legally I don't have a problem.

One of the reasons for legal immigration is health checks and knowing who these people are.

Last time I checked 12 Americans die from illegal drunk drivers every day,and 12 Americans are murdered every day,and this doesn't even count other crimes like pedophiles and rapist.

By the way Mexico is slowly winning the war by peaceful invasion,how many amnesties are we going to give them,that's a great way to become a citizen break the law be citizen.

If we follow that policy we shouldn't have any laws to enforce against our citizens if we don't enforce the laws against them.
 
And who exactly doesn't hate Maxine Waters and Barney Frank?? I don't know anyone! Well truthfully most of the dems I know IRLprobably don't even know who Barney Franks and Maxine Waters are. That's the sad truth of it. :(

Apparently alot of people, they keep getting voted in.
 
Like Barney Frank & Maxine Waters the said truth is Pelosi probably isn't going anywhere.

Isn't that the most telling argument of all against allowing politicians to define political voting districts?

If honest people were able to control the re-districting demanded by the decennial census results, the geriatric aristocratic Congress would be turned over more rapidly.

But noooo, we can't have honest people doing anything as sensitive as that, we have to leave that in the hands of the politicians. They're elected to serve themselves, er us...(I guess) and they're going to do it.
 
Illegal jobs shouldn't need protection. Why? Because they shouldn't be illegal.

Immigrants should easily and quickly be able to get work visa's and shouldn't be pushed to work illegally.

But since they have chosen to ignore this nation's laws, their asses should be marched home at bayonet point if necessary, after they've been finger-printed so we can know if they're repeat offenders. Those people can spend a couple years in jail before they go back home.
 
You actually think she is different than Barney Franks, Maxine Waters, Harry Reid, Schumer, Biden.....etc etc etc.....

It begs the question, where have you been? :rofl

Let's see....she likes men...Barney Franks likes men....no difference there.

She's stupid...Maxine Waters is stupid....no difference there.

She's corrupt...Harry's corrupt...no difference there.

So she's corrupt and stupid...that makes her just like Chuck Schumer.

I don't think she's plagiarized anyone...so she's not like Joe Biden...but they're both stupid.

So, if your theorem was that All Democrats are Alike, I'd say it's proven.
 
By forcing people to wait months and years before that are granted a work visa.

There is no reason to have people wait in a digital line for months or years just so they can cross the border and perform some minimum wage job.

If they don't want to obey the nation's laws, and invade in violation thereof, they should be marched back home at bayonet point.

What part of "illegal" is confusing you?
 
The complete and utter refusal of both major political parties to address the crisis in process by the two decade perpetual invasion of the United States by Mexico is the surest sign that the people of this country have lost any hope of ever regaining control of the government that is no longer theirs.

They are doomed to become third class citizens in their own homeland.
 
This is the typical Lib hostility to our police, intel and military.
Our laws.

Instead.
We are the problem.
Our police are evil.
Military are terrorists and murderers.... Nazi's.

Nothing new. Just another Liberal moment not really meant for public consumption caught on tape.

Where have we separated Mom's from Kids?

Perhaps we should do it.
It would illustrate a Zero Tolerance attitude to Illegals.

Come at your own risk.
You illegal status will be treated as such.
You made the choice to challenge our laws... no go home.

In fact... we should adopt the Mexican Illegal Immigration Laws.
To the word.


* Foreigners are admitted into Mexico "according to their possibilities of contributing to national progress." (Article 32)

* Immigration officials must "ensure" that "immigrants will be useful elements for the country and that they have the necessary funds for their sustenance" and for their dependents. (Article 34)

* Foreigners may be barred from the country if their presence upsets "the equilibrium of the national demographics," when foreigners are deemed detrimental to "economic or national interests," when they do not behave like good citizens in their own country, when they have broken Mexican laws, and when "they are not found to be physically or mentally healthy." (Article 37)

* The Secretary of Governance may "suspend or prohibit the admission of foreigners when he determines it to be in the national interest." (Article 38)

Mexican authorities must keep track of every single person in the country:

* Federal, local and municipal police must cooperate with federal immigration authorities upon request, i.e., to assist in the arrests of illegal immigrants. (Article 73)

* A National Population Registry keeps track of "every single individual who comprises the population of the country," and verifies each individual's identity. (Articles 85 and 86)

* A national Catalog of Foreigners tracks foreign tourists and immigrants (Article 87), and assigns each individual with a unique tracking number (Article 91).

