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Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

Laila said:
Blaming everything on one side is incorrect. Israel is not the innocent victim
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Yes...
Israel is 'not innocent' because she has the audacity to believe she has the right to exist.
 
MrVicchio said:
Here's the problem with people like you. You can't get over the fact Israel was created. You harp on this, and legitimize the violence. Fine, the way Israel came into being wasn't the best method around, and caused lots of problems we get it.
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I can't get over the fact Israel exist?
Wow, Go look back on my posts before making incorrect and stupid statements

Oh and Jews have controlled Jerusalem and that land for how long? 60 years? Yes, so long.
Muslims has had it for centuries. You never know what will happen in the future.

But that's just it, people like you believe that accepting that reality is unjust, guess what, that implies the other alternative, the destruction of Israel. Either we destroy Israel, the region accepts Israel and works with that reality for peace, or Israel kicks the ever living **** out of them until they stop attacking her.
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I'd much rather Israel is forced to withdraw to the original borders, forced to give up its Nukes, forced to relinquish control of Jerusalem and forced to give back occupied territory.
But hey, we can't all get what we want now can we?

One is a second holocaust, one is a perhaps not the most just answer ALL things considered, but is the most beneficial AND least lethal way to go, and one has periodic wars and conflict till the end of days.
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A holocaust of Palestinians?
If Israel even tried to do a Nazi on Arabs, i'd advocate Nukes.
 
Goobieman said:
Yes...
Israel is 'not innocent' because she has the audacity to believe she has the right to exist.
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Israel is not innocent in any conflict
It has provoked, it has shed blood and it has its fair share of crazies.
 
Laila said:
I lost? How have i lost anything?
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You're a Palestinian sympathizer which makes you a major part of the problem. You are the one keeping alive the hope of taking back Israel for the Palestinians. You are just as responsible for the fighting as any government leader.
 
sazerac said:
You are the one keeping alive the hope of taking back Palestine for the Palestinians.
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Fixed

And they will get the land back, we can play the waiting game
 
sazerac said:
You're a Palestinian sympathizer which makes you a major part of the problem. You are the one keeping alive the hope of taking back Israel for the Palestinians. You are just as responsible for the fighting as any government leader.
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I believe this sums it up:

Lenin called them "useful idiots," those people living in liberal democracies who by giving moral and material support to a totalitarian ideology in effect were braiding the rope that would hang them. Why people who enjoyed freedom and prosperity worked passionately to destroy both is a fascinating question, one still with us today. Now the useful idiots can be found in the chorus of appeasement, reflexive anti-Americanism, and sentimental idealism trying to inhibit the necessary responses to another freedom-hating ideology, radical Islam.
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Useful idiot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Ah, i guess that makes you Viccho amongst the 'useless idiots' then
 
Laila said:
Fixed

And they will get the land back, we can play the waiting game
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You want perpetual war. You might want to ask yourself what kind of person you are. You want children brought up to hate. You want them to be taught the most effective way to blow themselves up.

Just sick.
 
Laila said:
Israel is not innocent in any conflict
It has provoked, it has shed blood and it has its fair share of crazies.
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You fail to realize -- or at least admit that you realize -- is that Israel 'provokes' simply by existing.

Do you suggest they stop doing that?
 
sazerac said:
You want perpetual war. You might want to ask yourself what kind of person you are. You want children brought up to hate. You want them to be taught the most effective way to blow themselves up.

Just sick.
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Yes ... that is what i want deep down, how did you guess?

While we're at it, i also want the ME and all Muslim countries to wipe out Jews on the way :doh :roll:
 
Goobieman said:
Unless The Obama can convince Hamas that Israel -does- have a right to exist, he's just wasting his time.
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I rarely agree wit you, but I will in this instance. Yes, you're right... Obama and his camp will have to accomplish this difficult task of convincing them that Israel DOES have the right to exist.

The big question is: How does one do that? Will it be best to take the offensive and bomb them (or minimum, refuse any sort of dialogue), or to sit down, break bread, and discuss this matter in hopes of a resolution?

Me, the later is the only possible answer, as bombing will only create more hatred. This has been proven time-and-time again.
 
Goobieman said:
You fail to realize -- or at least admit that you realize -- is that Israel 'provokes' simply by existing.

