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Thread: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

  1. #101
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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    Quote Originally Posted by niftydrifty View Post
    ok, ok, ok,... Uncle! the next I don't document everything, I'll know that all the ad hominems and non-arguments directed at me are perfectly legitimate. thanks for the explanation and clarifications.
    your own definition

    An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: "argument to the man", "argument against the man") consists of replying to an argument or factual claim by attacking or appealing to a characteristic or belief of the source making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim.
    You did not present a "factual claim", and while I did reference the belief of the source I did not do that RATHER than addressing the substance but did it in conjunction with. Your own use of the term doesn't fit with your own definition. What IS rather funny though, is you haven't actually addressed anything I spoke about in regards to Rush's statements being Hyperbole or being given completely out of context and thus can not be said to be universally "his beliefs", rather choosing to focus your counter on whether or not I used an "ad hom".

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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    your own definition

    You did not present a "factual claim", and while I did reference the belief of the source I did not do that RATHER than addressing the substance but did it in conjunction with. Your own use of the term doesn't fit with your own definition. What IS rather funny though, is you haven't actually addressed anything I spoke about in regards to Rush's statements being Hyperbole or being given completely out of context and thus can not be said to be universally "his beliefs", rather choosing to focus your counter on whether or not I used an "ad hom".
    the quotes are his. except for one. end of debate.

    oh, oh, oh, except for the much lengthier post I made, which is documented, and that you haven't addressed at all, not even once.

    all of this about me and what I do, when all the while, we agree about Rush. How odd.

    You must really have it out for me, eh? (you won't mind at all then, if I speculate about your motivations, since it seems to be the crux of the matter here at good ol' DP, hmm?)
    Last edited by niftydrifty; 01-28-09 at 03:47 PM.
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  3. #103
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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    Quote Originally Posted by niftydrifty View Post
    the quotes are his. except for one. end of debate.
    I never denied those were LIKELY his quotes (though without any kind of actual documentation its hard to know for sure. However, I could imagine a situation in which he'd say all of them).

    Having a quote from someone does not = that being their view. You insinuated, and later flat out said, those were his BELIEFS.

    I can say "Hitler is a good man. You know? I mean, he did art. He helped his people out. He wanted the best for his country. I mean, that makes him a good man right? We can't just judge a man on a few single acts, we have to look at his whole life. No man is just "evil", even if he's responsible for the genocide of a people and starting a major war. ".

    Now, I'm being obviously sarcastic. I'm using hyperbole, intentional exaggeration, to make a point (in this case it'd be people that try to always find the "good in people" sometimes miss the obvious that some people are just too bad to try and justify them as being "good"). However, someone could then go and quote me and say that see, zyphlin thinks hitler is a good man. Does the fact that they are able to take that quote PROVE somehow FACTUALLY that I actually BELIEVE that Hitler is a good man?

    No.

    And neither do your single quotes without context PROVE those are Rush's beliefs. At the very most, and even then without some kind of link to prove it its still based on good faith, it proves he SAID them.

    oh, oh, oh, except for the much lengthier post I made, which is documented, and that you haven't addressed at all, not even once.
    I'll head back in the thread and look. Frankly I didn't see any post you made quoting mine besides the one I responded to...the one that didn't actually deal with any of my points save for saying "But, he's a blow hard and a propogandist!" and "You're using Ad Homs"

    all of this about me and what I do, when all the while, we agree about Rush. How odd.
    Actually we don't. We agree that he can be a blow hard that uses hyperbole and spreads propoganda. We disagree with the actual content of your claims...that those quotes of his are his beliefs.

  4. #104
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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    Quote Originally Posted by Shewter View Post
    You should see the Coulter one they did recently. Effing perfect lol.
    OOOOOOo I didn't know there was one! I'll look for it. Thanks for the scoop!
    Quote Originally Posted by soccerboy22 View Post
    You guys are weird.

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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    Hey Nifty, I went back through the thread. Nope, I've seen you address no where that the quotes you quoted had no source, had no context, and in no way shape or form prove that these are his beliefs. Sorry, I looked...the most I've seen you say in regards to that is that he speaks propoganda, he tells mistruths, and that those are his words. None of these things counter that:

    1. You have no context with those quotes.
    2. You provide no proof that those are his actual beliefs and not part of a hyperbolic statement or some other form of parody.

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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    [QUOTE=LaMidRighter;1057902416]
    It's fair, that's how you see it. Here's my take.

    I don't know the man, but he is very consistent, no matter who's in office, whether or not he cares is up for debate as no one is privvy to his private thoughts. Rush doesn't ever advocate for big government, and gives us the information we need plus his analysis, so either way, I think he does an overall good whether we agree with him or not.
    I think that his giving a voice to the conseratives not represented by the GOP is a good thing. I don't like Rush for other reasons more than I don't like his policies.

    I think does a serious disservice to the country with some of his rhetoric. HE is naturally a divider of people, not a uniter.