Foreigners with fake papers, or who enter the country under false pretenses, may be imprisoned:

* Foreigners with fake immigration papers may be fined or imprisoned. (Article 116)

* Foreigners who sign government documents "with a signature that is false or different from that which he normally uses" are subject to fine and imprisonment. (Article 116)

Foreigners who fail to obey the rules will be fined, deported, and/or imprisoned as felons:

* Foreigners who fail to obey a deportation order are to be punished. (Article 117)

* Foreigners who are deported from Mexico and attempt to re-enter the country without authorization can be imprisoned for up to 10 years. (Article 118)

* Foreigners who violate the terms of their visa may be sentenced to up to six years in prison (Articles 119, 120 and 121). Foreigners who misrepresent the terms of their visa while in Mexico -- such as working with out a permit -- can also be imprisoned.

Under Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony. The General Law on Population says,

* "A penalty of up to two years in prison and a fine of three hundred to five thousand pesos will be imposed on the foreigner who enters the country illegally." (Article 123)

* Foreigners with legal immigration problems may be deported from Mexico instead of being imprisoned. (Article 125)

* Foreigners who "attempt against national sovereignty or security" will be deported. (Article 126)

Mexicans who help illegal aliens enter the country are themselves considered criminals under the law:

* A Mexican who marries a foreigner with the sole objective of helping the foreigner live in the country is subject to up to five years in prison. (Article 127)

* Shipping and airline companies that bring undocumented foreigners into Mexico will be fined. (Article 132)
 
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Its very amusing watching folks trying to distance themselves and the other Democrats from Pelosi. They voted for her for Speaker. If they don't agree with her, why do they keep electing her their leader?

The Republican leaders are not too bright, but Pelosi takes the meaning of idiocy to a whole 'nuther level.
 
This is the typical Lib hostility to our police, intel and military.
Our laws.

Instead.
We are the problem.
Our police are evil.
Military are terrorists and murderers.... Nazi's.

Nothing new. Just another Liberal moment not really meant for public consumption caught on tape.
Hyper. Partisan. Here you are making sweeping, ignorant statements about Liberals yet again. I was a cop for a decade and a half, I was a soldier for a decade and a half, and I still work on behalf of law enforcement albeit at a different level now. And I'm considered at least slightly liberal given my position on certain subjects. Nobody here said anything like you've posted.

Where have we separated Mom's from Kids?
I've participated in about a dozen ICE raids in the midwest. We raided poultry plants and a couple of construction companies sites. Each time we bagged several female illegals, and put them in jail. Each time we had to send Division of Family Services along with a law enforcement escort to their homes to identify the children and either take them into foster care until the mother was released or deported. In the process we would often times find other illegal alien at the homes that would result in more arrests. Sometimes we would release the mothers to care for the children, sometimes DFS would take that role. It depended on what ICE wanted to do at the time. Typically after a few days to a week we reunited the mother and children. Either ICE decided they weren't deporting anyone, or one of the children was born in the U.S. and the mother was released to be with the kids. Sometimes the mother and/or father were transported to the border and the children would follow within a couple of days to a week.

Perhaps we should do it.
It would illustrate a Zero Tolerance attitude to Illegals.
See above.
Come at your own risk.
You illegal status will be treated as such.
You made the choice to challenge our laws... no go home.
Or we should spend some money to secure that border and heavily penalize employers who hire illegal immigrants.
In fact... we should adopt the Mexican Illegal Immigration Laws.
To the word.
To the word eh? Well fining offenders in pesos might pose a problem. :rofl
 
Hyper. Partisan. Here you are making sweeping, ignorant statements about Liberals yet again. I was a cop for a decade and a half, I was a soldier for a decade and a half, and I still work on behalf of law enforcement albeit at a different level now. And I'm considered at least slightly liberal given my position on certain subjects. Nobody here said anything like you've posted.
Thanks for your service.

