• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Israeli ground troops enter Gaza

Oh yes because Israel is so perfect right? Because it doesn't have blood on its hands?

Oh no, its all the Arabs fault we are in this entire mess :roll:
 
Khayembii Communique said:
I could say the same of everything you say, as you clearly have no capacity for independent thought.
Click to expand...
You are free to say so, as you are free to say many incorrect, inaccurate and unfounded things.

As for my capacity for independent thought. I am amused by your contention, and feel no compulsion to correct you in this matter. Carry on.
Khayembii Communique said:
Am I flaming now? I can't tell what's a flame and what's not anymore.
Click to expand...
No. rest assured that you are merely spluttering.

Khayembii Communique said:
Anyways, I think this is about equivalent to calling people small children.
Click to expand...
We'll is you'll read my post again, this time with a bit more care, you'll see that I did not actually call the earlier poster a child, I merely pointed out that their assertion was worthy of a child's thought process.

You see?
 
EgoffTib said:
Then you must overlook the attacking of civilian targets with phosphorous bombs by the "good guys". :lol:
Click to expand...
Obviously, it depends upon whether they are the children of the "good guys," or the "bad guys."

You might want to look up the WWII bombing campaigns against London, Berlin, Dresden, Hiroshima, Tokyo, and Pearl Harbor.
More contemporary examples can be found in the Viet Nam Conflict, as well as the current conflicts in Afghanistan and Iraq.

A good example of similar thinking can be found in the annuals of the WONA under the exploits of General Sherman.

Again, this is war. It is particularly ugly, and hostile groups like the Palestinians in Gaza are well advised to avoid inciting it.
 
Laila said:
Oh no, its all the Arabs fault we are in this entire mess :roll:
Click to expand...

That is Britain's responsibility I'm afraid and Arthur Balfour's of course. A black act in British history particularly when you consider the betrayal of the Arabs who helped to beat the Turks.
 
Wessexman said:
That is Britain's responsibility I'm afraid and Arthur Balfour's of course. A black act in British history particularly when you consider the betrayal of the Arabs who helped to beat the Turks.
Click to expand...

Oh i agree, UK has some responsibility ...

Not exactly the first country we meddled with in our history :doh
 
Oftencold said:
This is an assertion for very small children who cannot make tough ethical and moral judgments.

Personally, I think I'll call the ones who think it's a swell idea to strap bombs on their kids and sent them out to blow up people in pizzerias the "bad guys."
Click to expand...

And I'd call the descendents of and living land thieves the bad guys but that is neither here nor there and does no excuse the killing of civilians or help the current situation.
 
Laila said:
Oh yes because Israel is so perfect right? Because it doesn't have blood on its hands?

Oh no, its all the Arabs fault we are in this entire mess :roll:
Click to expand...
You really must try to be less overwrought in these matters, and allow Sweet Reason to hold sway.

I do not look for perfection in anything human, and am pleasantly surprised when I discover even mild examples of honer, compassion or mercy.

The fact of the matter is that while Israel is far from perfect, Hamas and it's supporters are not at all far from screaming, homicidal savagery.

The level of moral disparity 'twixt the parties is vast, profound, and obvious.


However, if one enjoys the practice of war, terrorism, murder and ethnic suicide, I suppose one is advised to support both sides, or withhold support form either, that the conflict might continue indefinitely, form generation, to tattered generation.
 
Last edited:
Oftencold said:
The fact of the matter is that while Israel is far from perfect
Click to expand...

Exactly, so **** both sides.
I would rather UK stays out of this entire mess and doesn't support Israel
 
Laila said:
Exactly, so **** both sides.
I would rather UK stays out of this entire mess and doesn't support Israel
Click to expand...
Then, perforce, you support the abrogation of your Nation's responsibilities, and unending suffering and darkness in the Middle East.

And you allow yourself to feel "clean" in so doing, amazing!


Good show!
 
Oftencold said:
Then, perforce, you support the abrogation of your Nation's responsibilities, and unending suffering and darkness in the Middle East.

And you allow yourself to feel "clean" in so doing, amazing!


Good show!
Click to expand...

Why not let them solve their own problems? This issue of land grabbing was not created by the United States or Kingdom.
 
Oftencold said:
Then, perforce, you support the abrogation of your Nation's responsibilities, and unending suffering and darkness.

And you allow yourself to feel "clean" in so doing, amazing!


Good show!
Click to expand...
What responsibilties? We have a responsibility to our own people first and as every old Tory knows getting tangled up in foreign wars helps that little. I'm not a liberal, I don't much care for interventionist, ideological crusades.

Also if we had a responsibility it would be to the Palestinians whose land we help to steal.
 
Last edited:
Oftencold said:
Then, perforce, you support the abrogation of your Nation's responsibilities, and unending suffering and darkness in the Middle East.

And you allow yourself to feel "clean" in so doing, amazing!


Good show!
Click to expand...

Well i suppose our other option is to upend it again, remove all Jews, Arabs and residents and reclaim it again ...

Hmm ... i kinda like that idea ....
 
EgoffTib said:
Why not let them solve their own problems? This issue of land grabbing was not created by the United States or Kingdom.
Click to expand...

Actually it was partially created by us. We drew up the Balfour declaration, we held the country during a time when Jews moved from being 8% to a majority of the population of what is now Israel and we had more than a small responsibility for that.
 
Wessexman said:
So would I.

In Britain we believe in private property.
Click to expand...
You know there was a time not long ago, when Britain was a shinning light of civilization in the world, and advanced an ideal that enriched the existence of billions.

