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German navy foils Somali pirates

bhkad said:
With your talent for finding fault with America, seemingly, without regard to what the matter might be, please help me out and tell me how you'd bash this development.
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Thats completely false. I just point to the faults. Never said that the US and everything about it is negative, thats just your extremist opposition reflex of anyone mentioning ANYTHING negative about the US.
Perhaps in this day and age we should ban all negative talk about the US, it would certainly fit the political picture of the last 8 years.
 
Maximus Zeebra said:
BBC NEWS | Africa | German navy foils Somali pirates


Who says Europe isn't doing their part.. GySgt.. Even Germany is down there, that is amazing considering a bit of history and their lack of will to have forces abroad.
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Well, other than the UK and France, nice to see someone else down there from Europe. Kudos for the Germans. The entire maritime world needs to focus on this problem. It affects all of us.
 
ludahai said:
Well, other than the UK and France, nice to see someone else down there from Europe. Kudos for the Germans. The entire maritime world needs to focus on this problem. It affects all of us.
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As a Taiwanese you probably have an opinion about the Chinese involvement.. Id like to hear that.
I think its dumb that these nations do not cooperate. Like th article said, Germans will only bring people to trial that "went against German interests". All the countries down there are really just protecting their own national trade fleet. Chinese protect Chinese, Germans protect Germans and so on.. The only one that really do general protection I guess would be France and possibly the US and the European mission.
 
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ludahai said:
Well, other than the UK and France, nice to see someone else down there from Europe. Kudos for the Germans. The entire maritime world needs to focus on this problem. It affects all of us.
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LOL, there are many European nations in the area. Denmark, Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Dutch, Germany, UK, France, Italy, Poland and so on.
 
Germany has a navy? :confused:
 
independent_thinker2002 said:
Germany has a navy? :confused:
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Its secret, and its 20 times more powerful than the US navy, which quite honestly looks amateurish in comparison.
Huge underseas monsters, and flying hangar ships(that also can dive) and so on, but luckily Germany is a pacifist nation now :lol:
 
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Maximus Zeebra said:
As a Taiwanese you probably have an opinion about the Chinese involvement.. Id like to hear that.
I think its dumb that these nations do not cooperate. Like th article said, Germans will only bring people to trial that "went against German interests". All the countries down there are really just protecting their own national trade fleet. Chinese protect Chinese, Germans protect Germans and so on.. The only one that really do general protection I guess would be France and possibly the US and the European mission.
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For the record, I am U.S. born and immigrated to Taiwan years ago.

I am concerned any time China gets involved because they always insert politics. However, I don't see too much damage they can do in this situation.

The British, French, and Americans seem to try to protect everyone there. I can't speak for the others. Still, the more assets in the area, the more intimidating that could be to the pirates.
 
As of December 18, 2008........


Canadian Forces Maritime Command (NATO)
French Navy (NATO)
German Navy (NATO)
Greek Navy (NATO)
Italian Navy (NATO)
Royal Navy (UK) (NATO)
Royal Danish Navy (NATO)
Royal Netherlands Navy (NATO)
Spanish Navy (NATO)
Turkish Navy (NATO)
United States Navy (NATO)


Swedish Navy
Royal Saudi Navy
Royal Malaysian Navy

Indian Navy (SCO)
Islamic Republic of Iran Navy (SCO)
Russian Navy (SCO)
People's Liberation Army Navy (China) (SCO)

Piracy in Somalia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It is now widely understood that European companies are systematically dumping toxic waste in these waters. The UN special envoy for Somalia, Ahmedou Ould Abdallah, has in the past few months repeatedly sounded the alarm about illegal fishing and toxic dumping off Somalia by European firms. Abdullah said that his organisation has "reliable information" that European and Asian companies are dumping the waste - including nuclear waste, - in this region. The European Union has responded to these allegations with silence. EUobserver
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Lessons have been learned. America has had to deal with Europe's trash for too long and been the target for all criticisms. Aside from policing our own ships and our own interests in this waterway, why should America help Europe and Asia out of yet another mess? The Cold War is over. In the 19th century, America dealt with the Barbary Pirates in the Med and Europe benefitted. Maybe Europe can return the favor so that America can merely benefit for a change.
 
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GySgt said:
As of December 18, 2008........


