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Thread: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

  1. #181
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by Iriemon View Post
    Aren't smart bombs pretty accurate?

    Where is the report from the IDF asserting that the school was hit be mistake?

    There initial claim, now admitted to be a false according to the UN report, was that they targeted the school because morter fire was coming from the school. And, according to you, using smart bombs.

    Doesn't sound like an accident to me.
    Repeat yourself, much?

  2. #182
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Who is saying "allowed"? Where did I say that?

    I'm saying I hold my friends to a higher standard than I do my enemies. I EXPECT those I consider enemies to do attrocious things, hence they are the ENEMY. I in turn expect my FRIENDS to not sink to the level of the ENEMY.
    There you go, again.

    Look, as I already noted, your standard for Israel would leave Israel defenseless and unwilling to defend herself.

    Second, how is dropping leaflets notifying Gazans to evacuate, using smart weapons, targetting weapons at all equivalent to using suicide bombers and unguided weapons, designed only to inflict maximum civilian casualties?

    Well?

    What is difficult to understand about this?

    I'm not saying Israel has no right to defend itself, I'm saying that we should hold them to a higher standard than that which we condemn our enemies for.
    You're right, you're not saying Israel doesn't have a right to defend herself, only that Israel should not defend herself because doing so would violate your sensibilities.

  3. #183
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    Oh? So you're a-okay with a ground invasion? Color me overwhelmed with surprise.
    Considering that isn't the first time in this thread I mentioned that, your surprise is an indication that you go flying off the handle without being fully aware of the facts. I, for one, am not surprised by this.



    Yeah, It could be a dummy rocket that the Arabs and Muslims fire into israel. It could be untargetted artillery fire. It could be dummy bombs just pickeled off aircraft with no concern for their targets.
    It could also be a targetted task force that lowers the amount of civilian casualties, but puts added risk on their own soldiers, who are willing combatantss, unlike the 40 civilians killed.



    Because nothing you had stated previously suggested that you believed Hamas was guilty of anything.
    So you attack me when I do? Very well. Seems amazingly stupid to me, but have at it.



    Measured judgment on your part.
    Why? So you can attack me for "stating the obvious".
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  4. #184
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    It could also be a targetted task force that lowers the amount of civilian casualties, but puts added risk on their own soldiers, who are willing combatantss, unlike the 40 civilians killed.
    It COULD be... but counterbattery fire requires quick action, as artillery units (especially mortars manned by terrorists) fire off a few rounds and then run to avoid retalliation.

    In an instance like this, the only efficite response is artillery or airstrikes.
    Last edited by Goobieman; 01-09-09 at 02:33 PM.

  5. #185
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by Harshaw View Post
    "How dare you do that?!! I know THEY are, too, but that's just the way THEY are."

    What's not to understand? "Holding someone to a higher standard" means you expect behavior from them that you find excusable in someone else.
    False.

    Holding someone to a higher standard is expecting them not to engage in the behavior you find INexcusable from someone else.

    If I find it inexcusable for Hamas to kill civilians, I find it EQUALLY inexcusable for Israel to do so.

    I do not want the US to ally with Hamas specifically BECAUSE of their inexcusable behavior. Thus, I ALSO want my ally to not engage in the same INexcuxsable behavior.
    Tucker Case - Tard magnet.

  6. #186
    Banned Iriemon's Avatar
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Originally Posted by Iriemon
    So Israel used smart bombs to attack a school when mortar fire came from outside the school.
    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    Did they?
    Let me post my source:

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    Your ignorance has no bounds.

    Israel is using smart weapons. Israel is warning residents to evacuate neighborhoods before they attack.

    What the hell would satisfy you?
    According to my source, the appropriate response to you even asking this question is "Your ignorance has no bounds."

    If you have an issue with that, take it up with the source.

    I'd agree if that were the case. It wasn't.
    Were you an eye witness?

    Iriemon: Cite that Israel warned the school to evacuate before shooting at it with smart bombs?
    Jmak: Who argued they had?
    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    Israel is warning residents to evacuate neighborhoods before they attack.

    What the hell would satisfy you?
    But I agree that with the school it doesn't sound like that warned anyone.

  7. #187
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Moderator's Warning:
    Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'General Thread Warning - I realize that this is a volatile topic. However, every topic can and must be be discussed with civility. So let's plz drop all the personal animosity and concentrate on civil debate. Passion is fine, but personal attacks must cease. Infractions/Thread Bans will ensue if this warning goes unheeded.

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  8. #188
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Considering that isn't the first time in this thread I mentioned that, your surprise is an indication that you go flying off the handle without being fully aware of the facts. I, for one, am not surprised by this.
    No, I'm truly surprised that you'd be all for a ground invasion rather than standoff weapons. I mean, what you're more supportive off is a blunt-force attack into densely populated neighborhoods which would further expose not only those residents to harm, but Israeli soldiers. Why is that preferable to limited engagement? Especially if, as you claim to be, you're sensitive to additional civilian casualties?

    It could also be a targetted task force that lowers the amount of civilian casualties, but puts added risk on their own soldiers, who are willing combatantss, unlike the 40 civilians killed.
    Right...so a mortar team sets up and fires their weapon. Then, they're moving because they know IDF can triangulate on their position.

    What you're arguing for is not a limited size force. Your logic here would require a large presence in Gaza to rapidly move and attack suspected positions.

    So you attack me when I do? Very well. Seems amazingly stupid to me, but have at it.
    Because I have no confidence in your good faith.

    Why? So you can attack me for "stating the obvious".
    If you possessed and applied measured judgment you wouldn't be advocating for Israeli behavior that would render her defenseless and concedes the advantage, tactically and morally, to Hamas.

  9. #189
    Banned Goobieman's Avatar
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    If I find it inexcusable for Hamas to kill civilians, I find it EQUALLY inexcusable for Israel to do so.
    I would agree.. if the circumstances werre the same.

  10. #190
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    Re: Obama camp 'prepared to talk to Hamas'

    Quote Originally Posted by Iriemon View Post
    If you have an issue with that, take it up with the source.
    My comments and statements are clear. There's no need to deliberately misrepresent them.

    Were you an eye witness?
    I see, so we can only comment if we're eyewitnesses.

    So, you are here discussing this....why?

    But I agree that with the school it doesn't sound like that warned anyone.
    You agree with what? No one commented either way.

    Still misrepresenting comments and posts, liar?

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