The statements are not ignorant, they are historically accurate.

Look back at John Kerry and Vietnam.
Look at how they treated Reagan.
How they've behaved since The Church Hearings.
Bush 43.
Look at what the libs cut with predictability: The military and intel services.
How they talk about our troops during war. "Terrorists", "terrorizing", "Nazi's",and that from the Dem leadership including Obama.

Sorry, libs have a long record of hostility to the military, police and intel.

It is why 911 rocked their world.
They knew they had trouble considering their history.
It is why the D's in the Senate begged for a second vote.

Then when things got tough they recanted and went back to their philosophical home.
Beating our troops, reveling in counting the dead, crapping on our generals.

It's what modern libs do... have done and continue to do.
It's their record.
They earned it.

You really do have a short memory.


I've participated in about a dozen ICE raids in the midwest. We raided poultry plants and a couple of construction companies sites. Each time we bagged several female illegals, and put them in jail. Each time we had to send Division of Family Services along with a law enforcement escort to their homes to identify the children and either take them into foster care until the mother was released or deported. In the process we would often times find other illegal alien at the homes that would result in more arrests. Sometimes we would release the mothers to care for the children, sometimes DFS would take that role. It depended on what ICE wanted to do at the time. Typically after a few days to a week we reunited the mother and children. Either ICE decided they weren't deporting anyone, or one of the children was born in the U.S. and the mother was released to be with the kids. Sometimes the mother and/or father were transported to the border and the children would follow within a couple of days to a week.
And I've heard ICE agents claim there were not separations.

I don't really care if there are.
They are illegals.
It was their choice to challenge the law.
That some discomfort and short term separation may ensue does not bother me.

...should spend some money to secure that border and heavily penalize employers who hire illegal immigrants.
Yes and yes.

To the word eh? Well fining offenders in pesos might pose a problem.
No problem... I'll set up a money exchange for them.
 
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Thanks for your service.
It was an honor.

The statements are not ignorant, they are historically accurate.

Look back at John Kerry and Vietnam.
Look at how they treated Reagan.
How they've behaved since The Church Hearings.
Bush 43.
Look at what the libs cut with predictability: The military and intel services.
How they talk about our troops during war. "Terrorists", "terrorizing", "Nazi's",and that from the Dem leadership including Obama.

Sorry, libs have a long record of hostility to the military, police and intel.

It is why 911 rocked their world.
They knew they had trouble considering their history.
It is why the D's in the Senate begged for a second vote.

Then when things got tough they recanted and went back to their philosophical home.
Beating our troops, reveling in counting the dead, crapping on our generals.

It's what modern libs do... have done and continue to do.
It's their record.
They earned it.

You really do have a short memory.
No, it's what some libs do. Not all. And that is my point with you. You always generalize out of partisan political expediency.

And I've heard ICE agents claim there were not separations.
Maybe there weren't in the cases they worked.

I don't really care if there are.
I do because it's much more costly to the state when they do separate parents from children.
They are illegals.
It was their choice to challenge the law.
That some discomfort and short term separation may ensue does not bother me.
Agreed, but it's fiscally irresponsible when you have alternative options at your disposal. There is no immediate threat to society from a peaceful illegal immigrant who is only here working and living with their children.

While the core of the issue is the illegality, it's not the real crux of the problem. It's the expense to you and I that illegal immigration results in. All we do is compound the expense when make mass arrests and separate families. Because right now we almost always release the majority of offenders. About the only ones we deport are those with actual criminal histories or pending cases in court for certain offenses. What's the point of basically inconveniencing these people if we are just doing "catch and release" enforcement? It costs us substantially to house them, feed them, we immediately assume medical liability, jails are immediately pushed to capacity. I believe we must focus neutralizing the draw that brings them up here. Force compliance by employers who willfully violate the law and the jobs dry up. It will also encourage many of them to get in line for the process of becoming legal. Take some of that spendulus money and put more cops or even armed soldiers on that damned border and start building.