Canadian Forces Maritime Command (NATO)
French Navy (NATO)
German Navy (NATO)
Greek Navy (NATO)
Italian Navy (NATO)
Royal Navy (UK) (NATO)
Royal Danish Navy (NATO)
Royal Netherlands Navy (NATO)
Spanish Navy (NATO)
Turkish Navy (NATO)
United States Navy (NATO)


Swedish Navy
Royal Saudi Navy
Royal Malaysian Navy

Indian Navy (SCO)
Islamic Republic of Iran Navy (SCO)
Russian Navy (SCO)
People's Liberation Army Navy (China) (SCO)
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For the love of God, these are people in fishing boats with 10 year old weapons. The world seriously needs THAT many countries to deal with a few people in dresses? :roll:

Haha, bet the pirates are shocked.
They got a response they didn't expect lmao
 
Laila said:
For the love of God, these are people in fishing boats with 10 year old weapons. The world seriously needs THAT many countries to deal with a few people in dresses? :roll:
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Yes. And insurgents in Iraq are just Arabs with AK47s. Do you even have a clue as to the type of threat these people pose to ships? These are people who've gone as far as buying money counters. That is a far cry from '10 year old weapons and fishing boats'.
 
Laila said:
For the love of God, these are people in fishing boats with 10 year old weapons. The world seriously needs THAT many countries to deal with a few people in dresses? :roll:
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Apparantly so. The problem is that no one is dealing with it. They are floating around protecting their own and waiting for America to do it for them. I am quickly coming to the opinion that America needs to start cleaning up its own messes and leaving the overwhelming rest to Europe and Asia. We didn't dump **** in those waters. Our messes encompass the few events during the Cold War. This mess developed during the '90s.

But the same goes for Somalia. If Somalia ever needs America to feed it, it should remember what it did the last time food tried to get delivered to those who needed it.
 
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Hatuey said:
Yes. And insurgents in Iraq are just Arabs with AK47s. Do you even have a clue as to the type of threat these people pose to ships? These are people who've gone as far as buying money counters. That is a far cry from '10 year old weapons and fishing boats'.
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If people actually stored guns on their ships instead of just allowing pirates take it, maybe the pirates wouldn't have had the money to buy new weapons and increase their technology.

Either way, the whole pirate 'problem' is moot and insignificant in that region compared to the fact the Somali President just got impeached leaving a power vaccum which the Islamists will try and fill made worse by the fact Ethiopia is withdrawing. Now the battle is on in Somalia between the moderate Islamists [who remain loyal to ex-President] and al-Shabab
 
GySgt said:
I am quickly coming to the opinion that America needs to start cleaning up its own messes and leaving the overwhelming rest to Europe and Asia. We didn't dump **** in those waters. Our messes encompass the few events during the Cold War. This mess developed during the '90s.

But the same goes for Somalia. If Somalia ever needs America to feed it, it should remember what it did the last time food tried to get delivered to those who needed it.
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I happen to agree with your opinion. But in regards to US, damned if you do; damned if you don't.

Who represents Somalia?
There is how many factions attempting to get control. If one faction bites US's hand off. Does the entire country deserve to suffer for it?
 
Laila said:
Who represents Somalia?
There is how many factions attempting to get control. If one faction bites US's hand off. Does the entire country deserve to suffer for it?
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Yes. Culture is fate. It's called responsibility. If America has to deal with the decisions made by Americans, then other nation's peoples should have to deal with the decisions their people make too. It's the same garbage we are experiencing in the Arab Middle East. What are Somalis doing against those factions who are ruining everything? Nothing. With this "support," why should America lift a finger to do what Somalis should at least be meeting us half way with?

The EU and Asia screwed up those waters. Somalia was an Italian colony. I think Americans have learned a lot about this world since 9/11. Before Somalia, Americans believed that people appreciated American aid. Before 9/11, we were stupid and believed in illusions of "friendships." In a sense we were disgustingly niave. But nations don't have friends do they? They merely have "allies," which is primarily and almost solely based on mutual interest. Morality has nothing to do with nothing. A common theme that seems to bring our left and right together anymore depending on which party occupies the White House is the bitter "**** you" attitude towards the world.

There is an argument amongst think tanks that helping third world nations out of their cultural nightmares is mutually beneficial to them and to America's future security. But there is also an argument that these third world nations are largely European legacies and as long as we don't accept responsibility for them, then we will be left alone and won't have to be placed in the position of defending ourselves and being criticized for it. Both views bring a never ending criticism from even our "friends."

I don't quite know what my argument is anymore.
 
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GySgt said:
What are Somalis doing against those factions who are ruining everything?
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Dying.

Somali Moderate Islamists are fighting against the Extremists within Somalia.
The President has left, the moderates will most likely get control of the Government but then they will have to fight against the fact the Islamists during Yusuf's [pathetic] reign of power had taken control of nearly the entire country.
 
