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Thread: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by Goobieman View Post
    Seems to me that, at worst, the primary definition you provided fits perfectly well.
    I said I saw your line of logic, I did not say the first definition matched the case. The military traits attributed to space as a result of the merging would be minimal.

    1. Military rockets may substitute the NASA's more expensive and unfinished version.
    2. NASA and DoD will now be sharing information.

    Unless you have more significant traits you wish to include, it would be inaccurate to say these traits would necessarily character space as militarized.

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    That "last part" does not give any indication of any cold war mentality (whatever that is).

    What assumptions did I make? That you think we should avoid even preparing to militarize or weaponzie space to avoid offending the ChiComs?

    Why is that such an unreasonable assumption?
    The fact that you don't know what cold war mentality means speaks volumes.

    you really want me to explain how you made a terrible assumption?

    Ok, in my first post I said this:
    I see this as the difference between weaponizing space and preparing for weaponized space. If China continues with plans to target satellite warfare I expect Obama to respond as any reasonable person would.
    Do you see how you made an ass of yourself now?

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by shiznit770 View Post
    The fact that you don't know what cold war mentality means speaks volumes.
    No, I don't know what you mean by it.

    You really have a fetish with divination, don't you? I'm supposed to divine what you mean wen you post your cliched phrases, eh?

    you really want me to explain how you made a terrible assumption?
    Yeah. What was so ~gasp~ terrible about it?

    I mean, you could have just I made a poor assumption, but now you've gone and gotten all choked up about it.

    Do you see how you made an ass of yourself now?
    Uh, no. Re-posting what you already posted doesn't explain why you think I was bieng an "ass."

    With all the time you've wasted here you could have already responded to my post several times over in a direct and reasonable manner.

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by shiznit770 View Post
    I said I saw your line of logic, I did not say the first definition matched the case. The military traits attributed to space as a result of the merging would be minimal.
    ...
    Unless you have more significant traits you wish to include, it would be inaccurate to say these traits would necessarily character space as militarized.
    You said that you agree that merging of the branches gives NASA somewhat of a military character to it.

    You also stated as your primary definition of 'militarize' as 'to give a military character to'.

    Hard to see how you dont agree that Obama looks to militarize space.

    And, given that you did not respond, I take it that you agree that the Bush administration did indeed not look to 'weaponize' space.

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    Um, no. The president cannot simply direct NASA to start conducting research on whatever he likes. As you should already know, NASA cannot conduct such research unless it has the funding to do so. The President cannot and does not have the authority to reprogram appropriations made by Congress. Hence, Congress would have to authorize the expenditure of dollars on such a program and then appropriate the actual funding.
    Uhh no. NASA is under the Executive Branch. Congress controls the purse strings, but NASA is under the mandate of the President.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    Uh, no. Re-posting what you already posted doesn't explain why you think I was bieng an "ass."

    With all the time you've wasted here you could have already responded to my post several times over in a direct and reasonable manner.
    That you think we should avoid even preparing to militarize or weaponzie space to avoid offending the ChiComs?
    See you assumed I was against even preparing to militarize or weaponize space when in actuality I stated just the opposite in my first post which you quoted! Since your initial post characterized mine and had a hostile tone to it I responded in a similar fashion.

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Uhh no. NASA is under the Executive Branch. Congress controls the purse strings, but NASA is under the mandate of the President.
    So you whine about King George but you have no problem with the President taking an appropriations bill from Congress and ignoring it so he can spend the money some other way?

    Your inconsistencies reflect a certain intellectual dishonesty.

    Yes, NASA is under the control and supervision of the Executive. So is DoD. However, the President cannot reprogram appropriated budget dollars authorized for expenditure toward a new air defense system and redirect that money to fund a new division for the Army.

    The President cannot reprogram appropriated funds without congressional approval.

    If you disagree with this, please provide an explanation.

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by shiznit770 View Post
    See you assumed I was against even preparing to militarize or weaponize space
    No, I didn't.

    You clearly commented that the US should wait to prepare until it's clear that China is continuing with plans to weaponize space.

    I merely asked you why we should wait.

    when in actuality I stated just the opposite in my first post which you quoted! Since your initial post characterized mine and had a hostile tone to it I responded in a similar fashion.
    I see, so you said I had a cold war mentality (again, whatever that means - though in this case you just used as a perjorative rather than anything meaningful) because you thought my comments were accompanied with a hostile tone?

    Rather than simply answering a plain question?

    Really?

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    So you whine about King George but you have no problem with the President taking an appropriations bill from Congress and ignoring it so he can spend the money some other way?

    Your inconsistencies reflect a certain intellectual dishonesty.

    Yes, NASA is under the control and supervision of the Executive. So is DoD. However, the President cannot reprogram appropriated budget dollars authorized for expenditure toward a new air defense system and redirect that money to fund a new division for the Army.

    The President cannot reprogram appropriated funds without congressional approval.

    If you disagree with this, please provide an explanation.
    Congress appropriates money. That money is not dictated. They give X to NASA, but they don't stipulate what research or programs that X amount of money is spent on. If they don't like it, they could decrease X; but they don't. Once the money is appropriated, NASA spends it on the things the President wants done. NASA is under the mandate of the President, it does as the President tells them to. If the President says "manned mission to Mars", NASA has to work towards a manned mission to Mars. Congress won't slash their budget because of it. The entire point was that NASA should no longer be under the mandate of the President. If we're going to have NASA, it needs to be run by the scientists. I don't see why I should spend my money on a bunch of worthless programs that aren't scientifically viable.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Obama Moves to Counter China With Pentagon-NASA Link

    Quote Originally Posted by JMak View Post
    No, I didn't.

    You clearly commented that the US should wait to prepare until it's clear that China is continuing with plans to weaponize space.

    I merely asked you why we should wait.

    I see, so you said I had a cold war mentality (again, whatever that means - though in this case you just used as a perjorative rather than anything meaningful) because you thought my comments were accompanied with a hostile tone?

    Rather than simply answering a plain question?

    Really?
    I said the US should make preparations, such as the integration of NASA with the military but not weaponize space until diplomacy has failed.

    The reason we should way is because China weaponizing space is not a certainty and should you treat it like one you are promoting a "cold-war like mentality". This means you assume the worst and attempt to prepare for it militarily, promoting military spending instead of diplomacy.

    The fact is diplomacy will fail if the US insists on military dominance in every area.

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