No problem... I'll set up a money exchange for them.
Let me know if you need help on that. :mrgreen:
 
No, it's what some libs do. Not all. And that is my point with you. You always generalize out of partisan political expediency.
Sorry.
We saw what you folks did. Since the 1970's.

Let's take very recent history.
There was one lone voice of opposition in the Lib party and you folks set out to destroy him.
Lieberman.

There was NO tolerance for opposing views concerning Iraq.
None.

In fact, your leader declared the US Military "lost".

The frenzy you folks ignited among your party was nothing short of hysteria.
Blind hatred.
I'm not one to use the word "hate" too much, it has a specific meaning... loss of emotional control accompanied by inner fits of rage... being part of it... but in this instance I'm at a loss for something to replace that word.

In any event, I remember The Libs repugnant behavior clearly.

It was simply difficult to believe these people were or are Americans.

They behaved like the enemy. At a minimum, they were their propagandists.

I do because it's much more costly to the state when they do separate parents from children.
By putting our laws before their family for a couple weeks might help reduce illegals by showing we mean business.

A deterrent.

I'll accept the cost in this instance.
It's for protection of the borders and nation.
Playing by the rules. The law.
It's Constitutional.

Agreed, but it's fiscally irresponsible when you have alternative options at your disposal. There is no immediate threat to society from a peaceful illegal immigrant who is only here working and living with their children.
I don't know if these people are peaceful.
They have not been vetted for citizenship.
I have no idea who they are or their record before entering the US.


While the core of the issue is the illegality, it's not the real crux of the problem. It's the expense to you and I that illegal immigration results in. All we do is compound the expense when make mass arrests and separate families. Because right now we almost always release the majority of offenders. About the only ones we deport are those with actual criminal histories or pending cases in court for certain offenses. What's the point of basically inconveniencing these people if we are just doing "catch and release" enforcement? It costs us substantially to house them, feed them, we immediately assume medical liability, jails are immediately pushed to capacity. I believe we must focus neutralizing the draw that brings them up here. Force compliance by employers who willfully violate the law and the jobs dry up. It will also encourage many of them to get in line for the process of becoming legal. Take some of that spendulus money and put more cops or even armed soldiers on that damned border and start building.
In the beginning there may be higher initial costs.
That is OK, so long as the program reduces costs and illegals over the long haul.

Reagan's Amnesty was supposed to signal a New Start... or was that "Overcharge" to the illegal immigration challenge.

Same with in the 60's... where Sen. Kennedy claimed all problems would be solved. Wrong.

The High Price Today of Immigration Reform in 1965
Chief among national concerns was total numeric immigration. Senate floor manager and Camelot knight-errant Ted Kennedy assured jittery senators that "our cities will not be flooded with a million immigrants annually." Senator Daniel Inouye, D-Hawaii, further calmed that august body, insisting "the total number of potential immigrants would not be changed very much." Time has proven otherwise. Average immigration levels before the 1965 amendments took effect hovered around 300,000 per annum. Yet 1,045,000 legal immigrants flooded our cities in 1996 alone.

Now we have 20 million illegals doing work Americans won't do...

It's time to step on some necks and get control of our borders in a professional, surgical manner.
I don't care if it costs more.
That job is fundamental to our prosperity, security, and it is Constitutional.

Social engineering, which eats trillions... is not.
 
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Sorry.
We saw what you folks did. Since the 1970's.

Let's take very recent history.
There was one lone voice of opposition in the Lib party and you folks set out to destroy him.
Lieberman.

There was NO tolerance for opposing views concerning Iraq.
None.

In fact, your leader declared the US Military "lost".

The frenzy you folks ignited among your party was nothing short of hysteria.
Blind hatred.
I'm not one to use the word "hate" too much, it has a specific meaning... loss of emotional control accompanied by inner fits of rage... being part of it... but in this instance I'm at a loss for something to replace that word.

In any event, I remember The Libs repugnant behavior clearly.

It was simply difficult to believe these people were or are Americans.