    His venom towards the other side is overkill, IMO. I'm not saying that he is wrong to want Obama to fail (and by now, everyone knows exactly waht he meant by that).

    I can agree with the concept of supporting the cvountry but not the mission that the leadsers of teh country want ot engage in.

    In fact, it is very similar to the concept of "supporting the troops, but not the mission".

    Where Rush becomes a hypocrite is that he has made statements like: "I told them what I think is the sort of phony-baloney, plastic-banana, good-time rock 'n' roller of some members of the American left saying they support the troops but they don't support their mission"

    The fact is that with the left in charge, their mission is indeed the coutnry's mission.

    So Rush is now engaging in the same thing, in a way, by trying to say that he wants Obama's Policies to fail, not Obama himself.

    Where I can se the difference here, I can also see the difference in the other argument made.

    Rush apparently does not see how his current position parralels that of the left with regard to supporting the troops.

    I was listening to his show that day, and saw the Hannity interview, his stated position is he wants the U.S. to succeed, and Obama to fail in the implementation of more socialism since it fails. He stated as well that he could support a free-market, conservative Obama administration. I am paraphrasing BTW.
    I saw the inteview as well, and my initial thought was that this is akin to supporting the troops, but not the mission. I have absolutely no problem with that mentality.

    My problem is based on Rush's hypocrisy. If it was not OK then, for the opposition to take a similar stance, it should not be OK for him to do so now.

    That is where he is inconsistent.

    HE's very consistently anti-socialism, and I respect that.

    He's not consistinet in his self-application of his ideologies though. He excuses the behavior when he is engaging in it, while fervently denouncing the behavior in others.


    My hourly job is at a broadcasting company, one of the stations carries Rush, his numbers are always increasing, no matter who is in office, so I have to say from experience that your point is a good take, but factually incorrect.
    I'm not saying he has lost ratings, or that they have not increased, I'm saying that he will receive a boost in ratings when he has more material.

    Didn't his ratings increase more when he had Obama to go after in 2008? (Although in general an election year might increase ratings in it's own right)

    I'm saying that he'll have even bigger ratings boosts with Obama in office than he would with McCAin in office because it is likely that more people will become unhappy with liberal policies while Obama is in office. And that's Rush's bread and butter.

    It's addimittedly purely speculation on my part that his ratings will get a bigger boost with Obama than they would have with McCain. I can tell you one thing, though, there is little doubt that Rush's ratings will never decrease with a Dem in office.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  7. #107
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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post

    I think that his giving a voice to the conseratives not represented by the GOP is a good thing. I don't like Rush for other reasons more than I don't like his policies.

    I think does a serious disservice to the country with some of his rhetoric. HE is naturally a divider of people, not a uniter.

    His venom towards the other side is overkill, IMO. I'm not saying that he is wrong to want Obama to fail (and by now, everyone knows exactly waht he meant by that).
    Well put. He sews the seeds of division and uses his position as an influential voice to breed hatred amongst his more gullible listeners. Hardly what this country needs right now.
    "An error does not become truth by reason of multiplied propagation, nor does truth become error because nobody sees it." - Gandhi

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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    Quote Originally Posted by EgoffTib View Post
    Well put. He sews the seeds of division and uses his position as an influential voice to breed hatred amongst his more gullible listeners. Hardly what this country needs right now.
    I don't think he "breeds hate", nor do I think very many of his listeners are "gullible" (actually they are quite informed, overall).

    What I think he does is foster the hate already present in some of his listeners.

    In truth, what he mostly does is give voice to a portion of the population. A large portion, given his ratings.

    Portions of this population truly hate the concepts and ideologies of the left.


    He's just giving voice to that. That is in some ways a service to them, but he does it in a manner that kindles the fires of hatred/distaste, instead of simply giving voice to them.

    And there are other extremely good things that he does using his influence. He's one of the most charitable members of the media-world. The stuff he does for charity is downright honorable. The letter he posted on e-bay going towards the families of fallen soldiers, the lymphoma charities, etc.

    That's the bitch about it for me. If it weren't for some of his tactics and virulence, I would actually quite liike the guy.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  9. #109
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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    I'd actually like to play a round of golf with him. Only because he could get me onto some nice golf courses. Otherwise Tuckers assesment of Rush I pretty much agree with.
    "Loyalty only matters when there's a hundred reasons not to be-" Gen. Mattis

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    Re: Democrats Launch Petition Against Rush Limbaugh

    I'd post my thoughts on Rush but I'll mostly just got with "What Tucker Said".

    I see him as entertainer first personally, political activist second. And I think, though he wouldn't admit it, he does too. Its actually why, if I'm bored or struck by a certain fancy, I don't have issues listening to his show (and find myself agreeing with him at times and wanting to yell at my radio "you idiot" at others) where as people like hannity bore the **** out of me. Hannity is a political pundit that blathers on about issues. Rush is an entertainer that talks about Politics.

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