Laila said:
Dying.

Somali Moderate Islamists are fighting against the Extremists within Somalia.
The President has left, the moderates will most likely get control of the Government but then they will have to fight against the fact the Islamists during Yusuf's [pathetic] reign of power had taken control of nearly the entire country.
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I'm aware. It's a target of interest in our intel world as is the entire HOA. But "dying" is a choice. There has been attempts to gather and strengthen the "dying," but all attempts from the outside have failed. This is what led to the African Union's attempts to step up and do for it's own continent with American assistance from the sea with targets of opportunity against radicals and extremists as a part of the "War on Terror."

The problem we keep running into is that we have to trust the locals on the ground not to use us to fight a tribal war instead of the war they should be fighting. It's the same all over. Britian used us against Iran. All of Europe used us against the Soviets. Islamic radicals and extremists used us against the Soviets just to turn later against us. The Shia used us against the Sunni in Iraq to settle scores by feeding us intel on "insurgents" who may or may not have been insurgents.

We get in trouble because we think we can handle every problem and that every problem has an American solution. But in the end, we can only trust ourselves and have to stop taking responsibility for everything under the sun. Do you know why Americans have always felt that it is our job to settle disputes or help the weak? Because larger disputes suck us in and we have "chosen" to help the needy. We aren't obligated to do anything for anybody. Somewhere down the road we forgot this.
 
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Yes alot of countries use US to do their dirty work. Iran should be having a ball right now, Shia is now the the power holder within Iraq leading to closer ties and making them more cocky when before what kept them in line was Saddam. Yep, Iran would be happy.

You seem to forget, US also used Muslims and mobilised them against the soviets and has its fair share of 'using' too.

Meh, HOA is worrying to me due to the Islamists aim. They don't care about Ethiopia anymore, they know its withdrawing but they still want to fight to impliment Shariah law into Somalia :S
 
Laila said:
Yes alot of countries use US to do their dirty work. Iran should be having a ball right now, Shia is now the the power holder within Iraq leading to closer ties and making them more cocky when before what kept them in line was Saddam. Yep, Iran would be happy.
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Oh, you should know better than this. The Shia in Iraq know that Iran's government is failed. Repressive, religiously owned, and anti-West. Hardly the path Iraq is going to take. If anything Iraq will have more of an impact on Iran that Iran has on Iraq. Think tanks even in Europe are talking about a future uprising within Iran due to the more oppressive state and economic troubles on the horizen. I see nothing wrong with an Iran owned by the people who happen to like western culture. After all, our troubles may have started in Iran in 1979 against Islamic extremists, but our consistent troubles have been Arab. In other words and as an example....the minority in Iraq.


Laila said:
You seem to forget, US also used Muslims and mobilised them against the soviets and has its fair share of 'using' too.
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Oh? Was not the Afghanis already determined to expel the Soviets? We merely came along after the fact and gave them focus. This isn't exactly the same thing as what I was talking about. We used each other mutually for a common goal.

But either way, we don't sit back and seek a foriegn devil to blame for our problems. We don't point the finger at Britian over Iran in order to absolve our own decisions. We seem to be the only nation that takes responsibility for its actions and inactions. Clinton even aplogized for doing nothing about the genocide in Rwanda. Everyone else either refuses their roles of responsibility or seeks others to blame.

America has to stop behaving as if we are the world's Red Cross.
 
GySgt said:
But either way, we don't sit back and seek a foriegn devil to blame for our problems.
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No we just pointed the finger at communism and locked away anyone that even "appeared" to be supportive of communism.

Sorry, most of the time I actually agree with what you say, but we are not infallible and we have blamed foreign "devils" for our problems.
 
TheNextEra said:
No we just pointed the finger at communism and locked away anyone that even "appeared" to be supportive of communism.
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And how is that blaming them for our own problems?

TheNextEra said:
Sorry, most of the time I actually agree with what you say, but we are not infallible and we have blamed foreign "devils" for our problems.
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....who? Who gets the blame for our own problems? Who do we blame when it comes to our economy? Who is to blame for global warming? Who is to blame for our auto industry? Who is to blame for our involvement in Vietnam? The list goes on. Who do we blame? Who is the enemy of God? Who is our foriegn devil for all things that go wrong?
 
GySgt said:
And how is that blaming them for our own problems?



....who? Who gets the blame for our own problems? Who do we blame when it comes to our economy? Who is to blame for global warming? Who is to blame for our auto industry? Who is to blame for our involvement in Vietnam? The list goes on. Who do we blame? Who is the enemy of God? Who is our foriegn devil for all things that go wrong?
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