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Thread: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent



    Iíve watched this different video several times, it looks to me that the guy is on his stomach, with a knee in his neck, the cop stood up, stepped back and just shot him.
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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post


    Iíve watched this different video several times, it looks to me that the guy is on his stomach, with a knee in his neck, the cop stood up, stepped back and just shot him.
    I agree. And if the cop is that incompetent that he mistakenly shot the guy thinking it was a taser gun, someone who hired him needs to be held criminally negligent for putting a gun in his hand to start with.

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    Re: Man's Fatal Shooting by San Francisco Subway Police Prompts Probe, Plans for Laws

    Quote Originally Posted by RightinNYC View Post
    I think I'll just get a red bull.
    I hear ya!

    I wish there was a way to link this thread with the other BART shooting thread. This one has good comments and the other has the best video of the shooting.

    OBL 11/24/02

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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post


    Iíve watched this different video several times, it looks to me that the guy is on his stomach, with a knee in his neck, the cop stood up, stepped back and just shot him.



    nah man, to me it looks like he stood up with his gun down almost at his side and he pulled the trigger. he looks shocked afterwords....


    Glock, plus poor trigger control = tragic accident..... he ain't yelling he ain't mad, and he looks shocked after it happened.....
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    nah man, to me it looks like he stood up with his gun down almost at his side and he pulled the trigger. he looks shocked afterwords....


    Glock, plus poor trigger control = tragic accident..... he ain't yelling he ain't mad, and he looks shocked after it happened.....
    If that is the case he should still be in jail for manslaughter.

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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    If that is the case he should still be in jail for manslaughter.

    That kid was restrained. He was not going any where. There was not even a need for a taser. And how the heck would a trained cop screw up thinking his glock was a freaking taser????

    This was just a general disturbance beef. The kids got into a fight on a train. No weapons involved etc, this cop is screwed,

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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    If that is the case he should still be in jail for manslaughter.
    How so? and voluntary?





    look this has happened before luckily here no one was shot:


    YouTube - Dumb cop almost shoots partner


    are you going to argue that this female officer was intending to shoot the suspect while the other officer had his knee on the suspects back?


    it is almost identical... poor finger control + glock = a bad recipe.....



    Am I saying this dood should be a cop ever again? nope. but to look at this as a murder or even nonnegligent manslaughter is a stretch as to me it there was no intent to kill.
    Last edited by ReverendHellh0und; 01-10-09 at 09:07 AM.
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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    How so? and voluntary?





    look this has happened before luckily here no one was shot:


    YouTube - Dumb cop almost shoots partner


    are you going to argue that this female officer was intending to shoot the suspect while the other officer had his knee on the suspects back?


    it is almost identical... poor finger control + glock = a bad recipe.....



    Am I saying this dood should be a cop ever again? nope. but to look at this as a murder or even nonnegligent manslaughter is a stretch as to me it there was no intent to kill.
    Hey... maybe that'll change cops training a bit : when you have a suspe that is subdued the ONLY tool you need to draw is your handcuffs.

    It's like if you're driving your car, don't pay attention for a few seconds hit another car causing a fatality. You may not have wanted to kill the person, you omay or may not have been negligent, but you still did take another man's life and that should be answered for, cop or not.

    If anything, since we are entrusting these officers to maintain the peace and maintaining our publix safety, they should be held up to a HIGHER standard. Also, that the cop STOOD UP rrather than keeping him subdued and getting his hands in cuffs... so if the suspect was fighting back, giving him more room to move could be seen as negligent.

    That there was an attempt to cover this up (by claiming there was no video and station security camera's werent working at the time), IF ACCURATE should also be viewed as tampering with evidence. In that, if true, these are clearly cops that have the willingness to modify evidence to their favor.

    So, he should have to defend himself accused of murder, but able to argue the unintentional murder and face manslaughter/. Jusr like any civilian would have to go throw under similar circumstance.

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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by BmanMcfly View Post
    Hey... maybe that'll change cops training a bit : when you have a suspe that is subdued the ONLY tool you need to draw is your handcuffs.

    It's like if you're driving your car, don't pay attention for a few seconds hit another car causing a fatality. You may not have wanted to kill the person, you omay or may not have been negligent, but you still did take another man's life and that should be answered for, cop or not.

