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Thread: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    You might as well have written a Disney story if hyperbole is your argument.
    Yeah because the real (Snow-White, Cinderella, etc) Disney movies were totally original.
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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Are you in the position to quantify the cost of increased spread of HIV? If not, than i do not see the point of your first comment, other than subjectiveness...
    Uh, that was the point.

    You responded to an argument that NEP programs should be cut by extolling their virtues. I pointed out that that's a completely irrelevant point without more information.
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    Uh, that was the point.

    You responded to an argument that NEP programs should be cut by extolling their virtues. I pointed out that that's a completely irrelevant point without more information.
    The benefits of HIV reduction are implied though, as it is quite difficult to argue short run costs vs long run costs in regards to a disease that is progressively spread through dirty needles.

    here is something to ponder:http://www.cdph.ca.gov/programs/AIDS...viewSEPsCA.pdf

    A study of 81 cities around the world compared HIV infection rates among IDUs in cities that had SEPs to cities that did not. In the 29 cities with SEPs, HIV infection rates decreased by an average of 5.8 percent per year.
    How much exactly is a 5.8% decrease in HIV worth in tax payers money?

    In the 52 cities without 1 Bluthenthal, R. Syringe Exchange Program Diversity and Correlates of HIV Risk: Preliminary results from the California Syringe Exchange Program Study. Presentation to the California Department of Health Services, Office of AIDS, April 22, 2003. Sacramento, CA. Office of AIDS 3 January 2008 California Department of Public Health SEPs, HIV infection rates increased by 5.9 percent per year. The study concluded that there is strong evidence that SEPs lead to lower levels of HIV among IDUs
    Economic studies have predicted that SEPs could prevent HIV infections among clients, their sex partners, and offspring at a cost of about $13,000 per infection averted.4 This is significantly less than the lifetime cost of treating an HIV-infected person, which is estimated to be $253,196.5 One estimate suggested that a national program of syringe exchange would have saved almost 10,000 lives by 1995
    Would you be so kind as to provide the aggregate cost of these programs in the state of California, that way we can further this discussion?
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    You know what would suck though, if a chick who shoots up contracts HIV (unknowingly) because she began sharing needles due to the abolishment of the local NEP.
    I have no sympathy for someone who shoots up. I especially have no sympathy for someone who is so sloppy about their habits that they endanger themselves.

    Then the next time she sells her ***** to a Jon without wrapping it up, he brings HIV home to his wife.
    I have even less sympathy for the slag who sells her body and the reject loser who thinks that ****ing a prostitute is safe under any condition.

    The Jon eventually feels guilty, and tells her which causes the wife to go off and screw the milkman (without wrapping it up)...
    We all know the tune...no sympathy.

    I know i know, "if people did not do heroin and cheat on their spouses, this would never happen." If my aunt had balls she would be uncle Vickie.
    I don't see the point.

    NEP's are proven to reduce HIV spread in their area. Yes people still share needles from NEP's, but not all of 'em.
    Perhaps HIV is Darwin's way of telling us some people should be cut out of the gene pool and they will do so by their own stupidity.

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Just put a 100% real estate tax on Beverly Hills and they can pay off their debt.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    Just put a 100% real estate tax on Beverly Hills and they can pay off their debt.
    Maybe they should have a celeb stupidity tax. Brittany Spears alone would prob. cover the shortfall.

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I have no sympathy for someone who shoots up. I especially have no sympathy for someone who is so sloppy about their habits that they endanger themselves.



    I have even less sympathy for the slag who sells her body and the reject loser who thinks that ****ing a prostitute is safe under any condition.



    We all know the tune...no sympathy.



    Perhaps HIV is Darwin's way of telling us some people should be cut out of the gene pool and they will do so by their own stupidity.
    Draconian punishment for all those who's actions i do not agree with! *sarcasm*

    I don't see the point.
    It is hard to grasp the concept when personal beliefs conflict with self interests.

    BTW, who cares what you have sympathy for Do you care if i have sympathy St. Judes patients?
    Last edited by Kushinator; 02-04-09 at 01:30 PM.
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
    "Wealth of Nations," Book V, Chapter II, Part II, Article I, pg.911

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    The benefits of HIV reduction are implied though, as it is quite difficult to argue short run costs vs long run costs in regards to a disease that is progressively spread through dirty needles.

    here is something to ponder:http://www.cdph.ca.gov/programs/AIDS...viewSEPsCA.pdf
    LOL at whatever idiot researcher who thought that was a reliable testing method. Let's try to brainstorm a possible factor that could skew this study. Hmmm.....could it be that cities that are developed enough and have the money to implement things like SEP's are just generally more likely to have lower HIV transmission rates than cities like Cape Town or Mumbai?

    How much exactly is a 5.8% decrease in HIV worth in tax payers money?
    Assuming that's true, why don't you tell me? You're the one arguing that it's worth it.

    Would you be so kind as to provide the aggregate cost of these programs in the state of California, that way we can further this discussion?
    Why the **** would I do that?
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Draconian punishment for all those who's actions i do not agree with! *sarcasm*
    Not funding a social program is a "draconian punishment?"

    edit: Also, weren't you a Ron Paul guy?
    People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.

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    Re: California goes broke, halts $3.5 billion in payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenboy219 View Post
    Draconian punishment for all those who's actions i do not agree with! *sarcasm*
    Who, pray tell, is handing out any kind of punative action here? If the slut and the lecherous dog aren't willing to maintain their own health, how does it suddenly become the State's problem and the tax payers' burden to do it for them?

    Draconian punishment my ass. You don't know the meaning of the words because you can't even differentiate between your emotional hyperbole the reality of personal responsibility.

    It is hard to grasp the concept when personal beliefs conflict with self interests.
    Wait...aren't personal beliefs what drive self interest? How do you arrive at the idea that those are in conflict? Do you know what you are saying or are you just being emotional over the heroine whore and her johns?

    BTW, who cares what you have sympathy for Do you care if i have sympathy St. Judes patients?
    Not really because St. Jude's doesn't rely on you to take care of their patients. If you were required to fund a program of St. Jude's that you disagree with, then I might consider your opinion on St Jude's patients something of worth. Until then....
    Last edited by jallman; 02-04-09 at 01:40 PM.

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