They behaved like the enemy. At a minimum, they were their propagandists.
Whatever you say zimmer. :rofl

By putting our laws before their family for a couple weeks might help reduce illegals by showing we mean business.

A deterrent.

I'll accept the cost in this instance.
It's for protection of the borders and nation.
Playing by the rules. The law.
It's Constitutional.
Incarceration is not an effective deterrent, this has long been established. Especially for immigrants coming from countries like Mexico where the criminal justice/law enforcement system is corrupt almost to the core. Our jails are like resorts to these folks. If jailing them were a deterrent it would have worked years ago.

I don't know if these people are peaceful.
You do if you are an investigating officer and you check them out well enough.
They have not been vetted for citizenship.
Obviously.
I have no idea who they are or their record before entering the US.
So you can't assume they are guilty of anything. This is still the U.S.

In the beginning there may be higher initial costs.
That is OK, so long as the program reduces costs and illegals over the long haul.

Reagan's Amnesty was supposed to signal a New Start... or was that "Overcharge" to the illegal immigration challenge.

Same with in the 60's... where Sen. Kennedy claimed all problems would be solved. Wrong.

The High Price Today of Immigration Reform in 1965


Now we have 20 million illegals doing work Americans won't do...

It's time to step on some necks and get control of our borders in a professional, surgical manner.
I don't care if it costs more.
That job is fundamental to our prosperity, security, and it is Constitutional.

Social engineering, which eats trillions... is not.
Pretty much agree with you on all of this.
 
Whatever you say zimmer. :rofl
It's a bitter pill, but these folks earned it.
Now you have to swallow hard.

Wish it were otherwise, I really do.
But the Libs record on National Security matters is abysmal.

Incarceration is not an effective deterrent, this has long been established. Especially for immigrants coming from countries like Mexico where the criminal justice/law enforcement system is corrupt almost to the core. Our jails are like resorts to these folks. If jailing them were a deterrent it would have worked years ago.
I'm not for incarcerating on a first offense.
Catch, return and let's build a wall to keep them and potential terrorists out.

For repeat offenders, they can go to the can.
 
Incarceration is not an effective deterrent, this has long been established. Especially for immigrants coming from countries like Mexico where the criminal justice/law enforcement system is corrupt almost to the core. Our jails are like resorts to these folks. If jailing them were a deterrent it would have worked years ago.

Oh, bull. Carceration is a maximally effective deterrent.

Make the employment of more than five illegal aliens a felony and start putting their employers in the federal penitentiary.

That'll deter the crap out of the illegal alien business.
 
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It's too perfectly wrong to be accidental.

Since it can't be accidental, it's treason.

I love how people on both sides of the political spectrum throw that word around like it's nothing. Treason is a very serious charge. If they were guilty of treason they would be charged as such. They aren't, however, guilty of treason just because some guy on a political debate board says so. :roll:
 
I love how people on both sides of the political spectrum throw that word around like it's nothing. Treason is a very serious charge. If they were guilty of treason they would be charged as such. They aren't, however, guilty of treason just because some guy on a political debate board says so. :roll:

Deliberately destroying the United States is a serious crime. Why shouldn't the word treason be used to describe it?

As for that "if they were guilty they'd be charged" nonsense, how about if you grew up?
 
I love how people on both sides of the political spectrum throw that word around like it's nothing. Treason is a very serious charge. If they were guilty of treason they would be charged as such. They aren't, however, guilty of treason just because some guy on a political debate board says so. :roll:
Actually it could be construed treason in this case because of the nature of the statements, it's too serious of a charge to apply for this particular stupid un-american statement IMO but a political opponent with a creative side and good grasp of semantics could have a chance of making a treason charge stick against Pelosi.
 
Deliberately destroying the United States is a serious crime. Why shouldn't the word treason be used to describe it?

How are liberals deliberately trying to destroy the US? And treason shouldn't be used to describe it because it's a serious charge and it's up to our justice system to dole out treason charges, not hyper partisan people who post on debate forums.

As for that "if they were guilty they'd be charged" nonsense, how about if you grew up?

Nice ad-hom. :roll:
 
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