    If anything, since we are entrusting these officers to maintain the peace and maintaining our publix safety, they should be held up to a HIGHER standard. Also, that the cop STOOD UP rrather than keeping him subdued and getting his hands in cuffs... so if the suspect was fighting back, giving him more room to move could be seen as negligent.

    That there was an attempt to cover this up (by claiming there was no video and station security camera's werent working at the time), IF ACCURATE should also be viewed as tampering with evidence. In that, if true, these are clearly cops that have the willingness to modify evidence to their favor.

    So, he should have to defend himself accused of murder, but able to argue the unintentional murder and face manslaughter/. Jusr like any civilian would have to go throw under similar circumstance.


    two things.

    1. can you link me to this cover up?

    2. you really did not address my point as i demonstrated this accident is not the 1st time it has happened. Can you do this?


    here is another i am sure you have seen....


    YouTube - DEA Shoots Himself






    as you can see, i have shown at least 3 incidents where there is similar mistakes made.

    Now given this, how do you maintain a charge of "murder" or "manslaughter"?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Protests over BART shooting turn violent

    Quote Originally Posted by Reverend_Hellh0und View Post
    two things.

    1. can you link me to this cover up?
    I carefully worded the potential of this, because the first source that I saw argue that point was from a blogsite, but now the security footage has been released, but was nothing comparable to the clarity of the other angles. So, simply dismiss this argued point, as I've found it to be innapplicable to this case.

    2. you really did not address my point as i demonstrated this accident is not the 1st time it has happened. Can you do this?
    Right, now the DEA officer that shoots himself, had said just before shooting himself that the gun wasn't loaded?? I wouldn't actually argue it, but I suppose technically speaking if he shot himself above the waist he could be tried for attempted suicide... If however, the gun discharged and had shot someone in the class fatally, I understand that it's a mistake, but manslaughter is essentially 'unintentional murder', but to be safe I looked for a legal definition : Legal Definition of Manslaughter
    MANSLAUGHTER - The unlawful killing of a human being without malice or premeditation, either express or implied; distinguished from murder, which requires malicious intent.

    The cases of manslaughter may be classed as follows those which take place in consequence of:
    1. Provocation.
    2. Mutual combat.
    3. Resistance to public officers, etc.
    4. Killing in the prosecution of an unlawful or wanton act.
    5. Killing in the prosecution of a lawful act, improperly performed, or performed without lawful authority.
    In the case of the officer shooting himself... while he may be embarrassed by it, he might have to answer questions to be eligible for disibility benefits while recovering, but other than that there's nothing really to say.

    In the case of the cop accidentally shooting the partner... I have to wonder why the woman was still training her gun on the suspect whien she was subdued, but I would say that she was lucky, and gets to call it a near miss. Person being arrested probly shat themselves... but if she shot her partner it would be up to the partner to place charges probably assault, which was clearly accidental. If she had shot the victim, I would argue the same point if injusred could press charges on the officer, and if killed the officer be charged for manslaughter. The intent is more clear in this video.

    The difference between this last case and the bart shooting however is the sequence of events, the accidental discharge was a cop that was trained on the suspect while he was being subdued, and in the bart shooting was the cop pulling his gun and shooting a subdued victim. In the bart shooting case the officer will have to show how he confused the gun and the taser, which you'd think should be on opposite sides or far enough apart to prevent this.

    Ultimately the piont is that there is no reason to pull out a gun on a subdued suspect.

    as you can see, i have shown at least 3 incidents where there is similar mistakes made.
    Now given this, how do you maintain a charge of "murder" or "manslaughter"?
    The charge would be murder because having a suspect on the ground, pulling out his gun and shooting him in the back as a sequence of events is murder, since it shows the intent to kill. In this circumstance, if he were to argue 'taser confusion' I would be willing to accept that, but he still endd a man's life, even unintentionally while engaging in his lawful duty of placing a citizen under arrest is still manslaughter.

    So, yes, this cop needs to see the inside of a prison.

    The cop almost shooting her partner is lucky to not have killed the suspect.

    and the DEA agent in a classroom would likely be protected through waivers since he is teaching a class involving firearms, but only harmed himself.

    I hope that would suffice in addressing the point?
    Last edited by BmanMcfly; 01-10-09 at 06:51 PM.

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