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Thread: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    I really don't want to be offended...but I am finding really hard not to be. So, if you don't mind helping me out here, please explain to me how you arrive at that.
    I think what he's trying to say is that gay men are big sissies! But seriously folks...

    My position, at least, does not stem from a belief that gay men cannot fight just as well as others - I certainly believe they can and do - nor does it stem from a personal dislike of gay people - I don't really care if the guy clearing a house with me thinks Brad Pitt is hot - my position is this...

    Given the socially conservative composition of the military - combat units in particular - a policy that attempts to fully integrate homosexuality represents a potential complication and loss of operational proficiency, as such it stands to reason that such a potentiality must be avoided. The military is what it is and wishful thinking isn't going to change anything. In the interests of practicality we sometimes have to sacrifice our ideals...shades of grey I'm afraid.

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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by jallman View Post
    I really don't want to be offended...but I am finding really hard not to be. So, if you don't mind helping me out here, please explain to me how you arrive at that.
    Okay, fair enough.

    What I am saying, is females aren't allowed in the front lines because men will do irrational things in order to protect them.

    I'm sure gay folks already practice this policy (or maybe not) but in order for the military to justify keeping them in the front line they've got to plead ignorance. I.E. "Don't ask, don't tell".

    I don't see that policy so much as discriminatory towards gays as it is protection.


    Like I said, nothing anti-gay about it. I'm merely pondering the amount of water those flood gates will let through.
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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    Read it again, I didn't deny being partisan. I said in Britain that being partisan is normal, it is in the US where you get this bipartisan crap.


    We aren't talking about houses but society and institutions although it is characteristic of political rationalism that you apply an enginerring metaphor to politics as if society and institutions were so simplistic as to be apply to be molded by simplistic formulas.

    All I'm saying is caution should be used and change should as far as possible be gradual and piecemeal rather than massive and sweeping in the field of politics. It is a epistomolgical modesty that realises that in social and political affairs humans have many gaps in their understanding so caution is needed. #

    This is ancient Conservative wisdom, in fact along with support for intermediate associations it is basically Conservatism.
    You keep saying "gradually". I ask for clarification and you get out your thesaurus. It's either they are open about their sexual preference or they aren't. I don't know what you mean by gradual change.

    Will it start by allowing them to say, "Sir, fabulous, sir!"?
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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by RightOfCenter View Post
    I really am all for this. You don't have to be straight to shoot straight.

    One has to wonder if it will have any adverse effects on our military. You average private is not necessarily the most open minded person.


    I agree with this point, personally i could care less what people do in their own privacy but you have to figure that a huge majority of the volunteer force that makes up our armed services are country boys who would be affected mentally by this.

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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by MBona View Post
    I agree with this point, personally i could care less what people do in their own privacy but you have to figure that a huge majority of the volunteer force that makes up our armed services are country boys who would be affected mentally by this.
    Their fragile psyches shouldn't be trusted with weapons then.
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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Shewter View Post
    Are homosexual men going to be given the same treatment as women based on principle then?

    Trust me, there is no anti-gayness about this. I just don't know how they would justify holding women out of the frontlines if they allow openly gay men.
    Because women and gay men are the same?

    What?

    And I don't see a problem with women serving in combat either. If it works for the Israelis then it will certainly work for us. Though I would say that if they want to they should have to match the same physical fitness standards as men.
    Quote Originally Posted by SWM
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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post

    Will it start by allowing them to say, "Sir, fabulous, sir!"?
    I'm going to say this next time I talk to an officer.
    Quote Originally Posted by SWM
    I never thought infanticide could be so delicious.

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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
    I think what he's trying to say is that gay men are big sissies! But seriously folks...

    My position, at least, does not stem from a belief that gay men cannot fight just as well as others - I certainly believe they can and do - nor does it stem from a personal dislike of gay people - I don't really care if the guy clearing a house with me thinks Brad Pitt is hot - my position is this...

    Given the socially conservative composition of the military - combat units in particular - a policy that attempts to fully integrate homosexuality represents a potential complication and loss of operational proficiency, as such it stands to reason that such a potentiality must be avoided. The military is what it is and wishful thinking isn't going to change anything. In the interests of practicality we sometimes have to sacrifice our ideals...shades of grey I'm afraid.
    I can agree with this during a war. However, if it was peace time I can't see any logical reason to keep them out.
    Quote Originally Posted by SWM
    I never thought infanticide could be so delicious.

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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by RightOfCenter View Post
    I'm going to say this next time I talk to an officer.
    I take no responsibility for what happens when you do.
    Quote Originally Posted by faithful_servant View Post
    Being a psychiatric patient does not mean that you are mentally ill.



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    Re: Obama to End Military's 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' Policy

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002 View Post
    I take no responsibility for what happens when you do.
    Hey, we're supposed to tell now, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by SWM
    I never thought infanticide could be so delicious.

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