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Thread: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

  1. #91
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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    There is clearly a difference between choosing to ride a Harley (i.e. choosing to look ridiculous) or choosing to smoke a cigarette and having a local water resource ravaged by pollution. I would have liked to see other examples taken from your pages.

  2. #92
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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by Middleground View Post
    So again I ask... is healthcare a right for every American?
    and
    Quote Originally Posted by Middleground View Post
    As you know, I personally do believe it's a right, and there is no doubt that that is the fundamental question.
    Believe as you wish. There is no such "Right".


    Quote Originally Posted by Middleground View Post
    Yet ask a Canadian what's the most important Canadian right, and most will tell you our healthcare.
    Are Canadians that uninformed?
    They have no such "Right".
    Go ahead and try to prove that such a "Right" exists in Canada.

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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by TOJ View Post
    Better stop the production lines at Harley Davidson since they are making a profit (at least trying to) and I think it is a proven direct fact that people are being killed from riding them. Also I guess you are for shutting down the tobacco companies. I could go on for pages but hopefully you get the point.

    Lets be realistic shall we? Your extremes do not prove a point, they only prove you extreme. The product, a motorcylce, in your example does not kill the person in question directly. Dumping waste into drinking water, or denying healthcare directly kills people.

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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    How is the preventative medicine paid for?


    Then you support unnecessaruly high health care costs.
    The preventative medicine is paid for through premiums, as it is now. The difference is that when a person goes to the doctor for check-ups, screenings, or whatever preventative measures one may take to stay healthy, there is little or no cost.

    The insurance companies could provide low premiums to those who use preventative medicine and live a healthy lifestyle because these people are avoiding, when possible, the more serious conditions that may be caught at early stages, thereby avoiding long-term and expensive treatments.

    If all would do so, and these people could be motivated by tax breaks for enrolling in these specific types of plans, then development of many chronic and expensive to treat disorders could be caught early. This would reduce healthcare costs.

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    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    The preventative medicine is paid for through premiums, as it is now.
    So, a third-party insurance program -- that unnecessarily raises cost of that medicine.

    The difference is that when a person goes to the doctor for check-ups, screenings, or whatever preventative measures one may take to stay healthy, there is little or no cost.
    Then there should be no issue with the patient paying for it himself.

    The insurance companies could provide low premiums to those who use preventative medicine and live a healthy lifestyle because these people are avoiding, when possible, the more serious conditions that may be caught at early stages, thereby avoiding long-term and expensive treatments.
    Its still a third party payer.

    Third party payers increase costs.

  6. #96
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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by Coolguy View Post
    and

    Believe as you wish. There is no such "Right".



    Are Canadians that uninformed?
    They have no such "Right".
    Go ahead and try to prove that such a "Right" exists in Canada.
    Canadians will also say their healthcare is "free." If you want to play semantics, go nuts.

    Bottom line is Canadians do not get turned away from any hospital or clinic. We expect to recieve care each and every time.
    No men are anywhere, and Im allowed to go in, because Im the owner of the pageant and therefore Im inspecting it, Trump said... Is everyone OK? You know, theyre standing there with no clothes. Is everybody OK? And you see these incredible looking women, and so I sort of get away with things like that.

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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    So, a third-party insurance program -- that unnecessarily raises cost of that medicine.


    Then there should be no issue with the patient paying for it himself.


    Its still a third party payer.

    Third party payers increase costs.

    Ok, so no insurance. So, will people pay for treatment through payment plans directly with the hospital/doctor, and if not then people will have to save money before they can get their broken bones fixed or get treatment? How do you envision that? I agree the world would be better off without insurance companies or government interference, but I am doubtful in reality that market forces alone would work.

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    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by tlmorg02 View Post
    Ok, so no insurance. So, will people pay for treatment through payment plans directly with the hospital/doctor, and if not then people will have to save money before they can get their broken bones fixed or get treatment?
    What's wrong with a payment plan and/or having money in reserve in case you get sick? Seems pretty reasonable to me, in both cases.

    I agree the world would be better off without insurance companies or government interference, but I am doubtful in reality that market forces alone would work.
    If your gripe is the 'cost of health care' then your solution is to put as many free-market forces into the system as possible -- competition always increases quality and lowers cost.

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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by Middleground View Post
    Canadians will also say their healthcare is "free." If you want to play semantics, go nuts.

    Bottom line is Canadians do not get turned away from any hospital or clinic. We expect to recieve care each and every time.
    I am sure that you expect treatment. But that surely doesn't negate the fact that you have no 'Right' to health care.

    This isn't semantics.

    Instead of being factually inaccurate, how about just stating the truth.
    Canadians have no such "Right".

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    Re: Obama calls for overhaul of U.S. health care system

    Quote Originally Posted by Coolguy View Post
    [SIZE="3"][FONT="Georgia"][I]I am sure that you expect treatment. But that surely doesn't negate the fact that you have no 'Right' to health care.
    If the government gives it to you, especially at the expense of someone else, its a privilege, not a a right.

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