Do you suggest they stop doing that?
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No, Israel provokes by its actions and that it occupies territories.
Perhaps when it gave no reason to be attacked, it would have the moral ground to preach its innocent but whilst it starves a group of people, continues to build settlements that even their own supreme court ruled is illegal ... then don't go crying about it being because of its mere existence.
 
Laila said:
I'd much rather Israel is forced to withdraw to the original borders, forced to give up its Nukes, forced to relinquish control of Jerusalem and forced to give back occupied territory.
But hey, we can't all get what we want now can we?
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Hamas. etc, define "occupied territory" as every square inch that Israel has sat upon since it was created, and they voe to keep fighting until Israel no longer sits there.
 
Laila said:
No, Israel provokes by its actions and that it occupies territories.
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Again:
Hamas. etc, define "occupied territory" as every square inch that Israel has sat upon since it was created, and they voe to keep fighting until Israel no longer sits there.

Why wont you admit that the simple existence of Israel is the 'problem'?
Hamas and Hizboolah do... why can't you be as honest?
 
Goobieman said:
Hamas. etc, define "occupied territory" as every square inch that Israel has sat upon since it was created, and they voe to keep fighting until Israel no longer sits there.
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Hamas technically is right. Jews, especially EUROPEAN jews have no right to Arab land. They belong to Europe.
However due to historical events people overlook that and i see no reason to not share the land
 
Goobieman said:
Why wont you admit that the simple existence of Israel is the 'problem'?
Hamas and Hizboolah do... why can't you be as honest?
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Yes, use extreme fractions to define honesty .. that works
Why don't you acknowledge Israel also plays a part in continuing this conflict?
 
Laila said:
Fixed

And they will get the land back, we can play the waiting game
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Don't bother with these people. These people are hypocrites. They talk about Palestinians just dealing with it and moving on because they lost their land, yet they are vehemently against illegal immigration to the US and call them invaders and don't want them living here. They don't just deal with it, they want them gone and out of here and if push came to shove, they would shove them out just the same. But when it comes to Muslims in their shoes, they choose to not understand.
 
Laila said:
Yes, use extreme fractions to define honesty .. that works
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In case you didnt notice... the 'extreme factions' -- Hamad and Hizboolah -- are the factions involved here.

Do you or do you not admit that Hamas and Hizboolah define ALL of Israel as 'occupied Palestine" and that they openly state that they will not stop fighting until all of Palestine is liberated?

Why don't you acknowledge Israel also plays a part in continuing this conflict?
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I have already described the part they play, in toto.
 
americanwoman said:
Don't bother with these people. These people are hypocrites. They talk about Palestinians just dealing with it and moving on because they lost their land, yet they are vehemently against illegal immigration to the US and call them invaders and don't want them living here. They don't just deal with it, they want them gone and out of here and if push came to shove, they would shove them out just the same. But when it comes to Muslims in their shoes, they choose to not understand.
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Well said and agree 100%
Its going to be interesting seeing a Hispanic majority within the US xD
 
Goobieman said:
Do you or do you not admit that Hamas and Hizboolah define ALL of Israel as 'occupied Palestine" and that they openly state that they will not stop fighting until all of Palestine is liberated?
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They define all of Israel as Palestinian territory and yes, they want land for Palestinians back so yes
 
Laila said:
They define all of Israel as Palestinian territory and yes, they want land for Palestinians back so yes
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That would not be a workable solution.
 
Laila said:
They define all of Israel as Palestinian territory and yes, they want land for Palestinians back so yes
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And so, given that you agree that Hamas, etc, are motivtaed by the mere existence of Israel, and will not stop fighting Israel until she is destroyed... how do you propose Israel make Hamas and Hizboolah happy?
 
Obama is going to talk to Hamas so now you're all fired up and ready for some more war with the evil Israelis. It's working!

You can win if you just keep up the hate! Keep the hate alive!
 
winston53660 said:
That would not be a workable solution.
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No it wouldn't.
Its too late to chuck all the Jews out of Palestine, i'd rather the land is cut in half and Jerusalem is giving to Muslims [obviously i would] but i know its never going to happen
 
sazerac said:
Obama is going to talk to Hamas so now you're all fired up and ready for some more war with the evil Israelis. It's working!
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Huh? :confused:
 
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