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Thread: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

  1. #201
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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    I've already shown her how legality does not matter in the human sex trade. She does not care about the reality at hand. As long as "morality" is enforced via the state everything is fine and dandy in her opinion.
    No you haven't. I've pointed out Israel, Germany, Amsterdam, etc to you. I've shown you that here the biggest importer of sex slaves is Nevada. You harped on the little tidbit that in Vegas it isn't legal. Big whoop. Men go to Vegas for prostitutes. It's a market there. An open market.

    Amsterdam's human trafficking is so out of control they're back tracking and trying desperately to clean the place up by closing brothels down.

    All you've done is say, "Look prostitution is illegal here and there's still human trafficking, " while IGNORING all the cases where prostitution was made legal and the effect was a rampant rise in trafficking all the while pretending that the supply/demand concept is completely lost on you.

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    Well the issue of this thread is legalizing prostitution. Legalizing it promotes a higher demand, cheapens the worth/value, and creates a fiercely more competitive market. When men have more choice they demand youth.
    Legalizing it means the people participating are no longer criminals. They're able to seek help when they need it. THey're able to claim the income and pay their taxes. I don't give a hoot how much money they're able to make, that isn't the issue. The issue is freedom and safety.

    We are talking about legalizing prostitution so I fail to see why you keep bringing up elite call girls which will have no place in a legalized setting. In a place like Ohio maybe some girl who isn't even all that good looking can get a few hundred off a guy as an independent contractor. Put that same girl in Amsterdam and she won't make enough to even live off. In legalized settings the girls are kept in lots, paid less, treated worse, and well who wants that lifestyle? Very few but the most desperate. Thus the trafficking.
    That's not the case in brothels in Nevada. And I certainly wasn't working for an "elite service" when I started. I checked out the elite services, and I assure you... I didn't fit in. I didn't have the ****ing money to work for an elite service that required expensive wardrobes.

    The reason I bring up my experience is precisely because it flies in the face of the misconceptions that you and others share about the business. You guys read some articles online and think you know everything there is to know. You read articles that are AIMED at misinforming you. They focus only on the lowest common denominator and ignore the majority of the people in the industry. THAT is why I bring up my experience.

    I do not bring up my experience because I think prostitution should be legal so more women can make a bunch of money. The amount of money they'd make is irrelevant. What is relevant is freedom, liberty, safety for both the prostitutes and the clients, and destigmatizing the industry as a whole. I don't give a **** if they end up making minimum wage. That isn't the issue.

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by winston53660 View Post
    Prove it. The demand is already there legal or not. I doubt the demand will change very much.
    Maybe if prostitution became legal everywhere at once perhaps demand wouldn't change. But creating pockets of legalized prostitution means you import demand via tourists who come specifically for the sex trade and it most certainly does increase demand and furthermore it would defy common sense if it did not.

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by rivrrat View Post
    Legalizing it means the people participating are no longer criminals. They're able to seek help when they need it. THey're able to claim the income and pay their taxes. I don't give a hoot how much money they're able to make, that isn't the issue. The issue is freedom and safety.


    That's not the case in brothels in Nevada. And I certainly wasn't working for an "elite service" when I started. I checked out the elite services, and I assure you... I didn't fit in. I didn't have the ****ing money to work for an elite service that required expensive wardrobes.

    The reason I bring up my experience is precisely because it flies in the face of the misconceptions that you and others share about the business. You guys read some articles online and think you know everything there is to know. You read articles that are AIMED at misinforming you. They focus only on the lowest common denominator and ignore the majority of the people in the industry. THAT is why I bring up my experience.

    I do not bring up my experience because I think prostitution should be legal so more women can make a bunch of money. The amount of money they'd make is irrelevant. What is relevant is freedom, liberty, safety for both the prostitutes and the clients, and destigmatizing the industry as a whole. I don't give a **** if they end up making minimum wage. That isn't the issue.
    Yeah but your experience is completely non-verifiable which you have to understand makes it sorta worthless. Anyone can be anyone on the internet.

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    Maybe that's how you feel, but ask the rest of the world, and that's not the story you'll get.
    Doesn't mean they are right though.


    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    Waitressing is not having sex for money. Two different things. There is a service involved, but the services are quite different.
    Regardless of the service, they are using the age ol method of "Sex Sells". You don't seem to have a problem with a pretty waitress flirting with patrons to get money, why do you have a problem with one that gives them what the want?

    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    All the other jobs you could readily admit to, but bring up prostitution, and I would bet everybody clams up.
    Only because of the taboo people in society puts on it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    I've never heard anybody say that's what they want to do when they grow up.
    you may not have heard it, but ask many porn stars and strippers that are successful at it ask if they regret it and most say NO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    Prostitution is very low-class. Doesn't matter how you dress it up, it's still low-class. It can have a beautiful package, and even be educated, but in the end it is what it is and it ain't good or necessary.
    Iit's only low class to people such as yourself. Others view it as a profession.


    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    Anyone who works can be pitied. It's tough getting up doing 9 to 5.
    So now we come to the real reason you hate these people. Jealousy, they can more than you on a 9 to 5 and you hate that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    Yes, they were.
    Again, only to jealous types such as yourself.


    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    This is probably how you have come to justify what you do.
    It's how most in the buisness do it. They are getting PAID to do a job, just like anyone else would. You are just jealous they are getting paid more than you would.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    Waitresses serve food and drinks. It's entirely different to have someone who you don't even know, enjoy something that is your own personal, highly cherished self for a few dollars. Not worth it in MHO. Unfortunate when you believe it is worth it.
    Again, that is your personal opinion. When you go into a restaurant you order food and drink that you want. It is no different in a brothel, you order the sex you want.

    The difference is you look down on a service you feel is immoral. Well guess what? Your immoral opinions don't matter to everyone.

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by TheNextEra View Post
    you may not have heard it, but ask many porn stars and strippers that are successful at it ask if they regret it and most say NO.
    Porn stars and strippers are a dime a dozen and rarely do they ever reach the heights of a Jenna Jameson Empire. Asking the "many porn stars and strippers that are successful..." is an impossibility because they're simply aren't "many" to be found that would qualify as successful.

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by Marilyn Monroe View Post
    Maybe that's how you feel, but ask the rest of the world, and that's not the story you'll get.
    And they would be wrong too.

    Waitressing is not having sex for money. Two different things. There is a service involved, but the services are quite different.
    Yes yes... and being a firefighter is different than being a police officer. So let's make one of them illegal!

    Yes the services are different, but they are services nonetheless.

    All the other jobs you could readily admit to, but bring up prostitution, and I would bet everybody clams up.
    Then that is their own problem.

    I've never heard anybody say that's what they want to do when they grow up.
    Never heard anyone say they want to be a ditch digger or fruit picker when they grow up either. And?

    Prostitution is very low-class. Doesn't matter how you dress it up, it's still low-class. It can have a beautiful package, and even be educated, but in the end it is what it is and it ain't good or necessary.
    Waitressing is very low class. Doesn't matter how you dress it up, it's still low-class. . It can have a beautiful package, and even be educated, but in the end it is what it is and it ain't good or necessary.

    The thinking is the same just different age groups.
    No, the thinking is not the same. On one hand you have consenting adults, and on the other... you don't.

    Anyone who works can be pitied. It's tough getting up doing 9 to 5.
    Indeed.


    Yes, they were.
    And just how were they insensitive? They did exactly what I asked of them.

    This is probably how you have come to justify what you do.
    I need no justification. Is there any reason to have sex other than to get off or get paid? Isn't getting paid to do something a way to use someone else to make money? Is that what capitalism is all about?

    Waitresses serve food and drinks. It's entirely different to have someone who you don't even know, enjoy something that is your own personal, highly cherished self for a few dollars. Not worth it in MHO. Unfortunate when you believe it is worth it.
    LOL And you don't think that customers - strangers - in restaurants or bars are enjoying the waitresses "highly cherished self" for a few dollars? What about someone getting a massage? Don't you think they enjoy using the masseuse for physical pleasure?

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    Porn stars and strippers are a dime a dozen and rarely do they ever reach the heights of a Jenna Jameson Empire. Asking the "many porn stars and strippers that are successful..." is an impossibility because they're simply aren't "many" to be found that would qualify as successful.
    Again, says you. There are quite many, otherwise there wouldn't be that many pornos floating around DAILY.

    Simple fact is there is money to made in the industry.

    I will admit many fail, just like many that try to start their own business that fail. But does that mean you should tell people never to start their own business because they can fail?

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    Yeah but your experience is completely non-verifiable which you have to understand makes it sorta worthless. Anyone can be anyone on the internet.
    Well, the whole "being illegal" thing makes most prostitution "studies" unverifiable and purely conjecture based off a tiny percentage of people working in the minority segment of a vast industry.

    In other words, it makes them pretty worthless.

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    Re: Selling sex legally in New Zealand

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou View Post
    No you haven't. I've pointed out Israel, Germany, Amsterdam, etc to you. I've shown you that here the biggest importer of sex slaves is Nevada. You harped on the little tidbit that in Vegas it isn't legal. Big whoop. Men go to Vegas for prostitutes. It's a market there. An open market.

    Amsterdam's human trafficking is so out of control they're back tracking and trying desperately to clean the place up by closing brothels down.

    All you've done is say, "Look prostitution is illegal here and there's still human trafficking, " while IGNORING all the cases where prostitution was made legal and the effect was a rampant rise in trafficking all the while pretending that the supply/demand concept is completely lost on you.

    I've pointed out where sexual human trafficking is a problem in nations where prostitution is illegal. I've also pointed out nations where it is a problem and prostitution is legal.

    It would be nice if you got off your soap box and actually proved a relationship between illegality and legality in regards to the human sex trade.
    Last edited by winston53660; 03-18-09 at 12:21 AM.

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