There is a school of thought that says that cultures grow old , whither and die just like their component humans.
 
Wessexman said:
Also if we had a responsibility it would be to the Palestinians whose land we help to steal.
Click to expand...

True.
UK should be supporting Palestinians if we are talking about responsibility
 
Oftencold said:
You know there was a time not long ago, when Britain was a shinning light of civilization in the world, and advanced an ideal that enriched the existence of billions.

There is a school of thought that says that cultures grow old , whither and die just like their component humans.
Click to expand...

Every country has its day.
Arabs has had it, Romans, Greeks, then Brits and then very soon ... US will be joining us :)
 
EgoffTib said:
Why not let them solve their own problems? This issue of land grabbing was not created by the United States or Kingdom.
Click to expand...
Tell me, if I am attacked in the street by a deranged madman, even one that I have not always been kind or fair to, would you leave me to my fate or provide some aid?


How you answer will say a great deal about you and your philosophy.
 
Oftencold said:
You know there was a time not long ago, when Britain was a shinning light of civilization in the world, and advanced an ideal that enriched the existence of billions.

There is a school of thought that says that cultures grow old , whither and die just like their component humans.
Click to expand...
Indeed, it a good way of looking at history. Britain was not really a shining light, we got tangled up in the affairs of many nations, rarely to their benefits and not too much more to ours in my belief. I certainly don't consider conviving to take people's land and give it to others to be a shinning light.
 
Laila said:
Every country has its day.
Arabs has had it, Romans, Greeks, then Brits and then very soon ... US will be joining us :)
Click to expand...

But it seems, not today. We have work to do and can't come lie in the mud with you just now.
 
Oftencold said:
Tell me, if I am attacked in the street by a deranged madman, even one that I have not always been kind or fair to, would you leave me to my fate or provide some aid?


How you answer will say a great deal about you and your philosophy.
Click to expand...

Firstly you are of course assuming Israel is in the right. I personally believe a two state solution needs to be found but I always consider Israel the aggressor. They came to someone else's country and took over.

Secondly you cannot compare the affairs of nations to individuals in such a simplistic way.
 
Wessexman said:
Indeed, it a good way of looking at history. Britain was not really a shining light, we got tangled up in the affairs of many nations, rarely to their benefits and not too much more to ours in my belief. I certainly don't consider conviving to take people's land and give it to others to be a shinning light.
Click to expand...
Look again, more closely and without the Twenty First century prejudices that you have been taught to embrace.

Remember that conquest was the rule of the world until very recently, and if we've moved beyond that, few if anu great power had before the Twentieth Century.

As a whole, Britain raised the standards of living, education and justice in all the lands that they occupied.

So strong were the institutions that they established, that people often fought to maintain them after the British had departed.

So powerful were the ideals regarding the Rights of Man that the British propagated, that their denial could cause client colonies to rebel against the government in favor of the culture thus established, as we did in America.

Look again at the nations that learned their lessons well from Britain, and compare them to the nations colonized by Spain, for instance.

And look to your people a scant lifetime ago when they defied, almost alone at first, the ultimate corruption of European ideals and the utter perversion of the heritage of the White Peoples.

No, you really do need to reassess this matter. One of my fondest hopes is the Britain one day, will remember who they are.
 
Last edited:
Oftencold said:
Look again, more closely and without the Twenty First century prejudices that you have been taught to embrace.
Click to expand...
:lol: Me have 21st century prejudices, you obviously don't know me well, part of me has barely reached the 13th century.

My prejudices are 17th and 18th century and older, they are old Tory prejudices against standing armies, foreign wars and entanglements and old whig prejudices against arbitrary power.


As a whole, Britain raised the standards of living, education and justice in all the lands that they occupied.
Click to expand...
They interfered arbitrarily in the affairs of other nations and cultures. You own nation was none too happy about British rule after a while.



So powerful were the ideals regarding the Rights of Man the the British propagated, that their denial could cause client colonies to rebel against the government in favor of the culture thus established, as we did in America.
Click to expand...
The rights of man is Jacobin speak, I don't much care for it. British liberty was never built on such unsound foundations hence you can compare the revolution of 1688 with that of 1789 and see the great differences.


And look to your people a scant lifetime ago when they defied almost alone at first the ultimate corruption of European ideals and the utter perversion of the heritage of the white peoples.
Click to expand...
That was ancient British courage and honour.

No, you really do need to reassess this matter. One of my fondest hopes is the Britain one day, will remember who they are.
Click to expand...
I remember who we are. I remember Clarendon and Harley, I remember Burke's prosecution of Warren Hastings for similar abuses that you seem to hail as glorious.
 
Last edited:
Wessexman said:
Firstly you are of course assuming Israel is in the right. I personally believe a two state solution needs to be found but I always consider Israel the aggressor. They came to someone else's country and took over.
Click to expand...
Delve a bit. Palestine was not a country, and the Jews had been busy buying up much of the land for a very long time.

You should also study up on the quaint fact that Islam not only encourages but demands violent conquest, and how much of the Islamic world was converted by force. In other words, they are hardly ion a position to complain about the Israelis acquiring land in a similar fashion, which they have only partly done.

Also almost every nation in the world today was founded by conquest. I seem to remember that there is a large island nation off the west coast of Europe with a history of successive waves of conquests and land-grabs in its history. Yet I do not believe that there is a serious case being made to return all of that pillaged real estate to the Celts.

Wessexman said:
Secondly you cannot compare the affairs of nations to individuals in such a simplistic way.
Click to expand...
What do you mean I can't? I just did!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom